Deep Cuts

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charver said:
The EU doesn't "allow" the US to be the dominant military power. It just is by virtue of its size. Neither did i say the US "prevents" the EU from forming a military bloc. The EU is made up of separate and distinctive states which are not natural political bedfellows and there would be large obstacles to overcome before such a project were to become reality. That the US discourages such moves, though, is not really debatable.

The Us is large because we have spent on defence. The EU militaries are small because they have not. You did imply that we, the US, seeks to prevent EU military growth. Show me how the US discourages growth of any EU military. Since this is not debatable, it should be a fairly easy thing for you to prove.

So the rest of the world wants the US to police it? Are you really sure about that? The EU heads of government may want the US to work with the international community to intervene in global conflicts (although frequently this differs from the views of actual EU citizens) but the old world order is not acceptable any more. Africa, Asia and South America have had their fill of Western European and American interference and exploitation.

The EU wants the US to act as police, as I said albeit they don't make public acknowledgement. I love the way you attempt to make it sound nicey nice. The interveneing you speak of is costly, both materially and in human life. The "old world order" is not only still acceptable, but neccesary and you are naive to think otherwise. Dictators love mambsy pambsy western leaders. They tend to make bold moves while weak leaders try to play footsie. That thugs like Chavez hate western ideologies is hardly a reason to stop applying pressure.

What do you look for in a policeman? I'd wager if your local copper came round and turned a blind eye to your neighbour committing a whole host of criminal acts and then threatened to shoot you because you'd dropped some litter you wouldn't be too happy.

This tirade is not making much sense. The US military is used to protect both domestic and foreign interests for not only ourselves, but for our so called allies to maintain a global economic stability. The point again is that the work needs to be done, but the lions share is done by the US. What the EU elite want to do is have their proverbial cake (US military paying the way) and eat it too ( point the hypocritical arrognat finger of indignation)

Would you expect your policeman to then arm your neighbour with a whole array of military hardware aimed at you? Or would this be a new way of "keeping thuggery and arms trading under control"?

You once again make no sense. You throw out a silly analogy that is much too simplistic and serves no [purpose other than to peddle left -wing propaganda.

You may have noticed the debates which rage constantly on the subject of gun control on the board. It is often claimed that in order to keep the government in check you need a strong well armed citizenry. Well, the world community seem to have come to the same conclusion and are actively arming themselves with nuclear weaponry in order to prevent unwarranted and intrusive policing by a self appointed corrupt policeman. Like it or not America is not seen as a guardian angel and hasn't been for some considerable time.
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They are arming themselves because they either want to rule the world because they adhere to some fanatical celestial calling to do so, or because as in the case of N.Korea, they hope to control their economic well being.

America is not seen as a guardian angel because she is unfairly trounced on by leftist intellectuals who are either naive, arrogant, or a combination of both. Nations who have only recently experienced freedoms, such as a number of European Eastern Block nations, appreciate the work and determination of the US, because they have not been so long and far removed from tyranny.
 
What about leftists non-intellectuals or rightist intellectuals? What's so wrong with being intelligent? Is stupidity in spades, like you have, some sort of virtue?
 
Dear Miss Ice Dancer,

I did start to write a lengthy response but, somewhat hungover this morning, i had an epiphany and decided that banging my head against a brick wall was not on my top 10 list of things to do today. Consequently i'm just going to agree with everything you've said.

It is astounding how a disparate group of states, many of whom have had stagnant communist era economies for half a century, have not managed to spend all their spare cash on matching the military spending of the US, which isn't bankrupt.

The US does want the EU to establish a large well equipped military force independent of the US and would see no threat to their position if such an outcome were to occur.

Although it never says it, the EU thinks the US is doing a great job especially in Iraq, which every European country fully supported, albeit very quietly.

There is no new world order and everything is just like it was post 1945. There are no new nuclear powers and emerging economies to threaten the dominance of the US.

Dictators love “nambsy pambsy” western leaders as opposed to the right wing nut-job's who often provide most of their weaponry.

Hugo Chavez is a “thug” who wasn't democratically elected and who needs to be deposed, preferably in favour of a leader who will cease looking after the interests of ordinary people and get back in the pockets of Western governments.

The US has maintained global economic stability. We're just going through a blip at the minute so pay no attention to that.

The EU elite eat proverbial cake and point a lot.

Any view which offers criticism of the US is left wing propaganda.

America's image in the world has nothing to do with funding terrorism, coups and death squads, nothing to do with propping up dictators or human rights abuses but is entirely due to leftist intellectuals being arrogant and/or naive.

Eastern European nations recognise the work and determination of the US to ensure freedom. Those rumours of “black” CIA prisons in Eastern Europe were unfounded, undoubtedly spread by leftist propagandists.

In short the US is a beacon of freedom to all in the world and if you say otherwise then you're just a crazy leftist. Yes, all 6.4 billion of you.

Death to Communism and Good Morning.
 
charver said:
Dear Miss Ice Dancer,

I did start to write a lengthy response but, somewhat hungover this morning, i had an epiphany and decided that banging my head against a brick wall was not on my top 10 list of things to do today. Consequently i'm just going to agree with everything you've said.

It is astounding how a disparate group of states, many of whom have had stagnant communist era economies for half a century, have not managed to spend all their spare cash on matching the military spending of the US, which isn't bankrupt.

The US does want the EU to establish a large well equipped military force independent of the US and would see no threat to their position if such an outcome were to occur.

Although it never says it, the EU thinks the US is doing a great job especially in Iraq, which every European country fully supported, albeit very quietly.

There is no new world order and everything is just like it was post 1945. There are no new nuclear powers and emerging economies to threaten the dominance of the US.

Dictators love “nambsy pambsy” western leaders as opposed to the right wing nut-job's who often provide most of their weaponry.

Hugo Chavez is a “thug” who wasn't democratically elected and who needs to be deposed, preferably in favour of a leader who will cease looking after the interests of ordinary people and get back in the pockets of Western governments.

The US has maintained global economic stability. We're just going through a blip at the minute so pay no attention to that.

The EU elite eat proverbial cake and point a lot.

Any view which offers criticism of the US is left wing propaganda.

America's image in the world has nothing to do with funding terrorism, coups and death squads, nothing to do with propping up dictators or human rights abuses but is entirely due to leftist intellectuals being arrogant and/or naive.

Eastern European nations recognise the work and determination of the US to ensure freedom. Those rumours of “black” CIA prisons in Eastern Europe were unfounded, undoubtedly spread by leftist propagandists.

In short the US is a beacon of freedom to all in the world and if you say otherwise then you're just a crazy leftist. Yes, all 6.4 billion of you.

Death to Communism and Good Morning.
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So what were you drinking last night? I had Makers Mark Kentucky Bourbon over ice. I also have a good Fuents to smoke. Though I must admit, I wouldn't mind having some of what ID was smoking though I can do with out the kool-aid she's drinking.
 
Chavez may have been elected as a populist candidate, but that does not mean he is not a thug.

Blaming economic failures for why socialist spending nations in the EU have weak militaries is not the fault of the US neither is it proof that the US is doing anything to prevent said nations from such spending (your unproven claim). Dragging in communist governments is a new distraction from your inability to prove your statements about the EU. BTW, China and Russia (old communist states) both have better equipped and larger militaries than all of the EU combined.

You can use sarcasm and dismissiveness to your hearts content as at least it makes you feel as though you have won the argument.


charver said:
Dear Miss Ice Dancer,

I did start to write a lengthy response but, somewhat hungover this morning, i had an epiphany and decided that banging my head against a brick wall was not on my top 10 list of things to do today. Consequently i'm just going to agree with everything you've said.

It is astounding how a disparate group of states, many of whom have had stagnant communist era economies for half a century, have not managed to spend all their spare cash on matching the military spending of the US, which isn't bankrupt.

The US does want the EU to establish a large well equipped military force independent of the US and would see no threat to their position if such an outcome were to occur.

Although it never says it, the EU thinks the US is doing a great job especially in Iraq, which every European country fully supported, albeit very quietly.

There is no new world order and everything is just like it was post 1945. There are no new nuclear powers and emerging economies to threaten the dominance of the US.

Dictators love “nambsy pambsy” western leaders as opposed to the right wing nut-job's who often provide most of their weaponry.

Hugo Chavez is a “thug” who wasn't democratically elected and who needs to be deposed, preferably in favour of a leader who will cease looking after the interests of ordinary people and get back in the pockets of Western governments.

The US has maintained global economic stability. We're just going through a blip at the minute so pay no attention to that.

The EU elite eat proverbial cake and point a lot.

Any view which offers criticism of the US is left wing propaganda.

America's image in the world has nothing to do with funding terrorism, coups and death squads, nothing to do with propping up dictators or human rights abuses but is entirely due to leftist intellectuals being arrogant and/or naive.

Eastern European nations recognise the work and determination of the US to ensure freedom. Those rumours of “black” CIA prisons in Eastern Europe were unfounded, undoubtedly spread by leftist propagandists.

In short the US is a beacon of freedom to all in the world and if you say otherwise then you're just a crazy leftist. Yes, all 6.4 billion of you.

Death to Communism and Good Morning.
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Mottleydude said:
So what were you drinking last night? I had Makers Mark Kentucky Bourbon over ice. I also have a good Fuents to smoke. Though I must admit, I wouldn't mind having some of what ID was smoking though I can do with out the kool-aid she's drinking.
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If i were drinking shorts i'd probably not even have managed to turn the computer on this morning.

It was strictly Boddingtons and then some weird real ale stuff i can't remember the name of but it tasted a bit like orange peel, not sure if it was supposed to taste of orange peel but there you go.

Give it about an hour and a bit, and its off to do it all over again.

Hats off to zombie Jesus and his bank holiday rewards. Huzzah.
 
charver said:
Thanks for the permission.

And for the record - nobody "wins" arguments on here.
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I wasn't giving permission I was pointing out what you were doing. I disagree about winning arguments. If someone makes a claim and then supports it with facts, they have won their argument. That posters are too dull witted or stubborn to acknowledge that, does not mean an argument has not been won.
 
Ice Dancer said:
I wasn't giving permission I was pointing out what you were doing. I disagree about winning arguments. If someone makes a claim and then supports it with facts, they have won their argument. That posters are too dull witted or stubborn to acknowledge that, does not mean an argument has not been won.
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If it makes you feel better to feel you've "won" an argument then i'm very happy for you to believe that.

Perhaps you'd like to put up a small plaque on your wall?
 
charver said:
If it makes you feel better to feel you've "won" an argument then i'm very happy for you to believe that.

Perhaps you'd like to put up a small plaque on your wall?
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Yes, more sarcasm your favorite strategy to cover a failed argument. Glad to know I won because of your inability to support your claims.
 
Ice Dancer said:
Yes, more sarcasm your favorite strategy to cover a failed argument. Glad to know I won because of your inability to support your claims.
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You really take this seriously don't you?


img-prod-TR5016-big.jpg

Awarded to Ice Dancer 11th April 2009 for winning on an internets message board.

Congratulations you're the big winner...
 
Take you seriously??? You have shown you can't be, meaning of course you are only to be engaged in the most elementary of discussions...I'll make note for all future discussions to remember your ego. :)

For the record, I did not create the argument you did. Next time you ought to engage your arguments with a little more energy and a lot less puffery or least preface them with "I just like to open my kisser and blather on don't pay me no mind". :p


charver said:
You really take this seriously don't you?


img-prod-TR5016-big.jpg

Awarded to Ice Dancer 11th April 2009 for winning on an internets message board.[/1]

Congratulations you're the big winner...
Click to expand...
 
Ice Dancer said:
Take you seriously??? You have shown you can't be, meaning of course you are only to be engaged in the most elementary of discussions...I'll make note for all future discussions to remember your ego. :)

For the record, I did not create the argument you did. Next time you ought to engage your arguments with a little more energy and a lot less puffery or least preface them with "I just like to open my kisser and blather on don't pay me no mind". :p
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Now look what you've gone and done.

broken-heart.jpg


Do you feel proud?
 
:D

Maybe you're not so icy after all.

Anyway, i'm off out (with a spring in my step).

Enjoy the weekend.
 
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