Into the Night
Verified User
Congress has no authority to change the Constitution either.
Donald Trump 'voids' Joe Biden's pardons after former president used autopen signature
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Remember folks they always, 100% of the time, without fail, bank on it, are doing what they accuse the other side of.
Democrats are not well in the brain.
Into the Night
Verified User
Nope. He is removing those and prosecuting those who broke the law. He has the authority to do tiat.
Trump has not issued any pre-emptive 'pardon'. Biden tried that! A pre-emptive 'pardon' is completely meaningless.
A meaningless act is never necessary.
Into the Night
Verified User
Buzzword fallacy.
Diogenes
Nemo me impune lacessit
Into the Night
Verified User
A meaningless act is a meaningless act, Void.
It's meaningless.
A pardon is not a speed, Void.
A pardon is not a mountain, Void.
A pardon is not an aircraft, Void.
Inversion fallacy.
Into the Night
Verified User
Buzzword fallacy. Repetition fallacy (chanting).
Into the Night
Verified User
How do you 'pardon' someone for something they never did, Damo???
Diogenes
Nemo me impune lacessit
It doesn't. Geebus, this is why I noted rulings on this in the past. You have got to pay attention to what someone says.
The foundational case is Kastigar v. United States (406 U.S. 441, 1972), where the Supreme Court ruled that the government can compel testimony from a witness who invokes their Fifth Amendment privilege by granting use and derivative-use immunity.
Just repeating things does not make them more correct, in fact repeating things when you have new information that directly contradicts what you have said makes it even more wrong. This immunity prevents the prosecution from using the compelled testimony or any evidence derived from it against the witness in a criminal case. The Court held that this level of protection is coextensive with the Fifth Amendment privilege, meaning it sufficiently safeguards the witness while allowing the government to obtain testimony. The ruling clarified that full transactional immunity (complete protection from prosecution for the offense) is not constitutionally required... use and derivative-use immunity is enough.
There are other rulings, but this was the foundational case on the subject. A pardon makes it impossible to prosecute for the crime, shoot in Hunter's case you cannot prosecute for ANY crime real or imagined he may have committed during a period of over a decade, thus you cannot violate his 5th by compelling testimony. Anyone pardoned for a crime cannot be prosecuted for the crime, it isn't even qualified immunity or derivative-use it is simply a free pass especially when it is like Hunter's... He absolutely could be compelled to testify.
Anyway, in Burdick v. United States (236 U.S. 79, 1915), the Supreme Court noted that a pardon removes the legal consequences of an offense, implying that a pardoned individual loses the ability to assert the Fifth Amendment for the forgiven crimes.
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Again... You can literally pardon them for anything, there is no constitutional limit. One thing I know, even our founders were not shocked when it was done... George Washington pardoned folks who were never charged with a crime.
Into the Night
Verified User
MAGA isn't a person.
What 'falling pole numbers'????
It's clear. It's also somewhat irrelevant.
How do you 'pardon' someone for something that they never did???
How do you 'pardon' someone that wasn't convicted???
An opinion, nothing more. It's obviously an issue, otherwise, why are you trying to defend it?
What 'pardon'????? How do you 'pardon' someone for something they were never convicted of??????
SlaveForChrist
Verified User
The reality is, an autopen was not used (even though one of Trump's own federal judges ruled it is perfectly acceptable anyway).Trump says Biden’s pardons are now ‘void and vacant’ after autopen controversy
Trump says Biden’s pardons are now ‘void and vacant’ after autopen controversy
President ranted about previous pardons on Truth Social and issued new threat to January 6 investigatorswww.independent.co.uk
Instead, Trump and his braindead cocksucking cult looked at the Federal Register, saw a reproduction signature that they use for all documents displayed wrt that president, and decided it was an autopen signature because they didn't realize it's a reproduction, not the actual signed document, because they're so fucking stupid.
A good thread on this: View: https://x.com/ellim992/status/1897970253097058329
Teflon Don
I'm back baby
What you call revenge, some would call justice. Although, one would ask, if they did nothing wrong they would not need preemptive pardons.The pardon is and of itself an admission of guilt. Even you would have to admit that
Teflon Don
I'm back baby
The fact that you think you are here to educate people says so much about your narcissistic personality disorder
Unless you're an imbecile you must mean acceptance of a pardon is an admission of guilt. It may not be. It's an acceptance of protection from prosecution, whether the acceptance is also an admission of guilt hasn't been finally decided.
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ZenMode
Well-known member
Again, it's already been done. Stop being stupid.
What court is no court? Why no court is no court!
Guno צְבִי
We fight, We win, Am Yisrael Chai
Poor ignorant farangTrump says Biden’s pardons are now ‘void and vacant’ after autopen controversy
Trump says Biden’s pardons are now ‘void and vacant’ after autopen controversy
President ranted about previous pardons on Truth Social and issued new threat to January 6 investigators
And while autopens (mechanical devices used to automatically add a signature to a document) have come under scrutiny in the past, the Justice Department as recently as 2005 determined they were constitutional and could be used for a president to sign a bill into law in a study commissioned by then-President George W. Bush.
"If the autopen is illegal, then many of the actions and regulations that presidents have done for the past four or five decades are null and void. It's a ridiculous argument," said Elaine Kamarck, a senior fellow of governance studies at the Brookings Institution.
"There is nothing in the Constitution that requires that a pardon must be signed without an autopen. Obviously, that is a 20th century invention, and earlier presidents had no access to such technology. Nonetheless, Trump has zero authority to undo a Biden pardon, just as the next president has no authority to undo Trump's pardons," said Michael Gerhardt, a constitutional law expert at the University of North Carolina.
Despite his claims, legal experts told ABC News that Trump does not have the power to overturn Biden's actions.
A president's clemency power is vested in Article II of the Constitution and is "broad and virtually unlimited," said Jeffrey Crouch, an assistant professor at American University and expert on presidential pardons.
Trump claims Biden's pardons for Jan. 6 committee are 'void.' Legal experts disagree
President Donald Trump is taking aim at one of his predecessor's final acts in office: preemptive pardons for members of the House Jan. 6 select committee. In a late-night social media post, Trump claimed without evidence President Joe Biden used an autopen to sign the pardons and so he...
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