the AR-15 follies: Here we go again!

[Dutch Uncle]

As I stated, I support your right to own guns and to defend yourself brother, but unless you’re being attacked by an army, I don’t see how an AR helps, or is even needed.

I think it comes down to one’s philosophy about civic and national responsibility. Knowing the perpetual tragedy of mass shootings in America caused by weapons of mass murder, makes MY decision not to own one real easy, but that’s just me. Looking at reports of school children being slaughtered and blown into tiny pieces makes my opposition to these weapons a nobrainer. Knowing that guns in the home kills more children, spouses, and people known to the shooter than intruders, makes me hesitant to to celebrate having a gun in my home or gun ownership at all.

AND A CONFESSION, knowing that guns kill more people attempting suicide than any other means of choice is something to seriously consider, given that I stood on the verge of it when my son was murdered. Nearly 50.000 Americans commit suicide in the US almost every year. Damn near an epidemic, and save my wife throwing the bullets in a lake, and kind and thoughtful words from two posters on this board, one being a Republican, I could have been one of those statistics. For me, this conversation is personal.

None of my guns killed anyone. At least not in my possession. Why do you want to restrict me from having them?

It seems you are attacking the symptoms of the problem. Mass murderers aren't accidents. All of these tragic acts were committed by people who were mentally ill and known by family and friends to have mental issues. Banning guns won't help them or the other 2/3s of the "gun violence" in America that are suicides.

 

[blackascoal]

None of my guns killed anyone. At least not in my possession. Why do you want to restrict me from having them?

It seems you are attacking the symptoms of the problem. Mass murderers aren't accidents. All of these tragic acts were committed by people who were mentally ill and known by family and friends to have mental issues. Banning guns won't help them or the other 2/3s of the "gun violence" in America that are suicides.

From my perspective, this isn’t about you and it isn’t about me. This is about America and the suffering of American children and families who will have to endure the tragedy of the next mass shooting .. and undoubtedly, there will be a next. All mass shootings are not committed by people suffering from some mental illness, and there is no question that I can demonstrate that with very little digging. The claim of mental illness itself is dubious at best. It’s what the right reaches for whenever the shooter is white. No differently then what played out here until it was discovered that the shooter was Arab. Then his “mental illness’ card was revoked and replaced with Islamophobia.

I’ve never accused you of shooting anyone, but I doubt very seriously that not having an AR 15 leaves you unarmed and defenseless. If having to give up my handguns would alleviate the suffering of one single child, I would do so in a heartbeat, but again, that’s just me.

 

[Taichiliberal]

Quote Originally Posted by Taichiliberal View Post
Get off your mental fat ass and go read the first AWB 1994. It states in no uncertain terms that all weapons purchased prior to enactment of the law are exempt from the ban, and thereby kept legal by the owners. Capice? No sale of such weapons on the list were legal after enactment of the law, as with purchases.

Nothing has been brought up yet. You said "remove," now answer the question on how you would accomplish that. Now quit fucking running from your own statement.

Yeah, I know what the "old law" says. What new ones will be introduced by assholes like you?

Oh stop playing dumber than you are.....you know damned well what I'm talking about. If you don't, I'll spell it out for you: You remove these weapons from the general population via stopping retailers & gun shows from selling them....you do that by specifically banning them. By legal precedent, anyone owning this type of weapon prior to the enactment of law can legally keep them...BUT THEY CAN'T SELL THEM!

CAPICE', buffoon?

A new addition would be to create a true working national network for universal background checks (that would include notice of psychological cases/commitment ) and registry of all weapons sales (like you do cars), so geniuses like you won't unknowingly sell to criminals all the mentally defective, and you have a better track of cross state buyers for criminal use.

If this doesn't clear things up, then I can't help you.

 

[Taichiliberal]

Quote Originally Posted by Taichiliberal View Post
Too bad Republicans keep trying to ignore the fact that better gun control and removing assault weapons from the general population lessens gun related deaths. Gun Manufacturers need sales, politicians need money...a match made in hell for the American people.

Banning unhealthy foods would lessen obesity related deaths. Why don't we do that?

You have laws via the FDA that have taken various foodstuffs and drugs off the shelves throughout it's history. That's their job. There is constant legal wrangling to determine what is and what isn't a direct danger to the public via company vs. FDA lawyers, scientists, etc.. Do your homework and become aware of the world you live in.

 

[Taichiliberal]

Quote Originally Posted by Sirthinksalot View Post
Banning unhealthy foods would lessen obesity related deaths. Why don't we do that?

I'd rather die fat and fed than skinny and hungry...

Works for me!

 

[Dutch Uncle]

From my perspective, this isn’t about you and it isn’t about me. This is about America and the suffering of American children and families who will have to endure the tragedy of the next mass shooting .. and undoubtedly, there will be a next. All mass shootings are not committed by people suffering from some mental illness, and there is no question that I can demonstrate that with very little digging. The claim of mental illness itself is dubious at best. It’s what the right reaches for whenever the shooter is white. No differently then what played out here until it was discovered that the shooter was Arab. Then his “mental illness’ card was revoked and replaced with Islamophobia.

I’ve never accused you of shooting anyone, but I doubt very seriously that not having an AR 15 leaves you unarmed and defenseless. If having to give up my handguns would alleviate the suffering of one single child, I would do so in a heartbeat, but again, that’s just me.

Name a few which weren't.

Still, the encroachment of your rights as a city person is up to you when voting about your city. That has nothing to do with my situation or the situation of millions of rural Americans.

 

[Taichiliberal]

I'd rather take the miniscule risk of dying in a mass shooting than allow chickenshits like touchy liberal to disarm the American people "for our own good".

Spoken like a true chicken hawk right wing BS artist. Why don't you toddle over to the next memorial for the victims of Columbine or Parkland and bray your stupidity? Should be interesting results.

 

[Taichiliberal]

Originally Posted by Sirthinksalot View Post
Banning unhealthy foods would lessen obesity related deaths. Why don't we do that?

Not bad, now your getting the picture.
"Unhealthy foods" vs unhealthy guns................Military type assault weapons, that are of no use but killing humans at a rapid rate.
Do you want to ban ALL foods?
No, just the unhealthy ones.

Beautiful catch!

 

[Taichiliberal]

We do have very short memories now don't we, a Week before the shooting in Colorado we had a shooting in Georgia. In Colorado the shooter managed to kill 10 People in a busy Grocery store and in Georgia the shooter was able to kill 8 People in three different business. In Georgia the shooting had to go to several different place to do his shooting meaning his task was slightly more difficult. In Georgia the shooting used a Handgun and no one was saying ban all handguns instead they made the claim that is was racially motivated, which it was not. In Colorado the shooter used an AR and the motive is unknown other than he is completely nuts, but the calls to ban AR's began on day 1 and have not stopped.
So what can we conclude, well it is obvious the Handgun can do the job every bot as good as an AR when in confined spaces, that both cases, as with most mass shootings the shooter was mentally ill, that we ignore Handguns when used in these shootings but by God we have to ban AR's.
Want to know why that is, it is because the government will Never be able to ban Handguns, too many Liberals also own them, but it is easier to focus on those scary black guns and ban them to get a false sense of security, all so we can avoid the Elephant in the room Mental Illness.

Your last lengthy sentence is disingenuous at best. In 1994, the AWB included handguns https://www.feinstein.senate.gov/pu...pistol, Krinkov,LAR 15 pistol; Calico Liberty

 

[Taichiliberal]

Quote Originally Posted by Taichiliberal View Post
Too bad Republicans keep trying to ignore the fact that better gun control and removing assault weapons from the general population lessens gun related deaths. Gun Manufacturers need sales, politicians need money...a match made in hell for the American people.

I agree with the Republicans that stripping citizens of rights is not the best path for peace, prosperity and American ideals.

Why do you think Democrats prioritize gun bans over better mental health care despite the fact all of these mass shootings were done by nutjobs?

That first sentence is the most repeated disingenuous line promoted by the gun lobby and anti-gov't, anti (anything they perceive as) liberal types and right wing media punditry. I say this because on one hand you have all these civilian/armchair weapons experts swearing that the anti-gun folk put too much credit on the AR-15, as there are plenty more weapons better suited for hunting, mass shooting, etc.

But, when it's pointed out that the AR-15 is extremely popular, and the weapon of choice for the majority of mass shooters and anti-gov't protest yahoos (who can be spotted strapped with them at their protests and rallies sometimes), the response is "well, those deaths are statistically minuscule, so I'd take the risk rather than you take my gun".

That's f***ing sick in my book...pure sociopathic thinking. Or if you like, arrested development .... an adult telling a child they can't have that particular toy as it poses a danger to other children, point to a plethora of similar type toys, and the child throws a tantrum, NO, I WANT THAT ONE BECAUSE I WANT IT!

Your second sentence is also disingenuous, as the Dems have put forth various bills that would incorporate mental illness tags in a universal background check system...only to be shot down by the GOP and kept as a state by state mish mosh

 

[Taichiliberal]

Hello Taichiliberal,



"“ATLANTA —

A sharp-eyed Instacart worker is getting credit for averting what could have been another awful crime in Atlanta, where a man brought body armor, ammunition and at least five guns into a grocery store, police said.

...

I seen an AR-15,” Russell told the TV station. "[That] kind of startled me, with the events that recently happened in the grocery store up in Colorado. To be able to stop it [a shooting], if it were going to be something, that’s what I cared about.”
In this March 23, 2021, photo, a makeshift fence stands around the parking lot outside a King Soopers grocery store where a mass shooting took place in Boulder, Colo. The suspects in the most recent shooting sprees found it relatively easy to get their guns. The suspect in the shooting at a Boulder supermarket was convicted of assaulting a high school classmate but still got a gun. (AP Photo/David Zalubowski)

World & Nation

Colorado shooting suspect appears in court; lawyer cites ‘mental illness’

36 minutes ago

Atlanta police spokesman Anthony Grant said officers responded to the Atlanta Station Publix at 1:30 p.m. Wednesday and saw Marley leaving the bathroom. Grant said the officers quickly held Marley for questioning, and found two long guns and three pistols concealed on him. Police later said a sixth gun was in his possession as well.

Police have been working since then to determine what Marley planned to do with the arsenal. There were no reports of Marley pointing a weapon or using one before authorities arrived.

...

The incident happened days after eight people, including six women of Asian descent, were fatally shot at three massage businesses in the Atlanta area.

Rico Marley, 22, was scheduled for an initial court hearing Thursday on charges including weapons possession during an attempt to commit felonies. Investigators also said Marley was undergoing a psychiatric evaluation. It’s unclear whether he had an attorney. "

Witness alerted Atlanta store manager to heavily armed man, police say

***

Hey. Ya never know when a squabble might break out in the dairy isle over getting the butter. Better take an arsenal to go shopping.

What I wonder is how much did all that steal and lead weigh? This guy looks like he had over a hundred pounds of weaponry on him easy.

And the other one is how in the world is he gonna shoot all those at the same time with two hands?

What a NUTCASE!

Like I said .... and the band played on.

 

[Taichiliberal]

That seems to be what the liberal gun haters want to do. Ban everyone (sane or insane) from owning what they think are "assault weapons," isn't it?

You keep bleating that line, yet history shows that no such bill proposal existed in the last 40 years...only in the fevered minds of sheep like you being ginned up by the gun manufacturers mouth pieces in right wing media.

 

[NiftyNiblick]

There are plenty of helpful measures that should be implemented to make our gun laws more sensible,

but we're putting a ton of effort into doing something that 98% of trumpanzees and 50% of Democrats won't let us do.

Plenty of Americans are horrified and enraged at the level of firearm crime in America--
it's mind boggling to the civilized world which sees us as Westworld come to rel life--

but most Americans would rather see the bullet-ridden bodies of innocent school children stuffed and mounted on Town Hall walls
than to see any restrictions on gun ownership.

That's who and what Americans are. Have the stones to admit it. Those of us who aren't like that don't have sufficient numbers to change anything.

A predominantly idiot country is going to have idiot attributes, these including being a 24/7 shooting gallery.

 

[Taichiliberal]

Quote Originally Posted by Nordberg View Post
When Clinton banned assault weapons in 1994, mass killings were cut in half, In 2004, the reds let it expire and mass shootings went up 239 percent. You haters get your way and people die. But lives are not as important as your right to have military weapons.

Just one point, the "military" style firearms are not going away, the new sales can be stopped by law, but those that already own them will end up retaining them, there really is little anyone can do to change that reality.

No one wants to.....that was the law in 1994. Damned fools re-opened the flood gates....and it went just as Nordberg described, a matter of fact and history. You can't water that down.

 

[Taichiliberal]

 

[RB 60]

Oh stop playing dumber than you are.....you know damned well what I'm talking about. If you don't, I'll spell it out for you: You remove these weapons from the general population via stopping retailers & gun shows from selling them....you do that by specifically banning them. By legal precedent, anyone owning this type of weapon prior to the enactment of law can legally keep them...BUT THEY CAN'T SELL THEM!

CAPICE', buffoon?

A new addition would be to create a true working national network for universal background checks (that would include notice of psychological cases/commitment ) and registry of all weapons sales (like you do cars), so geniuses like you won't unknowingly sell to criminals all the mentally defective, and you have a better track of cross state buyers for criminal use.

If this doesn't clear things up, then I can't help you.

Won't happen. What makes you think those of us that have unregistered guns will register them?
Oh, and you did say "remove," check the dictionary to see what "remove' means...

 

[Taichiliberal]

Let this sink in?!!

As you can read on this thread...the gunners don't care! They'll make any and all types of excuses to own a weapon that BY THEIR OWN ADMISSION is NOT the best weapon to use in an assault against other people (so they say despite the gun's designer doing so for the military)....despite it being a VERY EFFECTIVE weapon of choice for the majority of mass shooters in the last 2 decades. They want it because they want it....so there!

 

[Taichiliberal]

Agreed. It's a complex issue. Why do you think certain Democrats want to ban guns based on mental health but don't care if crazy people drive or vote?

Where do you get this stuff?

 

[Taichiliberal]

b,b,b,b more than a few teahicks have told me AR-15's are mere hunting rifles, NOT EVEN ASSAULT WEAPONS!

pure coincidence armies around the world use them to assault people and other armies!

Yeah, tell me about it! They even deny what it was originally designed for!

 

[Taichiliberal]

AR-15....a versatile weapon that does EXACTLY WHAT IT WAS DESIGNED FOR....ASSAULTING AND KILLING PEOPLE WITH ACCURACY .

Exactly.
Not designed for hunting like a bolt action Weatherby or even a lever action .30/30 for brush hunting or a shotgun for hunting fowl.
Not designed for target shooting like a Remington 40XB.

Not designed for home defense unless you're expecting to be invaded by a platoon of marauders
in which case you might consider either a change of address or retirement from illegal drug distributing activities,
plus it makes small holes. A big guy high on drugs will take one or two and keep on coming.

It's designed for the fucking military, which the civilian citizen is not.
I'm not an anti-gun person.
I'm a reasonable person when it comes to firearms.
There is no need for civilian ownership of assault weapons and there are infinite reasons in opposition to it.
You can still own lots and lots of more appropriate firearms designed for legitimate reasons,
and acquire them in ways compatible with public safety.

Bravo!