219-212... Health Care Bill Passes..

Topspin said:
I'm greedy, I'm glad there will be more finance and accounting jobs. And I'm glad that republitards strategy is aimed at pleasing the pope. Your poll numbers are in the teens and falling.
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here's what it's all about folks. traitors and scumbags like topspin would betray and sell you out to make an extra buck.

there's a pitchfork with your name on it, fascist.
 
SmarterThanYou said:
here's what it's all about folks. traitors and scumbags like topspin would betray and sell you out to make an extra buck.

there's a pitchfork with your name on it, fascist.
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Topspin's support has been bizarre and I'm am reluctant to even discuss this issue with him. He just seems insane and all over the place.
 
With the passage of universal healthcare in America, the paradigrim has really changed. The Republicans could choose to accept or reject it. If they reject it, we will see a new party emerge in 10 year as the Republicans are discarded to the rubbish heap of history. If they choose to accept it, I could see myself voting Republican (in extreme circumstances) in 10 years.
 
apple0154 said:
That's right. Another wait. And why is that? Who has been fighting against health care?
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....tsk/tsk......we both know why it is.....because they needed to collect ten years worth of taxes and provide only six years worth of benefits so they could maintain the lie that we can afford what they want to do........nobody has been fighting against health care....we've just been fighting against those who want to put it under the control of the federal government......
 
PostmodernProphet said:
....tsk/tsk......we both know why it is.....because they needed to collect ten years worth of taxes and provide only six years worth of benefits so they could maintain the lie that we can afford what they want to do........nobody has been fighting against health care....we've just been fighting against those who want to put it under the control of the federal government......
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You can afford it. That's the point. There are countries all over the globe affording it. There are countries that have afforded it for 40+ years. Not one country has reverted to the archaic "pay or suffer" system. Not one.

There isn't one example one can give and say, "See, that country can't afford it."

Like any other program there will always be people whining about the cost. However, there is not one political party, in any country with a universal plan, that is campaigning against it.

What more proof is needed? What is it people do not understand?
 
This quote can apply to either side of the political spectrum but I found it interesting. Of course it comes from someone with grave concerns about President Obama and the direction this country is heading right now. I have concerns but not so deep as to holler, "the sky is falling."

"The danger to America is not Barack Obama but a citizenry capable of entrusting a man like him with the presidency. It will be easier to limit and undo the follies of an Obama presidency than to restore the necessary common sense and good judgment to an electorate willing to have such a man for their president. The problem is much deeper and far more serious than Mr. Obama, who is a mere symptom of what ails us. Blaming the prince of the fools should not blind anyone to the vast confederacy of fools that made him their prince. The republic can survive a Barack Obama. It is less likely to survive a multitude of fools such as those who made him their president.
 
leaningright said:
This quote can apply to either side of the political spectrum but I found it interesting. Of course it comes from someone with grave concerns about President Obama and the direction this country is heading right now. I have concerns but not so deep as to holler, "the sky is falling."

"The danger to America is not Barack Obama but a citizenry capable of entrusting a man like him with the presidency. It will be easier to limit and undo the follies of an Obama presidency than to restore the necessary common sense and good judgment to an electorate willing to have such a man for their president. The problem is much deeper and far more serious than Mr. Obama, who is a mere symptom of what ails us. Blaming the prince of the fools should not blind anyone to the vast confederacy of fools that made him their prince. The republic can survive a Barack Obama. It is less likely to survive a multitude of fools such as those who made him their president.
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Again, what evidence is there a universal health plan is bad? It's not a new idea. Its not something untried. There isn't one example anyone can point to and say, "See, it ruined 'that' country."

It's just silliness. Scare tactics and silliness. Nothing more. Well, greed but that goes without saying.
 
apple0154 said:
Again, what evidence is there a universal health plan is bad? It's not a new idea. Its not something untried. There isn't one example anyone can point to and say, "See, it ruined 'that' country."

It's just silliness. Scare tactics and silliness. Nothing more. Well, greed but that goes without saying.
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For me personally it is not just the health care bill. I am not up enough on it to know if it is bad or good. I am on record stating that I want something done to help the less fortunate with health care...I was a great supporter of Sooner-care in our state. But to many of us...a whole bunch of us...we look at the European nations that so many liberals hold up as a "standard" for this or that and think, "We don't want to be anything like them." It repulses me to think of becoming like France or even England in many regards. Again, not just talking health care here. The jury is still out on whether I am for or against what went down Sunday.
 
leaningright said:
For me personally it is not just the health care bill. I am not up enough on it to know if it is bad or good. I am on record stating that I want something done to help the less fortunate with health care...I was a great supporter of Sooner-care in our state. But to many of us...a whole bunch of us...we look at the European nations that so many liberals hold up as a "standard" for this or that and think, "We don't want to be anything like them." It repulses me to think of becoming like France or even England in many regards. Again, not just talking health care here. The jury is still out on whether I am for or against what went down Sunday.
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But that's the beauty of health care. It fits in any society, from a dictatorship like Cuba to Holland's well-known freedoms.
 
apple0154 said:
You can afford it. That's the point. There are countries all over the globe affording it. There are countries that have afforded it for 40+ years. Not one country has reverted to the archaic "pay or suffer" system. Not one.

There isn't one example one can give and say, "See, that country can't afford it."

Like any other program there will always be people whining about the cost. However, there is not one political party, in any country with a universal plan, that is campaigning against it.

What more proof is needed? What is it people do not understand?
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what is not understood is why you can justify charging ten years costs and provide six years benefits and pretend you've balanced the budget.....
 
apple0154 said:
You can afford it. That's the point. There are countries all over the globe affording it. There are countries that have afforded it for 40+ years. Not one country has reverted to the archaic "pay or suffer" system. Not one.

There isn't one example one can give and say, "See, that country can't afford it."

Like any other program there will always be people whining about the cost. However, there is not one political party, in any country with a universal plan, that is campaigning against it.

What more proof is needed? What is it people do not understand?
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We can afford it? Have you seen our financial statements and other reports? Moody's is warning us our spending is out of control. China is worried that we won't be able to pay them back all that we have borrowed just to exist. There is nothing in the SS Trust Fund. It isn't a pretty picture.
 
PostmodernProphet said:
what is not understood is why you can justify charging ten years costs and provide six years benefits and pretend you've balanced the budget.....
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You have to remember it's a start. Some things kick in now. Well, in a few months like covering "kids" up to 26 years old. When the majority of things are covered four years from now the government will see what needs to be tweaked.

The fifth and sixth years will require the government to make appropriate adjustments. The idea is both political parties will be working on the same problem.

Look at it this way. Let's say it's found sprained/broken ankles/legs are an expense the government wants to cut back on. Rather than one political party saying we shouldn't cover injured ankles/legs due to skiing accidents that won't be an option. The options will be finding cheaper cast material or cheaper splints or some other cost savings method/device.

That's what was missing from the talks. One political party was trying to come up with a workable plan while the other party didn't want any plan at all and we see the result. As the citizens realize the benefits future governments that come into power will have no choice but to come up with ideas while maintaining the basic concept of the plan which is everyone is entitled to health care.
 
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