160 a barrel?

I have to disagree with you and ;) Epicurus....

I was in business for a couple of decades and worked for 3 Major Usa Corporations...and during this time period, one of the calculations that we often used in our analysis of our business, was the dollars per square foot that we were making in each of our stores.... in the space that each one of our stores had, including the stock space it took to house the product off of the "showroom" floor....or the display floor in a dept store.

If your space is limited, then dollars per square foot is a very important measure and a measure that you want to RISE.....

Why? Because if your space is limited, and you can only show a consumer so much product, yet you wanted to increase your sales, there are only two ways to do this...

One- Is turning your merchandise faster.
This means that you keep prices about the same....with lower end product, and you try to sell a hell of alot more of them a month to come out with beating your sales of the previous year....(And this is difficult to do, because your space is LIMITED so you DO NOT have the stock space to own or stock all of these cheaper cars that you would need to sell to beat last year...every inch of your floor and stock space matters...)

Or

Two- Take the easier approach and focus your customer on the higher end product, that sits on the same amount of floor space, (showroom for a car dealer) and stock space (parking lot of the dealership).....

Instead of having $12k autos, you have $25k autos sitting and using about the same amount of space.... You only need to sell half the amount of these $25k autos to give you the same sales as the $12k autos, using the SAME amount of property....and limited property at that....

So, we used to focus at all of my jobs, on "upgrading" the customer in to a higher priced product. I was in the shoe business, so if a customer asked for a certain product, we had a rule to have the sales person bring out the shoe the customer wanted, AND AN UPGRADED, similar, but Designer product, at a much higher price....about every tenth customer went for it....the upgrade but some stores had it down where every three customers out of ten would buy the upgrade and other stores where you could tell the sales people did not follow the mandate to bring an upgrade out too, with what the customer wanted sold no upgrades.

Just simple things like this can make or break a business... we HAD NO MORE SPACE, we leased spaces in department stores and they refused to give us more of it...the only way for us to do better, was to increase how much we could sell with the limited space we had and selling the "SUV" would have been the more profitable route to go...

Bottom Line

The car industry most certainly makes more off of an SUV than a car in more ways than one, and they would be foolish as business people to ignore this and not have this in their business plan to increase....so this is why i disagree with your dismissal of such.

And yes demand has alot to do with it, I do agree...but supply does also, and so does the focus of the industry that supplies us...the marketing and advertising that does CREATE the demand...its a multi billion dollar business...marketing and advertising....every corporation has a huge marketing staff, they are part of every product development meeting!

Care
Sorry, but using small business experience is not a good way to analyze a national marketing phenomenon. The U.S. auto industry has tens of thousands of dealerships and also, with the internet, direct sales. They are hardly pushing maximum sales due to limited floor space.

In fact, it's quite the opposite. Big honkin' SUVs are a major ticket item compared to smaller cars. They could have pushed smaller cars as the greater affordability of them would have significantly outpaced the larger ticket of big SUVs. But smaller cars is not what J.Q. Public wanted. So the auto companies gave J.Q. Public what they wanted.

And J.Q. Public was not worried about fuel prices because the economy had caught up and significantly surpassed the inflationary pressures of the last fuel crisis.

It is a simple matter. J.Q. public, as a mass, are not as easy to push around as you think. And J.Q. Public liked the idea of the SUV as introduced under that nomenclature in the late 80s. But they also wanted the room to be "soccer moms" as provided by the much maligned mini-van. So the demand was for the SUV type of vehicle (ie 4WD, performance power plant, etc.) coupled with the idea of the mini-van type vehicle (Large capacity, comfortable interior, easy to drive, etc.) The result was what is basically a series of luxury 4WD trucks. Its what the public wanted, and what the public were given.

SUV ads were not aimed at increasing overall sales of SUVs. They were aimed at getting the consumer to buy GM SUVs instead of Ford SUVs. (and vice versa) When Ford came out with a new item to make their SUVs better, GM and others were not far behind with either a copycat idea, or a different idea.

For crying out loud, even Cadillac started building trucks. Because that is where the demand was ALREADY, not because thats where they wanted the demand to be.
 
I have to disagree with you and ;) Epicurus....

I was in business for a couple of decades and worked for 3 Major Usa Corporations...and during this time period, one of the calculations that we often used in our analysis of our business, was the dollars per square foot that we were making in each of our stores.... in the space that each one of our stores had, including the stock space it took to house the product off of the "showroom" floor....or the display floor in a dept store.

If your space is limited, then dollars per square foot is a very important measure and a measure that you want to RISE.....

Why? Because if your space is limited, and you can only show a consumer so much product, yet you wanted to increase your sales, there are only two ways to do this...

One- Is turning your merchandise faster.
This means that you keep prices about the same....with lower end product, and you try to sell a hell of alot more of them a month to come out with beating your sales of the previous year....(And this is difficult to do, because your space is LIMITED so you DO NOT have the stock space to own or stock all of these cheaper cars that you would need to sell to beat last year...every inch of your floor and stock space matters...)

Or

Two- Take the easier approach and focus your customer on the higher end product, that sits on the same amount of floor space, (showroom for a car dealer) and stock space (parking lot of the dealership).....

Instead of having $12k autos, you have $25k autos sitting and using about the same amount of space.... You only need to sell half the amount of these $25k autos to give you the same sales as the $12k autos, using the SAME amount of property....and limited property at that....

So, we used to focus at all of my jobs, on "upgrading" the customer in to a higher priced product. I was in the shoe business, so if a customer asked for a certain product, we had a rule to have the sales person bring out the shoe the customer wanted, AND AN UPGRADED, similar, but Designer product, at a much higher price....about every tenth customer went for it....the upgrade but some stores had it down where every three customers out of ten would buy the upgrade and other stores where you could tell the sales people did not follow the mandate to bring an upgrade out too, with what the customer wanted sold no upgrades.

Just simple things like this can make or break a business... we HAD NO MORE SPACE, we leased spaces in department stores and they refused to give us more of it...the only way for us to do better, was to increase how much we could sell with the limited space we had and selling the "SUV" would have been the more profitable route to go...

Bottom Line

The car industry most certainly makes more off of an SUV than a car in more ways than one, and they would be foolish as business people to ignore this and not have this in their business plan to increase....so this is why i disagree with your dismissal of such.

And yes demand has alot to do with it, I do agree...but supply does also, and so does the focus of the industry that supplies us...the marketing and advertising that does CREATE the demand...its a multi billion dollar business...marketing and advertising....every corporation has a huge marketing staff, they are part of every product development meeting!

Care

I understand the above and agree for the most part. Again, the corporations are also responsible. But when talking specifically about cars, people are not as inclined to make an impulse purchase like they would in your shoe example. They know for the most part what they want prior to ever setting foot on a car lot. Especially today with the ability to perform so much research on-line.

For US to say that consumers are led like sheep by advertisers is to state that people are too ignorant to make informed decisions. While there are some out there that do blindly follow the herd.... to act like they are a majority is pathetic on his part. People's greed and desire to have the bigger and perceived better vehicle was driven by the idiotic desire to keep up with the Jones'.

Again, this is not to say that advertising and product placement don't work, they obviously do. But it is pathetic to suggest that individuals in general are that gullible that they will blindly follow those methods. They have an effect, but the individual is stil the one making the decision to buy and they are responsible for the decision they make.
 
Sorry, but using small business experience is not a good way to analyze a national marketing phenomenon. The U.S. auto industry has tens of thousands of dealerships and also, with the internet, direct sales. They are hardly pushing maximum sales due to limited floor space.

In fact, it's quite the opposite. Big honkin' SUVs are a major ticket item compared to smaller cars. They could have pushed smaller cars as the greater affordability of them would have significantly outpaced the larger ticket of big SUVs. But smaller cars is not what J.Q. Public wanted. So the auto companies gave J.Q. Public what they wanted.

And J.Q. Public was not worried about fuel prices because the economy had caught up and significantly surpassed the inflationary pressures of the last fuel crisis.

It is a simple matter. J.Q. public, as a mass, are not as easy to push around as you think. And J.Q. Public liked the idea of the SUV as introduced under that nomenclature in the late 80s. But they also wanted the room to be "soccer moms" as provided by the much maligned mini-van. So the demand was for the SUV type of vehicle (ie 4WD, performance power plant, etc.) coupled with the idea of the mini-van type vehicle (Large capacity, comfortable interior, easy to drive, etc.) The result was what is basically a series of luxury 4WD trucks. Its what the public wanted, and what the public were given.

SUV ads were not aimed at increasing overall sales of SUVs. They were aimed at getting the consumer to buy GM SUVs instead of Ford SUVs. (and vice versa) When Ford came out with a new item to make their SUVs better, GM and others were not far behind with either a copycat idea, or a different idea.

For crying out loud, even Cadillac started building trucks. Because that is where the demand was ALREADY, not because thats where they wanted the demand to be.

small business? Who worked for a small business? NOT ME....never have worked for a small business....have ONLY worked for Major Corporations in the USA.

Competition does come in to the picture also, no denying demand either....but you underestimate Supply and you underestimate marketing driving demand.

And you are contradicting yourself...when you say that Gm did not run SUV ads and marketing because they wanted to sell more SUV's.... while in the same breath you say GM wanted to sell more SUV'S than Ford!!! It is ONE and the SAME kiddo???

Care
 
I understand the above and agree for the most part. Again, the corporations are also responsible. But when talking specifically about cars, people are not as inclined to make an impulse purchase like they would in your shoe example. They know for the most part what they want prior to ever setting foot on a car lot. Especially today with the ability to perform so much research on-line.

Again, you underestimate Marketing.... this online source that gives you the details for all of the suv's and cars IS PART of their marketing strategy.

It gives people tha chance to look at all cars, including the ones that people did not envision owning, because of price or whatever.....without the human salesman present to nag you....number one complaint of consumers regarding car salesmen....

It also "sets up" the consumer for "covetting" something they probably can't really afford and probably don't really need....don't underestimate covetting....wanting what your neighbor had, and keeping up with the "Jones'"....I was in marketing....WE COUNTED ON IT....to build a trend.



For US to say that consumers are led like sheep by advertisers is to state that people are too ignorant to make informed decisions. While there are some out there that do blindly follow the herd.... to act like they are a majority is pathetic on his part. People's greed and desire to have the bigger and perceived better vehicle was driven by the idiotic desire to keep up with the Jones'.

Yes, keeping up with the "jones'" is counted on by marketing teams...to think that we don't count on it when planning our marketing for a product is a tad naive Super!

And TRENDS are created BY people following the heard! you may wnat to not believe this and believe that we are smarter than this and maybe some are smarter than this....but MOST are not.




Again, this is not to say that advertising and product placement don't work, they obviously do. But it is pathetic to suggest that individuals in general are that gullible that they will blindly follow those methods. They have an effect, but the individual is stil the one making the decision to buy and they are responsible for the decision they make.

People are lead like cattle when it comes to purchases due to our nature to Covet the other guys goods. I don't believe that the majority of people are "stupid" because of it....just that it is a major factor in why Capitalism works and a big reason why we are in the Housing mess that we are in too...and the credit crisis in the home that Americans are in too...the over extendedness of the consumer.....spending more than they make and using credit cards to do such.... IT WAS COUNTED ON, by the Creditcard companies and counted on by the subprimers....

I am not discounting the individual is the one to make the FINAL decision on what he does.... But I AM NOT discounting the Business's hand in it either...which is the hand that got the ball rolling through Product Marketing and through Supply.

Care
 
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Umm how many people would buy the hard weenie pills if not for advertising ?


I know uscit....

It is a HUGE part of Capitalism....it fuels it.

Maybe I am biased because I did this for a living a while back as a Product Development Marketing Manager for Reebok International....we did not pay multi million dollar contracts to people like Shack back then for NO REASON AT ALL... Corporations tend not to waste their money on things they think won't be affective to their cause....

care
 
Yep care and how many swivel sweepers would be sold if not for the obnoxious guy pushing them on infomercials ?

The sheep do not realize how sheepy they are.
 
Care since you are advertising aware. Not a common thing. Have you noticed how the auto ads are changing from just feelgood if you buy our car image things to a bit more technical again? Like mileage and warranties and such. Beginning to change, but a bit late to catch the import brands on the sales curve.

and the priapism term got dropped from the hard weenie pills too. Too technical and worrisome I guess ;)

we will see quite a bit of advertising changes thru the recession.

Most commercials now say to me be stupid like these people and buy our product.
 
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Care since you are advertising aware. Not a common thing. Have you noticed how the auto ads are changing from just feelgood if you buy our car image things to a bit more technical again? Like mileage and warranties and such. Beginning to change, but a bit late to catch the import brands on the sales curve.

and the priapism term got dropped from the hard weenie pills too. Too technical and worrisome I guess ;)

we will see quite a bit of advertising changes thru the recession.

Most commercials now say to me be stupid like these people and buy our product.

Yes, the marketing focus will change during a Recession, during a Depression and during a Boom.... This does not in any way mean that the bottom line focus of the marketing team is to sell the product at the fastest rate possible....

People do make trends, however I am not discounting trends due to covettedness....and the power of marketing and advertising to make certain the trend is exploited to no end.

c.
 
Yes, the marketing focus will change during a Recession, during a Depression and during a Boom.... This does not in any way mean that the bottom line focus of the marketing team is to sell the product at the fastest rate possible....

People do make trends, however I am not discounting trends due to covettedness....and the power of marketing and advertising to make certain the trend is exploited to no end.

c.

Yep
That is the function of marketing and advertising.
 
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