Not Everyone Is Meant For College

Annie

Annie

Not So Junior Member
There should be programs for those that are not college material and we should stop pretending that everyone is.

http://www.theatlantic.com/doc/200806/college

The idea that a university education is for everyone is a destructive myth. An instructor at a “college of last resort” explains why.

by Professor X
In the Basement of the Ivory Tower

...America, ever-idealistic, seems wary of the vocational-education track. We are not comfortable limiting anyone’s options. Telling someone that college is not for him seems harsh and classist and British, as though we were sentencing him to a life in the coal mines. I sympathize with this stance; I subscribe to the American ideal. Unfortunately, it is with me and my red pen that that ideal crashes and burns.

Sending everyone under the sun to college is a noble initiative. Academia is all for it, naturally. Industry is all for it; some companies even help with tuition costs. Government is all for it; the truly needy have lots of opportunities for financial aid. The media applauds it—try to imagine someone speaking out against the idea. To oppose such a scheme of inclusion would be positively churlish. But one piece of the puzzle hasn’t been figured into the equation, to use the sort of phrase I encounter in the papers submitted by my English 101 students. The zeitgeist of academic possibility is a great inverted pyramid, and its rather sharp point is poking, uncomfortably, a spot just about midway between my shoulder blades.

For I, who teach these low-level, must-pass, no-multiple-choice-test classes, am the one who ultimately delivers the news to those unfit for college: that they lack the most-basic skills and have no sense of the volume of work required; that they are in some cases barely literate; that they are so bereft of schemata, so dispossessed of contexts in which to place newly acquired knowledge, that every bit of information simply raises more questions. They are not ready for high school, some of them, much less for college.

I am the man who has to lower the hammer...

....
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Certainly, college is not for everyone.

First, there are those, who, as the article points out, are ill prepared for the rigors of a college level academic program. Many of those are victims of our current "education" (and I use the term loosely) system which seems to run on the idea that "self esteem" - even if it is derived from being given what most have to earn - is more important than assuring a high school diploma means a certain minimum level of knowledge and ability. Others are victims of themselves, having chosen to either deliberately take advantage of the pass-without-doing-the-work system, or gave it all up as "too boring to bother with". Others (very, very few) are actually unable to progress beyond the level their physical brain limits them to.

But even when one does have the cognitive and academic skills to handle - or even excel - at college it does not mean college is for them. The types of careers available through a four year college degree are vast, but are yet only a part of the total career opportunities available. A skilled carpenter is in a trade that provides as good a living as many bachelor degrees, yet does not demand 4 years of classical, formal education. A good auto mechanic is worth their weight in gasoline (used to be gold, but lately....). And while modern mechanics certainly must take technical classes on a constant basis that demand good intelligence, it is still not anything like what goes on at a college. They may be ABLE to do the college work, but if they prefer fixing cars, more power to them. The same goes for metal workers, concrete workers, welders, cabinet makers, etc., etc., etc. I will take my hat off to anyone who has the ability to become a craftsman in a trade.

One attitude this elitist society needs to get over is the way we tend to look at trade schools, community colleges, and the like. A two year degree in computer maintenance and repair makes for a good trade, and from a societal aspect, is every bit as valuable as the careers open to a graduate of a 4-year computer science program. But, in my experience, there seems to be a "second class" attitude toward trade schools or two-year colleges, as if those who go there are not "good enough" or they would have gone to COLLEGE. Why is that?
 
Yepper I make $75/ hr and have no degree. That is my paid job, I make far less than that in my two businesses.

I do however have over 4,000 classroom hours of technical education, and am smarter than topper :)
 
Good Luck said:
Certainly, college is not for everyone.

First, there are those, who, as the article points out, are ill prepared for the rigors of a college level academic program. Many of those are victims of our current "education" (and I use the term loosely) system which seems to run on the idea that "self esteem" - even if it is derived from being given what most have to earn - is more important than assuring a high school diploma means a certain minimum level of knowledge and ability. Others are victims of themselves, having chosen to either deliberately take advantage of the pass-without-doing-the-work system, or gave it all up as "too boring to bother with". Others (very, very few) are actually unable to progress beyond the level their physical brain limits them to.

But even when one does have the cognitive and academic skills to handle - or even excel - at college it does not mean college is for them. The types of careers available through a four year college degree are vast, but are yet only a part of the total career opportunities available. A skilled carpenter is in a trade that provides as good a living as many bachelor degrees, yet does not demand 4 years of classical, formal education. A good auto mechanic is worth their weight in gasoline (used to be gold, but lately....). And while modern mechanics certainly must take technical classes on a constant basis that demand good intelligence, it is still not anything like what goes on at a college. They may be ABLE to do the college work, but if they prefer fixing cars, more power to them. The same goes for metal workers, concrete workers, welders, cabinet makers, etc., etc., etc. I will take my hat off to anyone who has the ability to become a craftsman in a trade.

One attitude this elitist society needs to get over is the way we tend to look at trade schools, community colleges, and the like. A two year degree in computer maintenance and repair makes for a good trade, and from a societal aspect, is every bit as valuable as the careers open to a graduate of a 4-year computer science program. But, in my experience, there seems to be a "second class" attitude toward trade schools or two-year colleges, as if those who go there are not "good enough" or they would have gone to COLLEGE. Why is that?
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and I do believe that was the point of the article. Yet we have some on crying that those with GED are not able to think? I beg to differ. There are too many success stories from those with HS diplomas and others. College is good for some, but not for everyone.
 
I have also noticed the past few elections a certain faction of the democratic party who seem to be enamored with the idea that liberal/democratic voters are "more intelligent" than conservative/republican voters, and use per capita college degrees as the basis for the claim.

I had a professor once - very smart guy in his field (history) - but could not find the oil filler cap on his new car.

Also know a guy who has never taken a college course, but can do tensor equations in his head. He is always studying math - but on his own terms, and for free at the public library. He can also hang a door in record time, trim and true, without using a square or level. Best finish carpenter on the planet.

There are all kinds of intelligence, and not all are of the type which gains advantage from a formalized higher education program.
 
uscitizen said:
Well GL I offer as proof that some of us were not dumb enough to vote for Bush twice....
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Yea, that is the attitude alright. And it such a WINNING attitude, too.

I did not even vote for the SOB, but that bullshit "Bush voters are stupid" rankles the crap outta me. A lot of very intelligent people voted for Bush. A majority voted for Bush in 04. And then we have a bunch of self-agrandizing smug asswipes with the claim that over half of active voters in 2004 are stupid.

And you wonder why so many paint the democrats as elitist snobs.
 
The idea that everyone should go to college looks great on paper and is ridiculous in real life.

We need more technical schools. We will always need plumbers, welders, mechanics, building tradesmen, and even more technical trained electricians, elctronics technicians, ect ect

There should be no shame in that.

I make a comfortable living. I am a semester shy of being a teacher, but couldn't live on what they pay teachers. My bosses are both millionaires, and neither went to college.

A mentor of mine once told me "never confuse an educated man with an intelligent man, they are not the same thing". And he held a PhD. But he knew that knowledge is not always attached to a degree.
 
Watermark said:
College is for the rich. You peons should get to work while we rule over you as masters. It is the way of the universe.
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I'm from the same city as one of the world's richest men, and grew up 5 min. from where he went to high school. He employs tons of college grads, but was himself a dropout. That is to say, Bill Gates of Microsoft...
 
Good Luck said:
I have also noticed the past few elections a certain faction of the democratic party who seem to be enamored with the idea that liberal/democratic voters are "more intelligent" than conservative/republican voters, and use per capita college degrees as the basis for the claim.

I had a professor once - very smart guy in his field (history) - but could not find the oil filler cap on his new car.

Also know a guy who has never taken a college course, but can do tensor equations in his head. He is always studying math - but on his own terms, and for free at the public library. He can also hang a door in record time, trim and true, without using a square or level. Best finish carpenter on the planet.

There are all kinds of intelligence, and not all are of the type which gains advantage from a formalized higher education program.
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Actually the numbers do show that in 2000 at least Gore got more votes than Bush from those with an advanced college degree.

Political leanings aside you are right about the difference between book smarts, street smarts etc. Remember the oldage for example, those who can do those who can't teach (my father is a former college professor so I really like that one) among others. There are all kinds.

However you have picked up on a definite theme from people like citizen who state 'we are enlightened and think for ourselves and therefore didn't vote for Bush'...
 
Off the top of my head only 15% of Americans give or take have gotten a bachelor degree. I think there is plenty of room for growth.
 
damn, usc, don't you ever sometimes just think, "maybe today I won't burden all my forum mates with the worst puns in the world"? Would you be open to this idea if it never has occurred to you?
 
AssHatZombie said:
damn, usc, don't you ever sometimes just think, "maybe today I won't burden all my forum mates with the worst puns in the world"? Would you be open to this idea if it never has occurred to you?
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Nope never occured to me, but now that you mention it....A bad idea all around, just endure ;)
 
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