Chicago Strict Gun Laws: 500 Homicide 2012

Liberals love this shit!!
Everytime one of their beloved criminals kills an innocent they fall into a state of joy!!

Lets disarm all the honest folk they screech.

Their beloved criminals prefer unarmed victims!!

The liberals fly into an ecstatic euphoria everytime a criminal kills!!
 
SJJRSJJS said:
It looks like strict gun laws do not work: "A man gunned down Thursday on Chicago's west side marked what police say is the city's 500th homicide of the year. It's a dubious distinction that hasn't occurred since 2008, when the city ended the year with 512 murders."
http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/201...e-chicago-records-500th-homicide-of-2012?lite
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You know what's sad? I've been hearing this frequently (What is it? A new thread once a week?) and have waited patiently for someone other than me to point out one annoying little fact that makes this argument moot.

The Chicago hand gun ban was overturned by the SCOTUS in 2010.



In another dramatic victory for firearm owners, the Supreme Court has ruled unconstitutional Chicago, Illinois' 28-year-old strict ban on handgun ownership, a potentially far-reaching case over the ability of state and local governments to enforce limits on weapons.

A 5-4 conservative majority of justices on Monday reiterated its two-year-old conclusion the Constitution gives individuals equal or greater power than states on the issue of possession of certain firearms for self-protection.

"It cannot be doubted that the right to bear arms was regarded as a substantive guarantee, not a prohibition that could be ignored so long as states legislated in an evenhanded manner," wrote Justice Samuel Alito.

The court grounded that right in the due process section of the 14th Amendment. The justices, however, said local jurisdictions still retain the flexibility to preserve some "reasonable" gun-control measures currently in place nationwide.

In dissent, Justice Stephen Breyer predicated far-reaching implications. "Incorporating the right," he wrote, "may change the law in many of the 50 states. Read in the majority's favor, the historical evidence" for the decision "is at most ambiguous."
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So there you have it. The reason for all these increased murders in Chicago. Thanks, NRA!

For anyone looking for a reason as to why Chicagoans are shooting each other more often, how about this one: it’s now legal to own a handgun here.

The Supreme Court issued its McDonald v. Chicago decision, which held that local governments do not have the right to write their own gun control laws, in 2010. The decision overturned the city’s handgun ban, and the police department began issuing permits later that year.

Since the beginning of this year, 120 people have been murdered in Chicago. That’s a 60 percent increase over 2010 and 2011. It’s affecting every neighborhood. During one weekend in January, there were three murders within a mile of my apartment in Rogers Park: one young man’s body was found in a park. His killer committed suicide a few hours later. Two others were shot to death as they drove down Sheridan Road. Their SUV crashed into a pole and knocked it down.

Two weekends ago, on Morse Avenue, several gunmen jumped out of an SUV and sprayed a van with bullets. They didn’t hit anyone, but the van crashed into several cars as the driver frantically tried to escape death. The attack was reportedly part of a gang turf war. In response, the alderman and the police commissioner held a “positive loitering” patrol last Saturday night. I’ve lived around Howard Street for 15 years, but last weekend was the first time I’ve been reluctant to walk it after dark.

I am relating this for the benefit of Second Amendment Absolutists in places like Effingham and Sandoval, because I live in the real world of uncontrolled guns. They don’t. These rural Constitutional scholars believe in the principle that anyone should be allowed to own any gun, without any restrictions. It’s easy for them to say, because they don’t suffer the consequences of their fanatical ideology.

Neither does the Supreme Court, which interprets the Constitution without considering the real-world consequences of its decisions. The gun lobby’s solution to the misuse of guns -- laws prohibiting criminals from owning firearms -- does not work. First of all, it only takes effect after someone commits a crime with a gun. Second of all, most “illegal guns” are guns that were legally issued, then stolen.
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Allow me, please to highlight one other important statement in this opinion piece:

most “illegal guns” are guns that were legally issued, then stolen
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Another fact overlooked by the gun lobby, isn't it?

More proof that if we take guns out of the hands of "responsible gun owners", we'll also take them out of the hands of criminals.
 
Correction: "Most" guns used illegally are not stolen, only the shocking number of 25% of them, still way too high, isn't it, "responsible gun owners"?

Where do the majority of the remainder come from?

Crooked gun dealers! More proof we need strict, very strict laws and jail time for gun dealers breaking the law through strawman purchases and sales and through gun shows. Let's stop by ending all gun shows until these laws are enacted.
Wachtel says one of the most common ways criminals get guns is through straw purchase sales. A straw purchase occurs when someone who may not legally acquire a firearm, or who wants to do so anonymously, has a companion buy it on their behalf. According to a 1994 ATF study on "Sources of Crime Guns in Southern California," many straw purchases are conducted in an openly "suggestive" manner where two people walk into a gun store, one selects a firearm, and then the other uses identification for the purchase and pays for the gun. Or, several underage people walk into a store and an adult with them makes the purchases. Both of these are illegal activities.

The next biggest source of illegal gun transactions where criminals get guns are sales made by legally licensed but corrupt at-home and commercial gun dealers. Several recent reports back up Wachtel's own studies about this, and make the case that illegal activity by those licensed to sell guns, known as Federal Firearms Licensees (FFLs), is a huge source of crime guns and greatly surpasses the sale of guns stolen from John Q. Citizen. Like bank robbers, who are interested in banks, gun traffickers are interested in FFLs because that's where the guns are. This is why FFLs are a large source of illegal guns for traffickers, who ultimately wind up selling the guns on the street.

According to a recent ATF report, there is a significant diversion to the illegal gun market from FFLs. The report states that "of the 120,370 crime guns that were traced to purchases from the FFLs then in business, 27.7 % of these firearms were seized by law enforcement in connection with a crime within two years of the original sale. This rapid `time to crime' of a gun purchased from an FFL is a strong indicator that the initial seller or purchaser may have been engaged in unlawful activity."

The report goes on to state that "over-the-counter purchases are not the only means by which guns reach the illegal market from FFLs" and reveals that 23,775 guns have been reported lost, missing or stolen from FFLs since September 13, 1994, when a new law took effect requiring dealers to report gun thefts within 48 hours. This makes the theft of 6,000 guns reported in the CIR/Frontline show "Hot Guns" only 25% of all cases reported to ATF in the past two and one-half years.

Another large source of guns used in crimes are unlicensed street dealers who either get their guns through illegal transactions with licensed dealers, straw purchases, or from gun thefts. These illegal dealers turn around and sell these illegally on the street. An additional way criminals gain access to guns is family and friends, either through sales, theft or as gifts.
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It's obvious. "Responsible gun owners" are responsible for the murders of tens of thousands of innocent people each year.
 
the licensing scheme chicago has implemented prevents most everyone from obtaining a handgun still. so you're still full of shit, howey. your anti gun propaganda is not fooling anyone with intelligence and reason.
 
Howey said:
Prove it.
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look it up yourself, or be ignorant and swallow the anti gun propaganda.

chicago requires a training certificate to be issued a handgun purchase permit, however, chicago has a zoning law that does not allow any gun ranges within city limits. therefore, chicago makes it impossible to LEGALLY purchase a handgun unless one can get out of the city.
 
SmarterthanYou said:
look it up yourself, or be ignorant and swallow the anti gun propaganda.

chicago requires a training certificate to be issued a handgun purchase permit, however, chicago has a zoning law that does not allow any gun ranges within city limits. therefore, chicago makes it impossible to LEGALLY purchase a handgun unless one can get out of the city.
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So the gun nuts can't get in the wagon and drive a few miles to get their training? Or are you saying the training's not needed?
 
Howey said:
So the gun nuts can't get in the wagon and drive a few miles to get their training? Or are you saying the training's not needed?
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spoken like a true liberal idiot. let me know when you want to be serious about a gun conversation instead of all whiny assed cowardly.
 
KY requires a hunter safety training course completion before you can be issued a hunting liscence.
I don't think they give those on every street corner...
And KY is very RED and pro gun.
 
SmarterthanYou said:
and I thought you had some brains. do you realize how big chicago is?
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Yep been there a few times and people are accostomed to travelling from the outlying towns to Chi Town and visa versa to work and such.
So no need to whine about every neighborhood not having a shooting range.
 
While the OP was not really smart and wrong conclusions were drawn (otherwise the original poster could have answered uscitizen's post about NYC) I would like to point out a couple of things that jump off the screen at me while I read this thread.

Originally posted by Howie
More proof that if we take guns out of the hands of "responsible gun owners", we'll also take them out of the hands of criminals.

It's obvious. "Responsible gun owners" are responsible for the murders of tens of thousands of innocent people each year.
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You can see why (or at least I can) people always allude to a "slippery slope" as they see the attitudes of someone like Howie (even though he is not representative of all who would limit gun ownership some how) as it pertains to guns. You can see why there is never going to be any willing "give" with most gun owners, especially if folks like Howie get to dictate the narrative on the left.
 
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