two politicians that i like

[Don Quixote]

i was watching the news out of huston and up came a story where the councilman for galveston went around house to house knocking on doors to find out why people had not evacuated

in some homes the people had a language problem and did not understand, in other homes he found people that did not have reliable transportation or the money to leave

he called the mayor and got some metro buses to come get the people and transport them to shelters - it was a joint effort between the councilman and the mayor - two politicians that cared and acted

 

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

i was watching the news out of huston and up came a story where the councilman for galveston went around house to house knocking on doors to find out why people had not evacuated

in some homes the people had a language problem and did not understand, in other homes he found people that did not have reliable transportation or the money to leave

he called the mayor and got some metro buses to come get the people and transport them to shelters - it was a joint effort between the councilman and the mayor - two politicians that cared and acted

This is how disaster is supposed to be handled at the local level. It is one of the things that really bugged me about Katrina, there was this politicized rush to blame the entire travesty on Bush, and he is not the 'two politicians' who can go door to door, and get the people to safety. I realize the Federal government disaster relief was plagued with dysfunction, but why did no one ever hold local officials accountable? In my view, Katrina was such a catastrophe, because the local officials failed in their duties, and once that happens, the whole system fails. Changes have now been made in these disasters, FEMA and the Feds now have authority to override a Governor and be proactive in protecting citizens before the disaster.

In order for things to go smoothly during a disaster, every level of government has to do their part. Every individual has responsibility as well. Katrina is an example where everyone on the local level, sat on their ass and let it happen, and then pointed the finger at Bush, as if he is supposed to be Superman, and come down there to save everyone before the disaster! Maybe if there had been a few more people who cared, like these two politicians, on the local level, it wouldn't have been the disaster it was?

 

[Don Quixote]

This is how disaster is supposed to be handled at the local level. It is one of the things that really bugged me about Katrina, there was this politicized rush to blame the entire travesty on Bush, and he is not the 'two politicians' who can go door to door, and get the people to safety. I realize the Federal government disaster relief was plagued with dysfunction, but why did no one ever hold local officials accountable? In my view, Katrina was such a catastrophe, because the local officials failed in their duties, and once that happens, the whole system fails. Changes have now been made in these disasters, FEMA and the Feds now have authority to override a Governor and be proactive in protecting citizens before the disaster.

In order for things to go smoothly during a disaster, every level of government has to do their part. Every individual has responsibility as well. Katrina is an example where everyone on the local level, sat on their ass and let it happen, and then pointed the finger at Bush, as if he is supposed to be Superman, and come down there to save everyone before the disaster! Maybe if there had been a few more people who cared, like these two politicians, on the local level, it wouldn't have been the disaster it was?

would that more politicians, on every level, acted so

the biggest blame that bush deserved is that fema did not do its job because the bush appointed head did not know his ass from a hole in the ground about disaster response

having said that, the local and state officials did not do their jobs either

let us hope that the entire nation learned from that disaster

 

[theMAJORITY]

Man--it must be dangerous at times to live in a country and not know the language spoken there. I say--let nature take it's course. There is a strong corrolation between not speaking the engilish language here in the states, and being illegal, and not suppose to be here.

Launguage, borders, culture define every nation. I could not understand how I would be able to live in another country, and not know their language---unless they offer free stuff to me that their normal citizens have to pay for. That would be cool right?

Yea--no other country protects their borders like we do. What you liberials don't understand is----it is for the man baby--yes the top dog capatolists full of corruption who want slave labor all over the world. That is why the illegals are here. Let the storm do it's job.

 

[Mott the Hoople]

This is how disaster is supposed to be handled at the local level. It is one of the things that really bugged me about Katrina, there was this politicized rush to blame the entire travesty on Bush, and he is not the 'two politicians' who can go door to door, and get the people to safety. I realize the Federal government disaster relief was plagued with dysfunction, but why did no one ever hold local officials accountable? In my view, Katrina was such a catastrophe, because the local officials failed in their duties, and once that happens, the whole system fails. Changes have now been made in these disasters, FEMA and the Feds now have authority to override a Governor and be proactive in protecting citizens before the disaster.

In order for things to go smoothly during a disaster, every level of government has to do their part. Every individual has responsibility as well. Katrina is an example where everyone on the local level, sat on their ass and let it happen, and then pointed the finger at Bush, as if he is supposed to be Superman, and come down there to save everyone before the disaster! Maybe if there had been a few more people who cared, like these two politicians, on the local level, it wouldn't have been the disaster it was?

Jesus H Christ. You wingnuts and your kool-aid drinking. Tell a lie often enough and you niave partisan nit-wits will believe anything.

Get this clear. The Katrina disaster REQUIRED a federal response and the present administration fucked it up royally by putting a bunch of incompetent political cronies in charge of FEMA. Just one more example of the Bush administrations utter incompetence.

 

[Mott the Hoople]

would that more politicians, on every level, acted so

the biggest blame that bush deserved is that fema did not do its job because the bush appointed head did not know his ass from a hole in the ground about disaster response

having said that, the local and state officials did not do their jobs either

let us hope that the entire nation learned from that disaster

I doubt it. The wingnuts were to busy fixing the blame to have the least little clue on how to actually fix the problem.

 

[Mott the Hoople]

Man--it must be dangerous at times to live in a country and not know the language spoken there. I say--let nature take it's course. There is a strong corrolation between not speaking the engilish language here in the states, and being illegal, and not suppose to be here.

Launguage, borders, culture define every nation. I could not understand how I would be able to live in another country, and not know their language---unless they offer free stuff to me that their normal citizens have to pay for. That would be cool right?

Yea--no other country protects their borders like we do. What you liberials don't understand is----it is for the man baby--yes the top dog capatolists full of corruption who want slave labor all over the world. That is why the illegals are here. Let the storm do it's job.

Bull shit. Quite making excuses for your second rate education. Hell you can't even speak or write one language correctly and those who can grasp more than one language scare the shit out of your ignorant redneck ass don't they?

You're just a chicken shit red neck coward who's to scared to put forth the effort to learn something that you don't understand.

That's really the first mark of a yellow bellied coward. Fear of that which they don't understand.

A real man tries to learn about things they don't understand. They don't whine and cry about it.

What a pussy.

 

[Cancel3]

Dysfunctional government and bloated bureacracy is not based on one political party. It is both republicans and democrats who have created this mess.

On the one hand you have people screaming that the government didn't move fast enough. My company had people on the ground before the rains had stopped. And the government had people in there with them. I can also tell you numerous stories of residents being very hostile towards both.

On the other hand there are people screaming about the wasted tax dollars. When you mobilize fast you are not going to do it cheaply. Its just the way things are. You can plan as much as you want, but natural disastors are about chaos.



Blaming one party or the other is just political bullshit at the expense of people's lives.

 

[Cancel3]

As far as the language goes, thats not an issue that means people should die.

There are plenty of LEGAL immigrants who have not mastered english yet. Most of them are not particularly literate in their native tongue.

Maj, when I look at your language skills I can see that you would have a great deal of difficulty learning a second language. That is not an insult to you, just an observation about your technical grasp of english. Many of those coming in legally have had less education than you have. You expect them to learn english in a matter of a year or so without any formal classes?

Also, even those who can speak english reasonably well are speaking it as a second language. That means when they are scared they have much more difficulty with it.

A good corrolation would be if I taught you calculus. You could learn it and be able to do the calculations in the classroom. But let there be 80 mph winds and flooding (or even the threat of it), and I bet your ability to repeat what you have learned would go down the tubes.

 

[evince]

Man--it must be dangerous at times to live in a country and not know the language spoken there. I say--let nature take it's course. There is a strong corrolation between not speaking the engilish language here in the states, and being illegal, and not suppose to be here.

Launguage, borders, culture define every nation. I could not understand how I would be able to live in another country, and not know their language---unless they offer free stuff to me that their normal citizens have to pay for. That would be cool right?

Yea--no other country protects their borders like we do. What you liberials don't understand is----it is for the man baby--yes the top dog capatolists full of corruption who want slave labor all over the world. That is why the illegals are here. Let the storm do it's job.

You just cant be real no one can be this stupid and callous.

These top dog capitalists you speak of are running this country right now.

Let the babies of people who speak any language other than english Die in the storm wether they are American citizens or not?

This guy has got to be someone pulling our leg.

 

[Cancel3]

You just cant be real no one can be this stupid and callous.

These top dog capitalists you speak of are running this country right now.

Let the babies of people who speak any language other than english Die in the storm wether they are American citizens or not?

This guy has got to be someone pulling our leg.

I would hope so. But unfortunately I know people with these views.

I think its more because he cannot face the possibility that his All American views may not be perfect.

But its probably also that the deaths are just number and news stories for him. He does not really connect them with life.

 

[Mott the Hoople]

Dysfunctional government and bloated bureacracy is not based on one political party. It is both republicans and democrats who have created this mess.

On the one hand you have people screaming that the government didn't move fast enough. My company had people on the ground before the rains had stopped. And the government had people in there with them. I can also tell you numerous stories of residents being very hostile towards both.

On the other hand there are people screaming about the wasted tax dollars. When you mobilize fast you are not going to do it cheaply. Its just the way things are. You can plan as much as you want, but natural disastors are about chaos.



Blaming one party or the other is just political bullshit at the expense of people's lives.

As I said, there more concerned about fixing the blame then they are about fixing the problem. Had the Democrats been in control during Katrina they would have deserved the criticism and to be held accountable. They were not. The Republican were and deserved every bit of the criticisms heaped upon them.

 

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

As I said, there more concerned about fixing the blame then they are about fixing the problem. Had the Democrats been in control during Katrina they would have deserved the criticism and to be held accountable. They were not. The Republican were and deserved every bit of the criticisms heaped upon them.

No they didn't. The people who deserved criticism, and never got it, were the local officials and 'first responders' who bailed. The week of the hurricane, when people should have been evacuating, should have been making emergency plans, should have been getting the hell out of town, they were flogging into bars getting drunk, and scoffing at the suggestion it was going to be bad!

Unlike the Mayor and Councilman of Galveston, which Don posted this thread about, there were no 'politicians who cared' on the local level. There were also no politicians who cared on the state level. The Governor of the state is supposed to "request" federal disaster assistance, it's not the federal government's job, or even within it's Constitutional authority, to intervene in a state disaster, until the Governor requests assistance. The LA Governor never did! In spite of the fact that it was a violation of the Constitutional powers of the Federal government, Bush declared LA a national disaster BEFORE the hurricane hit land, which was unprecedented at the time. (That means it had never happened before in the history of the US!)

Now you can blame Bush for having appointed an incompetent FEMA director, you can blame FEMA for not responding fast enough after the disaster, but the blame for the entire disaster can't be laid at the feet of Bush, he did exactly what he was supposed to do, and more. Furthermore, the bulk of responsibility lies with the state and local officials, who should have done more BEFORE the disaster, but didn't.

 

[Cancel3]

Just as an FYI, the first responders didn't bail. There were some who refused to enter areas where there was reported violence and where they would not be safe. But that is standard operating procedure for unarmed first responders.

 

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

Just as an FYI, the first responders didn't bail. There were some who refused to enter areas where there was reported violence and where they would not be safe. But that is standard operating procedure for unarmed first responders.

I saw the videos, POLICEMEN were participating in the looting! Some of them simply abandoned their posts, others left town and didn't even return after the hurricane. There was absolutely nothing 'standard' about the operating procedure. The Red Cross had 15 transfer truckloads of emergency supplies, sitting outside of New Orleans, less than 3 miles from the Superdome, while people died, they were not allowed to enter the city. FEMA sent hundreds of mobile homes to New Orleans, to provide temporary housing, where they literally sat on freight transports until the frames warped, because New Orleans had an ordinance prohibiting mobile housing. These are not things Bush should have been blamed for, but he was... the whole damn thing! Over and over again, even til this day, Democrats politicized this disaster and personally blamed it all on the president.

 

[Cancel3]

I saw the videos, POLICEMEN were participating in the looting! Some of them simply abandoned their posts, others left town and didn't even return after the hurricane. There was absolutely nothing 'standard' about the operating procedure. The Red Cross had 15 transfer truckloads of emergency supplies, sitting outside of New Orleans, less than 3 miles from the Superdome, while people died, they were not allowed to enter the city. FEMA sent hundreds of mobile homes to New Orleans, to provide temporary housing, where they literally sat on freight transports until the frames warped, because New Orleans had an ordinance prohibiting mobile housing. These are not things Bush should have been blamed for, but he was... the whole damn thing! Over and over again, even til this day, Democrats politicized this disaster and personally blamed it all on the president.

And how long had those policemen been on duty and standing out there on their own? It wasn't the first day. It wasn't the second day. It was almost a week before they got reenforcements. These guys were standing against angry mobs with nothing but what they had on them. And YOU have the audacity to call them cowards??

The FEMA people were not allowed to enter the city because people were SHOOTING at rescue workers. Are YOU willing to send FEMA workers into a firefight? Of course it was standard operating procedure. You think that the tiny isolated events that you saw on video are an indictment of the thousands of people who risked their lives to help?

You are as bad as those who scream that its all Bush's fault.

 

[Good Luck]

And how long had those policemen been on duty and standing out there on their own? It wasn't the first day. It wasn't the second day. It was almost a week before they got reenforcements. These guys were standing against angry mobs with nothing but what they had on them. And YOU have the audacity to call them cowards??

The FEMA people were not allowed to enter the city because people were SHOOTING at rescue workers. Are YOU willing to send FEMA workers into a firefight? Of course it was standard operating procedure. You think that the tiny isolated events that you saw on video are an indictment of the thousands of people who risked their lives to help?

You are as bad as those who scream that its all Bush's fault.

And what was Bush supposed to do about that? Declare marshal law and send in the army? (Imagine the democrats' reaction to that!)

Civil control is the jurisdiction of local government, even in disasters. It fell apart in New Orleans because local government did not do their jobs. There were thousands of people who should have been evacuated but were not because local governments did not do their jobs.

Yes, FEMA was a mess, and that was due to Bush putting the wrong guy in charge, AND due to the Bush administration changing FEMA infrastructure to supposedly reduce costs.

BUT the primary responsibility still lays with the city and state governments. FEMA may have dropped the federal ball, but Red Cross and other disaster relief agencies did not. But their efforts were delayed, and in some case thwarted by local ordinances. Had the local and state governments done their jobs the way they were supposed to, rescue and relief efforts would not have been delayed like they were. Had they coordinated evacuation efforts better (remember the parking lot full of flooded school buses?), rescue assets would not have been so overwhelmed.

Had the mayor requested help from other areas for peace officers and the like, they would have been able to maintain control better. Had the governor activated a couple NG units, (in advance) they would have had better control. Civil break down is NOT something that can be blamed on the federal government no matter WHO is in charge. That is, unless you want to give the federal government excuse to write a law allowing FEMA to declare federal marshal law in cases of disaster. It is bad enough they found the excuse allowing FEMA to override local government on disaster relief. Adding federal civil control is not something we should want - or need.

 

[Don Quixote]

And what was Bush supposed to do about that? Declare marshal law and send in the army? (Imagine the democrats' reaction to that!)

Civil control is the jurisdiction of local government, even in disasters. It fell apart in New Orleans because local government did not do their jobs. There were thousands of people who should have been evacuated but were not because local governments did not do their jobs.

Yes, FEMA was a mess, and that was due to Bush putting the wrong guy in charge, AND due to the Bush administration changing FEMA infrastructure to supposedly reduce costs.

BUT the primary responsibility still lays with the city and state governments. FEMA may have dropped the federal ball, but Red Cross and other disaster relief agencies did not. But their efforts were delayed, and in some case thwarted by local ordinances. Had the local and state governments done their jobs the way they were supposed to, rescue and relief efforts would not have been delayed like they were. Had they coordinated evacuation efforts better (remember the parking lot full of flooded school buses?), rescue assets would not have been so overwhelmed.

Had the mayor requested help from other areas for peace officers and the like, they would have been able to maintain control better. Had the governor activated a couple NG units, (in advance) they would have had better control. Civil break down is NOT something that can be blamed on the federal government no matter WHO is in charge. That is, unless you want to give the federal government excuse to write a law allowing FEMA to declare federal marshal law in cases of disaster. It is bad enough they found the excuse allowing FEMA to override local government on disaster relief. Adding federal civil control is not something we should want - or need.

one of the front line state entities for disaster control is the national guard - oops, they were in iraq...with their equipment

still, why were they not mobilized before the event...La is one of the more corrupt states though

the levies protecting the new orleans area barely held against a cat 2 storm and one the levies outside new orleans failed


the hurricane season is not over, so what next, what if a cat 3 storm hits the area