FUCK THE POLICE
911 EVERY DAY
Will you visit me in prison?
I think I'm going to make the Witches and Communists party while I'm in there.
Does evil exist and should we defeat it...
- Thread starter Jarod
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Will you visit me in prison?
I think I'm going to make the Witches and Communists party while I'm in there.
Epicurus
Reasonable
That's a Big Tent.
"Hedges, who is not a pacifist and supports humanitarian interventions, such as those in Bosnia and Kosovo designed to stop campaigns of genocide, nevertheless describes war as “the most potent narcotic invented by humankind.” He argues that violence has a dark fascination, something the Bible calls “the lust of the eye.” He writes that war is the pornography of violence, that “it has a dark beauty, filled with the monstrous and the grotesque.” “War,” he writes, “gives us a distorted sense of self. It gives us meaning. It creates a feeling of comradeship that obliterates our alienation and makes us feel, for perhaps the first time in our lives, that we belong.” War, Hedges wrote, exposes the capacity for evil that lurks not far below the surface within all of us. We are all culpable. War is about worshipping the death instinct, which Hedges, quoting Freud, refers to as Thanatos, the Greek God of death. War, he argues, starts out looking and feling like love, the chief emotion war destroys, leads to the annihilation of the other and finally to self-annihilation. War, he writes, is as close as we come to attaining a state of almost pure sin with its goals of hatred and destruction. His book draws heavily from his own experience and the literature of combat from Homer to Michael Herr."
http://www.truthdig.com/about/staff/70
"We first kill people with our minds, before we kill them with weapons. Whatever the conflict, the enemy is always the destroyer. We're on God's side; they're barbaric. We're good, they're evil. War gives us a feeling of moral clarity that we lack at other times." Sam Keen
http://www.truthdig.com/about/staff/70
"We first kill people with our minds, before we kill them with weapons. Whatever the conflict, the enemy is always the destroyer. We're on God's side; they're barbaric. We're good, they're evil. War gives us a feeling of moral clarity that we lack at other times." Sam Keen
a11n
New member
i'd join it! long live socalism!
C
Cancel5
Guest
Would you share the titles, I love to read this type of stuff. I like to look at both sides of the story.
There were mass graves, and there are mass graves. When you look at the history of Iraq, present and past, you see that they are a people divided and not easily controlled. I didn't like Saddam, but the US has had to use some of his methods in Iraq. It is a shame, their ways are different than our ways.
Dixie - In Memoriam
New member
My suspicion is, you more likely love playing Johnny Cochran and building a criminal defense for these thugs by attempting to discredit whatever I post here. I am familiar with the MoveOn.Org tactics and propaganda, and I have heard and read enough independent accounts of what went on in Iraq, to define it as unequivocal evil.
Here are a few things you can read over, if you are genuinely sincere. (which I doubt.)
The United States, Britain, Europe and the War in Iraq, published in December 2003, by William Shawcross ...very good book, details and chronicles the torture techniques used by the Hussein's as well as the accounts of routine rapes by the deviant sex maniac sons.
Documented eye-witness accounts of the shredder from Ann Clwyd--
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/thunderer/article1120757.ece
Evan Thomas and Christopher Dickey, Newsweek, from the 2002/10/21 issue:
"Both men (Uday is 38, Qusay 36) were born and bred to violence of the most lurid kind. As infants, they were supposedly given disarmed grenades as toys. More reliably, they were said to accompany their father on outings to the torture chamber. ... Saddam has always believed in the symbolic power of mutilation. [Saddam] was aiming at the creation of "a new man" in Iraq, just as Hitler and Stalin had tried to do in Nazi Germany and Soviet Russia. He may well have made his sons into psychopaths. ... Strolling through a park, Uday spotted a young couple. He called out to the young woman, but the pair walked on, pretending not to notice. Affronted, Uday grabbed the woman by the arm and declared, "You're much too good for this simple man." (Her companion was wearing the uniform of an Army captain.) The woman stammered that she had been married only the day before. Uday's guards promptly dragged her to a hotel room, where Uday raped her as the guards watched from the next room. Latif, who says he witnessed this scene, says he heard the woman scream. He went to the balcony and saw her half-naked figure lying in front of the hotel entrance six floors below. Her husband, who cursed Uday, was executed for 'defamation of the president.'"
Iraqi exiles agreed that Uday Hussein, the eldest of five children, personified the government's random brutality. Human rights groups and Iraqi exiles accused him of routinely kidnapping women off the streets, raping and sometimes torturing them, and personally supervising the torture and humiliation of hundreds of prisoners. Such conduct earned him the title "Abu Sarhan," the Arabic term for "father of the wolf."
-- The New York Times, July 23, 2003
"Thousands of people are missing in Iraq, victims of Saddam Hussein's dictatorship, but a more visible legacy are the parts that are missing from people who survived. Missing eyes, ears, toenails and tongues mark those who fell into the hands of Mr. Hussein's powerful security services."
-- The New York Times, April 24, 2003
Farris Salman is one of the last victims of Mr. Hussein's rule. His speech is slurred because he is missing part of his tongue. Black-hooded paramilitary troops, the Fedayeen Saddam, run by Mr. Hussein's eldest son, Uday, pulled it out of his mouth with pliers last month, he said, and sliced it off with a box cutter. They made his family and dozens of his neighbors watch.
"...Salman was blindfolded and bundled into a van. Residents of his neighborhood say the van arrived in the afternoon with an escort of seven trucks carrying more than a hundred black-uniformed fedayeen wearing black masks that only showed their eyes. They rounded up neighbors for what was billed as a rally; Mr. Salman's mother was ordered to bring a picture of Mr. Hussein. Two men held Mr. Salman's arms and head steady, and pointed a gun to his temple. Another man with a video camera recorded the scene. 'I was standing and they told me to stick my tongue out or they would shoot me, and so I did. It was too quick to be painful but there was a lot of blood.' The fedayeen stuffed his mouth with cotton and took him to a local hospital, where he got five stitches, no painkiller and was returned to prison."
-- The New York Times, April 24, 2003
More accounts of the "fun" had by Uday and Qusay Hussein....
http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,1101030602-454453,00.html
Uday Hussein, the eldest son of Iraqi dictator Saddam Hussein, was ready to party. At his first outing in 1998, at the posh Jadriyah Equestrian Club, he used high-powered binoculars to survey the crowd of friends and family from a platform high above the guests. He saw something he liked, recalls his former aide Adib Shabaan, who helped arrange the party. Uday tightened the focus on a pretty 14-year-old girl in a bright yellow dress sitting with her father, a former provincial governor, her mother and her younger brother and sister. ...The rest is too disturbing to detail here, you can read more at the link.
A chef at Baghdad's exclusive Hunting Club recalls a wedding party that Uday crashed in the late 1990s. After Uday left the hall, the bride, a beautiful woman from a prominent family, went missing. "The bodyguards closed all the doors, didn't let anybody out," the chef remembers. "Women were yelling and crying, 'What happened to her?'" The groom knew. "He took a pistol and shot himself," says the chef, placing his forefinger under his chin.
Last October another bride, 18, was dragged, resisting, into a guardhouse on one of Uday's properties, according to a maid who worked there. The maid says she saw a guard rip off the woman's white wedding dress and lock her, crying, in a bathroom. After Uday arrived, the maid heard screaming. Later she was called to clean up. The body of the woman was carried out in a military blanket, she said. There were acid burns on her left shoulder and the left side of her face. The maid found bloodstains on Uday's mattress and clumps of black hair and peeled flesh in the bedroom. A guard told her, "Don't say anything about what you see, or you and your family will be finished."
Have you heard enough yet... there are hundreds of stories like this, from real Iraqi people who were there and witnessed it all first hand.
FUCK THE POLICE
911 EVERY DAY
For every atrocity you can come up with that happened in Iraq I can come up with a thousand in other countries. Atrocities happen everywhere all the time, and it would weaken the US to the breaking point to try and fix all of them. What we did in Iraq, in the end, just ended up killing an assload of people.
Dixie - In Memoriam
New member
We're not talking about other countries, we are talking about Iraq. And I seriously doubt you can do what you claim, Iraq was a literal playground of torture for these monsters, millions of people were effected over the years, multiply that by thousands and you would be hard pressed to find countries with that much population, much less torture and atrocity.
What you are throwing out is deplorable and sickening. It is like saying, we can't prevent all rapes, so let's just let them happen as they may, no need to do anything about it, we'll still have rapes. You are a moron.
FUCK THE POLICE
911 EVERY DAY
I'm not going to invade a sovereign nation because I believe I can affect its rape per capita rate. If I invade a nation to stop one single criminal, I am causing a million atrocities for every one I stop. In a fairyland we would live in a world without atrocities, but violence is never the way to end them.
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Dixie - In Memoriam
New member
We have a moral obligation as decent human beings, to defeat the kind of evil and terror perpetrated on the Iraqi people by the Hussein regime. I don't give a flying fuck about their sovereignty, and neither should you or any other decent and respectable human being. You simplify the situation and minimize what these monsters were doing to their people, and it doesn't speak well for your character or ethics. Would you have sat by and allowed Hitler to just continue incinerating Jews because he was a "sovereign nation?" Undoubtedly so!
You are about as low a piece of human debris as Uday and Qusay, if that is honestly how you feel about it, that's all I can say.
FUCK THE POLICE
911 EVERY DAY
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mahmudiyah_killings
The Qasim family lived in an isolated farm house situated approximately 200 meters[5] away from a traffic checkpoint manned by US soldiers. The soldiers, who noticed Abeer as she worked in the field next to the house,[6] formed a 6-man unit responsible for the traffic checkpoint. According to the neighbors, the accused soldiers had previously entered the farmhouse several times, ostensibly to search it, and had made advances towards Abeer in the days before the actual killing took place. Abeer's brother Mohammed, aged 13, who survived the attack along with his younger brother because they were in school at the time, said he witnessed one of the soldiers stroke Abeer's face during one of their visits to the house, a gesture that had terrified the girl.[7]
Abeer's mother was concerned enough about the soldier's advances to request that Abeer be allowed to spend her nights at the neighbor's house. Abeer’s father did not think a significant danger was imminent, saying "it was no problem and that she was just a small girl."[6] Nevertheless, Abeer started to sleep at her neighbor’s house at nights, which proved to be an ineffective deterrent as the attack took place in broad daylight the day after Abeer spent her first night with neighbors.
According to the affidavit written by the FBI in support of an arrest warrant for Steven Green, the accused had discussed raping the girl in the days preceding the event. On the day in question, five soldiers of the six-man unit responsible for the checkpoint left their posts for the Qasim farmhouse. Four of the soldiers are alleged to have directly participated in the attack, while a fifth (PFC Howard) acted as lookout. A sixth soldier SGT Anthony W. Yribe, is charged with failing to report the attack but is not alleged to have been a direct participant.
The affidavit goes on to state that the soldiers entered the house and ordered Abeer’s father, mother and sister into another room where Steven Green summarily shot all in the head, emerging to say, "I just killed them, all are dead." As the rest of the family was shot in the other room, Abeer was held down to the floor by another soldier. After killing the other family members, Green and at least one other soldier raped Abeer, and then Green shot and killed her.
Based on reports, after the rape the lower part of Abeer’s body, from her stomach down to her feet, was set on fire. The fire eventually spread to the rest of the room and the smoke alerted neighbors who ran to tell Abu Firas Janabi, Abeer’s uncle, that the farmhouse was on fire and that dead bodies could be seen inside the burning building. Janabi and his wife rushed to the farmhouse and doused some of the flames to get inside. Upon witnessing the scene inside, Janabi went to a checkpoint guarded by Iraqi soldiers to report the crime.
The Qasim family lived in an isolated farm house situated approximately 200 meters[5] away from a traffic checkpoint manned by US soldiers. The soldiers, who noticed Abeer as she worked in the field next to the house,[6] formed a 6-man unit responsible for the traffic checkpoint. According to the neighbors, the accused soldiers had previously entered the farmhouse several times, ostensibly to search it, and had made advances towards Abeer in the days before the actual killing took place. Abeer's brother Mohammed, aged 13, who survived the attack along with his younger brother because they were in school at the time, said he witnessed one of the soldiers stroke Abeer's face during one of their visits to the house, a gesture that had terrified the girl.[7]
Abeer's mother was concerned enough about the soldier's advances to request that Abeer be allowed to spend her nights at the neighbor's house. Abeer’s father did not think a significant danger was imminent, saying "it was no problem and that she was just a small girl."[6] Nevertheless, Abeer started to sleep at her neighbor’s house at nights, which proved to be an ineffective deterrent as the attack took place in broad daylight the day after Abeer spent her first night with neighbors.
According to the affidavit written by the FBI in support of an arrest warrant for Steven Green, the accused had discussed raping the girl in the days preceding the event. On the day in question, five soldiers of the six-man unit responsible for the checkpoint left their posts for the Qasim farmhouse. Four of the soldiers are alleged to have directly participated in the attack, while a fifth (PFC Howard) acted as lookout. A sixth soldier SGT Anthony W. Yribe, is charged with failing to report the attack but is not alleged to have been a direct participant.
The affidavit goes on to state that the soldiers entered the house and ordered Abeer’s father, mother and sister into another room where Steven Green summarily shot all in the head, emerging to say, "I just killed them, all are dead." As the rest of the family was shot in the other room, Abeer was held down to the floor by another soldier. After killing the other family members, Green and at least one other soldier raped Abeer, and then Green shot and killed her.
Based on reports, after the rape the lower part of Abeer’s body, from her stomach down to her feet, was set on fire. The fire eventually spread to the rest of the room and the smoke alerted neighbors who ran to tell Abu Firas Janabi, Abeer’s uncle, that the farmhouse was on fire and that dead bodies could be seen inside the burning building. Janabi and his wife rushed to the farmhouse and doused some of the flames to get inside. Upon witnessing the scene inside, Janabi went to a checkpoint guarded by Iraqi soldiers to report the crime.
Dixie - In Memoriam
New member
If what you posted is true (skeptical of that), I hope they fry the mutherfuckers responsible for it. However, one isolated incident doesn't nullify the thousands of rapes and tortures that have took place in Iraq during the reign of Hussein and his sons. Is that what you hoped this would do? ...You need about 200,000 more such incidents before we can draw some kind of viable parallel, you idiot. But nice attempt at defending these scumbuckets, you really do an outstanding job of sticking up for them.
FUCK THE POLICE
911 EVERY DAY
His son raped and killed 200,000 people?
Shit, that almost compares to the hundreds of thousands of Iraqui's our own soldiers have killed. I am clearly not defending them, just pointing out how your attempt to use violence to solve every problem in the world backfires. By invading a country you are causing an atrocity, and you don't seem to even count the deaths that the invasion causes as counting, which is absurd.
Dixie - In Memoriam
New member
Hmmm... funny I don't hear anyone defending the killing of Nazi's in the overthrow of Hitler's regime. Maybe you should write a blog about the countless Nazi deaths from US bombs, when we defeated that sovereign nation? I'm sure you will have some sympathetic ears.
And YES you are defending them, just as you have from the very start. Every time you spout off some of your silly nonsense to defend your anti-war position. We had a legitimate reason to invade Iraq and topple the government, if nothing else, from a human rights standpoint. People like you, who have a political agenda, can't be bothered with human rights, it really doesn't matter one whit to you. It's more important to focus our attention and efforts on giving Waterhead something for nothing, because you are a spoiled little emo kid who thinks the government is your candy store.
FUCK THE POLICE
911 EVERY DAY
Well there's a difference. The only report of a mass killing in Saddams regime was the 100 people killed for rising up against the government in that town. We invaded Hitler because he invaded us, we had no idea he was killing Jews at the time.
Opportunity cost Dixie. If I want to protect human rights there is a lot more I can do with a trillion dollars than invade Iraq.
Dixie - In Memoriam
New member
1. How do you explain literal mountains of skeletons unearthed in mass grave sites around Iraq and literally hundreds of thousands of missing Iraqi's? Go read some of the accounts from the links I posted, and come back to tell me this with a straight face. You are either in denial or uninformed.
2. Hitler never invaded the United States. According your your philosophy, it wouldn't have mattered if we DID know he was killing Jews, it wouldn't have been worth the amount of money and blood we spent to defeat him.
Thank God it's not up to you to protect human rights.
FUCK THE POLICE
911 EVERY DAY
I refuse to read the accounts from the right wing sites that make up such claims that you have posted.
Arguing with you is like arguing with a brick wall Dix.
Dixie - In Memoriam
New member
Newsweek, Time, and the New York Times are right wing sites now? Would you like the links to the articles from Human Rights Watch too? Should I post the pictures of the mass graves in Iraq? It's really hard to refute the thousands upon thousands of dead bodies found so far.
There is no argument here, you are a person in obvious denial of reality. I am just trying to get you to realize it.
I belive the mass graves exist, Ive seen enough to prove that, I am talking about the part about the wood chipper and such.
So why are we not occupying Rowanda and Darfur and Cambodia and many other nations?