The Constitution won’t save America- It has lost touch with the nation's twisted soul

Scott

Verified User
Just finished reading this article published on UnHerd today by N.S. Lyons, thought it was quite good. I'll say that I'm not Christian myself, but the author also mentions "some broader but less easily defined moral character", which I like. Quoting from its introduction and conclusion...

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Last month, the US Supreme Court considered arguments in a landmark case on the legality of America’s metastasising censorship-industrial complex. The case, Murthy vs Missouri, rests on whether White House requests that Twitter and Facebook take down alleged Covid misinformation constituted illegal censorship that violated the First Amendment right to free speech.

Given the ample evidence of the Biden administration’s sweeping censorship efforts in recent years, many legal observers assumed the case was a done deal. And yet, during the hearing, it quickly became apparent that a majority of the court’s justices were sympathetic to a counter-argument that, actually, it’s the Government who’s the real victim in this case — because what “free speech” really means is that the Government has a right to tell Facebook that you need to shut up.


[snip]

John Adams once warned that “our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people”, and that, should that national moral character disappear, the resulting political passions “would break the strongest cords of our Constitution as a whale goes through a net”. Adams was of course referring primarily to Christianity and its system of moral order, and Maistre would have very much agreed. In his view, the origin of a strong, stable and legitimate constitution could rest only in God and what we might call the popular fear of God: a sincere (even if subconscious) belief that to transgress the constitution (written or unwritten) was in a way to transgress divine law, an act liable to be punished accordingly. Ultimate authority then effectively rested above any man or document. Without this source of higher authority, the constitution would crumble and only the whims of petty tyrants would remain.

It sure seems that this is what we’re witnessing today. Whether or not we attribute the key role to Christian belief or to some broader but less easily defined national moral character, it seems clear to me that the Constitution is no longer alive with any such frightful sacred authority; it has been thoroughly profaned, and therefore opened to abuse. Nor is there today even a shared national understanding of its meaning and unwritten spirit. Whereas once few people would have dared try to blatantly twist its words to mean something that all would know implicitly they could not mean, our rulers no longer hesitate to do so — and often succeed. They succeed because that implicit constitution has been replaced.

I know that for Americans, who put so much faith in our Constitutional tradition, this is probably a particularly difficult and demoralising reality to accept. But accept it we must. Otherwise, we won’t be able to grasp the nature and extent of the challenge facing us. No amount of legalistic quibbling about the details and original meaning of the Constitution will rescue us from our present situation; nor could the nation’s highest court, even if it weren’t full of quislings. Even if the Supreme Court were to strongly reaffirm the principle of free speech, it would provide at most only a temporary reprieve — a ruling which the regime and its institutions would in all likelihood simply proceed to ignore, knowing they could get away with it.

No court has the power to define America’s true, unwritten constitution. If we want to change that constitution, and so restore any substance to the Constitution, then what will be called for is nothing less than a sustained and determined national cultural, intellectual, religious, and political counter-revolution sufficient to re-mould the very animating spirit of the state. It would, in other words, require an effort just as sweeping as the long revolution which dismantled and subordinated our original constitution in the first place.

**

Full article:
The Constitution won’t save America- It has lost touch with the nation's twisted soul | UnHerd
 
I don't see this type of censorship as a bad thing.

Children younger than 14 who live in Florida are now prohibited from joining social media platforms, while those who are 14 or 15 will need a parent's consent to sign up. The restrictions come after Governor Ron DeSantis signed a bill into law last month, which will fine companies up to $50,000 per violation.
 
I don't see this type of censorship as a bad thing.

Children younger than 14 who live in Florida are now prohibited from joining social media platforms, while those who are 14 or 15 will need a parent's consent to sign up. The restrictions come after Governor Ron DeSantis signed a bill into law last month, which will fine companies up to $50,000 per violation.

I admit I don't know when minors should be permitted to be on social media platforms. I recently saw a video talking about how it's bad for the very young to be on them (preschool), but as to when exactly they -should- be allowed, the jury's still out in my mind.

As to N.S. Lyons' article, they don't mention age restrictions on social media platforms at all. Instead, the focus is on whether the government should have the authority to cajole and even downright bully social media platforms into censorship speech it doesn't like. The Supreme Court apparently thinks this is the way to go, N.S. and I don't.
 
It was... murder? Care to elaborate on what you mean?

This communist revolution which has taken control of America pretended that that the Constitution is still in effect even as they ignored it....running America from their committees from the shadows. It wont be long now till they admit that the Constitution is over.
 
It was... murder? Care to elaborate on what you mean?

This communist revolution which has taken control of America pretended that that the Constitution is still in effect even as they ignored it....running America from their committees from the shadows. It wont be long now till they admit that the Constitution is over.

Ah alright. I don't know about any communist revolution taking place in America, but perhaps we can agree in a Globalist one?
 
Ah alright. I don't know about any communist revolution taking place in America, but perhaps we can agree in a Globalist one?

Its America....which has Europe as our puppy dogs....almost the entire rest of the world hates us now.
 
Just finished reading this article published on UnHerd today by N.S. Lyons, thought it was quite good. I'll say that I'm not Christian myself, but the author also mentions "some broader but less easily defined moral character", which I like. Quoting from its introduction and conclusion...

**
Last month, the US Supreme Court considered arguments in a landmark case on the legality of America’s metastasising censorship-industrial complex. The case, Murthy vs Missouri, rests on whether White House requests that Twitter and Facebook take down alleged Covid misinformation constituted illegal censorship that violated the First Amendment right to free speech.

Given the ample evidence of the Biden administration’s sweeping censorship efforts in recent years, many legal observers assumed the case was a done deal. And yet, during the hearing, it quickly became apparent that a majority of the court’s justices were sympathetic to a counter-argument that, actually, it’s the Government who’s the real victim in this case — because what “free speech” really means is that the Government has a right to tell Facebook that you need to shut up.


[snip]

John Adams once warned that “our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people”, and that, should that national moral character disappear, the resulting political passions “would break the strongest cords of our Constitution as a whale goes through a net”. Adams was of course referring primarily to Christianity and its system of moral order, and Maistre would have very much agreed. In his view, the origin of a strong, stable and legitimate constitution could rest only in God and what we might call the popular fear of God: a sincere (even if subconscious) belief that to transgress the constitution (written or unwritten) was in a way to transgress divine law, an act liable to be punished accordingly. Ultimate authority then effectively rested above any man or document. Without this source of higher authority, the constitution would crumble and only the whims of petty tyrants would remain.

It sure seems that this is what we’re witnessing today. Whether or not we attribute the key role to Christian belief or to some broader but less easily defined national moral character, it seems clear to me that the Constitution is no longer alive with any such frightful sacred authority; it has been thoroughly profaned, and therefore opened to abuse. Nor is there today even a shared national understanding of its meaning and unwritten spirit. Whereas once few people would have dared try to blatantly twist its words to mean something that all would know implicitly they could not mean, our rulers no longer hesitate to do so — and often succeed. They succeed because that implicit constitution has been replaced.

I know that for Americans, who put so much faith in our Constitutional tradition, this is probably a particularly difficult and demoralising reality to accept. But accept it we must. Otherwise, we won’t be able to grasp the nature and extent of the challenge facing us. No amount of legalistic quibbling about the details and original meaning of the Constitution will rescue us from our present situation; nor could the nation’s highest court, even if it weren’t full of quislings. Even if the Supreme Court were to strongly reaffirm the principle of free speech, it would provide at most only a temporary reprieve — a ruling which the regime and its institutions would in all likelihood simply proceed to ignore, knowing they could get away with it.

No court has the power to define America’s true, unwritten constitution. If we want to change that constitution, and so restore any substance to the Constitution, then what will be called for is nothing less than a sustained and determined national cultural, intellectual, religious, and political counter-revolution sufficient to re-mould the very animating spirit of the state. It would, in other words, require an effort just as sweeping as the long revolution which dismantled and subordinated our original constitution in the first place.

**

Full article:
The Constitution won’t save America- It has lost touch with the nation's twisted soul | UnHerd

no.

the government telling companies what to do is still covered by the constitution.

it's defacto censorship from the government, by proxy.

the corporations are guilty of conspiracy to censor.
 
Censorship of the internet would be unnecessary
if people would only realize that it's a forum not restricted to qualified participants
and regarded it accordingly.

The whole purpose of the internet, it would seem, is highly ill-advised populism.
Discriminating people understand what it is, but in a democracy,
the opinion of idiots carries unfortunate weight.

As for our cherished Constitution,
it was a probably well-intentioned but very poorly executed document.
It represents the kind of harm done by people who are unaware of their limitations.

Anytime something serious is written, the writer's first responsibility
is to anticipate the possible mistakes of those trying to comprehend it.
 
I admit I don't know when minors should be permitted to be on social media platforms. I recently saw a video talking about how it's bad for the very young to be on them (preschool), but as to when exactly they -should- be allowed, the jury's still out in my mind.

As to N.S. Lyons' article, they don't mention age restrictions on social media platforms at all. Instead, the focus is on whether the government should have the authority to cajole and even downright bully social media platforms into censorship speech it doesn't like. The Supreme Court apparently thinks this is the way to go, N.S. and I don't.
I lived in the ghetto during the crack epidemic. Kids that went to school were able to eat lunch that day. Some schools even started a breakfast program. Parents couldn't be depended on to feed their own kids. It opened my eyes to liberal thinking on government involvement. Not every situation should be left up to the parent.
 
no.

the government telling companies what to do is still covered by the constitution.

it's defacto censorship from the government, by proxy.

Agreed. I think N.S. Lyons would agree with you as well. The problem is that without a populace that's willing to fight to preserve U.S. freedoms, the constitution can be "interpreted" to mean whatever the Supreme Court likes.

the corporations are guilty of conspiracy to censor.

From what I've read, corporations can censor what's on their platforms. What the constitution was apparently meant to prevent was the U.S. government bullying them into doing it. But apparently the current Supreme Court justices think it's ok, and since they're the top dogs when in comes to interpreting the Constitution, Americans have a serious problem.
 
Agreed. I think N.S. Lyons would agree with you as well. The problem is that without a populace that's willing to fight to preserve U.S. freedoms, the constitution can be "interpreted" to mean whatever the Supreme Court likes.



From what I've read, corporations can censor what's on their platforms. What the constitution was apparently meant to prevent was the U.S. government bullying them into doing it. But apparently the current Supreme Court justices think it's ok, and since they're the top dogs when in comes to interpreting the Constitution, Americans have a serious problem.

there's no problem.

libertarians and corporate cocksucks need to just stfu with their subversive anti-constitution idiot talk.

they should lose all protecions from section 230 then if they're going to a take an editorial role.
 
Censorship of the internet would be unnecessary
if people would only realize that it's a forum not restricted to qualified participants
and regarded it accordingly.

Ideally, I think it should only be restricted to those who actively advocate harming people for no good reason (as opposed to stopping the Nazis in World War II, say). Unfortunately, even when it comes to this, it appears that governments and corporations are taking sides- for instance, it's ok to advocate harm to Russians or Palestinians because they're not following the Globalists' agendas, for instance.

The whole purpose of the internet, it would seem, is highly ill-advised populism.
Discriminating people understand what it is, but in a democracy,
the opinion of idiots carries unfortunate weight.

I have no problem with -some- restrictions. I particularly like the ability of thread creators in this forum to thread ban people who they don't want to listen to in their own threads. But when it comes to information generally, I'm off the view that the best way to counter faulty arguments is with good ones, not by banning people from presenting said faulty arguments. Things get even worse when only a select few in power get to decide what arguments are allowed and what aren't.

As for our cherished Constitution,
it was a probably well-intentioned but very poorly executed document.
It represents the kind of harm done by people who are unaware of their limitations.

Could you give an example of what you mean here?

Anytime something serious is written, the writer's first responsibility
is to anticipate the possible mistakes of those trying to comprehend it.

Sure. But seeing as how the writers of the constitution have all passed, they won't be making any more revisions. It's up to the current generation of Americans to correct any flaws it has.
 
Agreed. I think N.S. Lyons would agree with you as well. The problem is that without a populace that's willing to fight to preserve U.S. freedoms, the constitution can be "interpreted" to mean whatever the Supreme Court likes.

From what I've read, corporations can censor what's on their platforms. What the constitution was apparently meant to prevent was the U.S. government bullying them into doing it. But apparently the current Supreme Court justices think it's ok, and since they're the top dogs when in comes to interpreting the Constitution, Americans have a serious problem.

there's no problem.

libertarians and corporate cocksucks need to just stfu with their subversive anti-constitution idiot talk.

they should lose all protecions from section 230 then if they're going to a take an editorial role.

I think the most pressing concern here is the U.S. government bullying corporations from taking down information it doesn't want up. As to the problem, I think it's pretty plain- if the U.S. Supreme Court is going to interpret the Constitution as saying it's ok for the U.S. government to bully corporations into taking down content said government doesn't want up, what good is the constitution? In the end, it's just pieces of paper. There's a line from one of Frank Herbert's books that I think is quite apt here:

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Law always chooses sides on the basis of enforcement power. Morality and legal niceties have little to do with it when the real question is: Who has the clout?
**
 
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