Fixing Granny's house

[MAGA MAN]

"92-5/8"
"Q: Why is the length of a precut stud 92-5/8 in.? With the sole plate and two top plates at 1-1/2 in. each, the total wall height is 97-1/8 in.Sep 1, 2002"
https://www.finehomebuilding.com/2002/09/01/do-precut-studs-make-sense

You DON'T want a 8'-3' floor/ceiling height, you want a 8'-1' floor/ceiling height. You want to put 1/2" (or 5/8") sheetrock on the ceiling, then 2 sheets of 4' wide sheetrock on the walls. That gives you an allowance of 1/2" at the bottom. 8'-3" gives you an extra 2 and 1/2". Who wants to cut 2" slices of sheetrock to attach to the wall, who wants to tape and float the extra joint throughout the entire house?

Pouring a concrete slab in sections defeats the purpose of the monolithic slab. Each section will lift or sink individually and cause an uneven floor. You'll have construction/expansion joints here, there, and everywhere. This 'double wall' you're talking about, the existing wall and the 'new interior wall'. The 'new interior wall' will need a solid footing not broken up with 'joints'. Same would go for your load bearing walls, they would need at least an 8" thickened slab that would be continuos with #4 or #5 rebar.

"skid-steer", I guess that is a Bobcat with bucket attached? Yeah, you would have to find someplace that you could open up, especially if this is a raised house like you say it is.

You're basically gutting the entire inside of the house, how great does the outside look for you to try and salvage this piece of shit? Did you look in the attic? Whats that look like?

All Granny really needs is a little Studio Apartment type living space. Is this really for Granny, or for some resale value after Granny checks out? Or, ... are you just drumming up business for yourself?

I have no idea why precuts are that length. For a wall 8'-3" high just use two widths starting from the top, then a 3" width at the bottom that will not need to be finished well since it will be covered by baseboard.

Monolithic is a misnomer. All floor slabs have control joints, largest size without 12'x16', and rectangles should never be more than 1.5 times their width. On commercial jobs we use control and expansion joints. If a slab sinks relative to the next, the soil is unstable, which this is not the case here, again based on the stability of the perimeter footings.

The new perimeter wall will be over the footing overhang. Interior load bearing walls will be over strip footings.

As the OP states, "The brick veneer is perfect...".

The "attic" is a "sleeping attic", complexly finished.

 

[MAGA MAN]

I think you may have got your pants pulled down on this one, DS.

I am aware that LeonThePussy has started another thread about this. The sad little girl has no life and routinely makes shit up. That is why I have her on IA and routinely ban her from my threads.

 

[Jack]

I have no idea why precuts are that length. For a wall 8'-3" high just use two widths starting from the top, then a 3" width at the bottom that will not need to be finished well since it will be covered by baseboard.

Monolithic is a misnomer. All floor slabs have control joints, largest size without 12'x16', and rectangles should never be more than 1.5 times their width. On commercial jobs we use control and expansion joints. If a slab sinks relative to the next, the soil is unstable, which this is not the case here, again based on the stability of the perimeter footings.

The new perimeter wall will be over the footing overhang. Interior load bearing walls will be over strip footings.

As the OP states, "The brick veneer is perfect...".

The "attic" is a "sleeping attic", complexly finished.

Dark Soul: "I have no idea why precuts are that length."
Jack:


Dark Soul: "then a 3" width at the bottom"
Jack: ... who wants to waste their time cutting a 3" strip of sheetrock, ... who wants to get down and crawl along the floor attaching the strip?

Dark Soul: "that will not need to be finished well since it will be covered by baseboard."
Jack: The baseboard may cover the actual joint, but will NOT cover the tapered edge of the sheetrock. The tapered edge (if not floated to match) will be OBVIOUS when painted. If you do that, you've delivered an inferior product.

There's a reason a treated bottom plate, a pre-cut stud, and a double top plate are used, it's efficient. By using an 8' 2x4, you have to CUT EACH ONE to length since they come 1/4" to 1/2" longer than 8' and may not be square.

The more talking you do, the more I'm starting to believe Leon.

 

[MAGA MAN]

Dark Soul: "I have no idea why precuts are that length."
Jack:


Dark Soul: "then a 3" width at the bottom"
Jack: ... who wants to waste their time cutting a 3" strip of sheetrock, ... who wants to get down and crawl along the floor attaching the strip?

Dark Soul: "that will not need to be finished well since it will be covered by baseboard."
Jack: The baseboard may cover the actual joint, but will NOT cover the tapered edge of the sheetrock. The tapered edge (if not floated to match) will be OBVIOUS when painted. If you do that, you've delivered an inferior product.

There's a reason a treated bottom plate, a pre-cut stud, and a double top plate are used, it's efficient. By using an 8' 2x4, you have to CUT EACH ONE to length since they come 1/4" to 1/2" longer than 8' and may not be square.

The more talking you do, the more I'm starting to believe Leon.

The drywaller has the option of ordering 54" widths, or using a taller baseboard.

You're relying more on internet lore than actual experience.

 

[Irish Exit]

This is what happens when there is no steel, like mesh or rebar, in the concrete, it will fracture and then begin to move. Concrete slabs are said to be able to last 500 years. There's usually a 'City Code' that mandates the 'First Floor' (the concrete slab) be a minimum of 18" ABOVE the crown of the road in front of the House so the rain water runs -----------> that way.

I think that particular house had other issues. It was built around 1980 give or take when the whole subdivision went up. It is the only house with a slab. I suspect there is a giant boulder/rock formation under part of it they were trying to cheat around to turn it into a buildable lot as cheaply as possible and as the house settled, part of the slab settled onto rock and part of it didn't which goofed up the load on the slab. I have no proof of this other than it is on a high point and the golf course it backs up to has a lot of random large rockfaces protruding out of the surface in places where one would not naturally want them on a golf course for maintenance reasons, like in the middle of fairways, approaches to greens, and such. Every other house in the subdivision is either built on block foundations or piers.

 

[Jack]

The drywaller has the option of ordering 54" widths, or using a taller baseboard.

You're relying more on internet lore than actual experience.

The Drywaller is in charge of ordering 'baseboard'?, ... that's interesting.
OK. Nice having a back-and-forth with you. Good Luck.

 

[Jack]

I think that particular house had other issues. It was built around 1980 give or take when the whole subdivision went up. It is the only house with a slab. I suspect there is a giant boulder/rock formation under part of it they were trying to cheat around to turn it into a buildable lot as cheaply as possible and as the house settled, part of the slab settled onto rock and part of it didn't which goofed up the load on the slab. I have no proof of this other than it is on a high point and the golf course it backs up to has a lot of random large rockfaces protruding out of the surface in places where one would not naturally want them on a golf course for maintenance reasons, like in the middle of fairways, approaches to greens, and such. Every other house in the subdivision is either built on block foundations or piers.

'Golf Course'? Sounds like an upscale neighborhood, I don't think they would cut corners. (?)
I don't know where this place is but footings usually go down past the frost line and I doubt they would settle much.
But ... I have no answer, maybe you are correct.

 

[MAGA MAN]

The Drywaller is in charge of ordering 'baseboard'?, ... that's interesting.
OK. Nice having a back-and-forth with you. Good Luck.

In small projects its always better to have the subs do as much related work as possible, since it prevents them from causing problems for the next guy. For example, when I hire someone to paint windows, I always add-in cleaning the exterior glass as part of his contract. That prevents an overcharge from the next guy having to scrape off yards of poorly edged paintwork.

 

[Irish Exit]

'Golf Course'? Sounds like an upscale neighborhood, I don't think they would cut corners. (?)
I don't know where this place is but footings usually go down past the frost line and I doubt they would settle much.
But ... I have no answer, maybe you are correct.

Not an upscale neighborhood. Just a middle middle class neighborhood developed by a man who came from a long line of slumlords who was trying to do something more mainstream than yet another set of government subsidized apartments his family was known for slumlording. The golf course itself was originally built mid-century as a no frills golf course/pool for employees of a local factory that no longer exists. It has been upscaled some since it ended up in private hands, but it is still a work in progress....assuming it doesn't go bankrupt and fall to developers as many courses are doing.

 

[Jack]

In small projects its always better to have the subs do as much related work as possible, since it prevents them from causing problems for the next guy. For example, when I hire someone to paint windows, I always add-in cleaning the exterior glass as part of his contract. That prevents an overcharge from the next guy having to scrape off yards of poorly edged paintwork.

'baseboard' usually falls to the Trim Carpenter, not some Rocker or Finisher.

 

[Jack]

Not an upscale neighborhood. Just a middle middle class neighborhood developed by a man who came from a long line of slumlords who was trying to do something more mainstream than yet another set of government subsidized apartments his family was known for slumlording. The golf course itself was originally built mid-century as a no frills golf course/pool for employees of a local factory that no longer exists. It has been upscaled some since it ended up in private hands, but it is still a work in progress....assuming it doesn't go bankrupt and fall to developers as many courses are doing.

'slumlord'. In THAT case, you might be entirely right.
If it helps, think of a 1980s 'Dark Soul' Developer figuring he could build a house on top of a large bolder in the middle of the slab and it would 'balance' the house like some kind of teeter-totter.

 

[MAGA MAN]

'Golf Course'? Sounds like an upscale neighborhood, I don't think they would cut corners. (?)
I don't know where this place is but footings usually go down past the frost line and I doubt they would settle much.
But ... I have no answer, maybe you are correct.

Corners are cut regardless of the cost of the homes, as a general rule. There are also sections of the Residential Code that are wrong, simply. That's why I have so much business.

The frost line in much of The South is enforced by local CEOs at 12". That's not deep enough to achieve the presumptive soil bearing value of 2000 psf, unless you have exceedingly dense soils, DCP count at 16 or more. Most of the Piedmont soils are residual (weathered in place from the parent bedrock) will count in at 7 or so, rarely more than 12, and for alluvial soils (deposited by wind or water) like in the sand hill region the counts are probably lower. The math for this is well established, developed by the late Karl Terzaghi (1883-1963) of Harvard University sometime in the early 20th century.

That's why I always specify a minimum depth of 18"; because the math usually works then. The vast majority of the contractors that I have worked with say that this is "overkill" or that I am "full of shit", then never hire me back. Of course none of these naysayers have gone to engineering school and learned even the basics of soil mechanics, never mind foundation engineering. This is one reason why I have developed such a select client base.

 

[MAGA MAN]

'baseboard' usually falls to the Trim Carpenter, not some Rocker or Finisher.

Perhaps in tract housing jobs, but not in repairs.

 

[Irish Exit]

'slumlord'. In THAT case, you might be entirely right.
If it helps, think of a 1980s 'Dark Soul' Developer figuring he could build a house on top of a large bolder in the middle of the slab and it would 'balance' the house like some kind of teeter-totter.

My house wasn't built by their spec builder thank god. I have had several forever residents tell me my house's builders name and tell me he built really good houses and did them right, usually followed by an "....unlike (so and so) who built that house over there". My across and down one neighbor is always comparing houses which is funnily annoying because he will say things like, "Why did they do this to your house and not to mine. It isn't like it would have cost them that much more to do mine that way?" I am like, "Dude, you do know I wasn't even born when these houses were built don't you?"

 

[MAGA MAN]

My house wasn't built by their spec builder thank god. I have had several forever residents tell me my house's builders name and tell me he built really good houses and did them right, usually followed by an "....unlike (so and so) who built that house over there". My across and down one neighbor is always comparing houses which is funnily annoying because he will say things like, "Why did they do this to your house and not to mine. It isn't like it would have cost them that much more to do mine that way?" I am like, "Dude, you do know I wasn't even born when these houses were built don't you?"

I recently designed repairs on a $1.5 million dollar home where the front concrete slab-on-fill stoop had settled, causing it to drain back to the house and flood the interior crawl space. Since the concrete was still in place during my inspection I had to make assumptions for my design, that it was built correctly and to Code, with masonry up to the top of the exterior slab.

When the repair contractor, my client, demolished the slab he found that it been poured against an OSB panel on top of the foundation wall, an obvious Code violation. He called me for a redesign then asked me: "why would a builder do it that way?"

I laughed and replied "you know."

 

[Jack]

My house wasn't built by their spec builder thank god. I have had several forever residents tell me my house's builders name and tell me he built really good houses and did them right, usually followed by an "....unlike (so and so) who built that house over there". My across and down one neighbor is always comparing houses which is funnily annoying because he will say things like, "Why did they do this to your house and not to mine. It isn't like it would have cost them that much more to do mine that way?" I am like, "Dude, you do know I wasn't even born when these houses were built don't you?"

Buying a house is like a roll of the dice, no one can predict a slab fracture 5 years before it happens.

 

[Irish Exit]

Buying a house is like a roll of the dice, no one can predict a slab fracture 5 years before it happens.

You can by not buying a house with a slab

 

[Jack]

You can by not buying a house with a slab

Slabs:

1. Lasts 500 years.
2. Fairly recently built home, elevation is 18"-24" above crown on road ... positive water runoff.
3. No termite problems.
4. No water damage.
5. Stays level.
6. Underground Plumbing never freezes.

To me, it's like buying a House with a 100 Amp Service vs. the House with a 200 Amp Service.

 

[MAGA MAN]

You can by not buying a house with a slab

If you have a home with a basement, then you have a slab.

 

[MAGA MAN]

I used to say never buy a house built in a crawl space, but a recent Code change includes encapsulation, where the exterior walls are insulated, then a reinforced liner is installed over the dirt, up over the walls and any interior columns. There are no vents and the space is dehumidified. In Southern climates the main level floor is not insulated, and the natural cooling effect of the earth helps to reduce AC costs. Existing homes can be retro-fitted.