Let Risk-Taking Financial Institutions Fail

Darla said:
Ok well, even with the bailout, Americans, regular Americans are going to be hurting over the next year to 18 months at least. I'd like to see changes in the bankruptcy code, extended and INCREASED umemployment benefits so that those losing their jobs have a shot of hanging onto their homes, at least in this bill. You don't want it viewed as a fat cat bailout, then bailout the little guy too, because he is getting fucked over the next couple of years no matter what happens, and we all know it.
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I buy everything with cash now. I owe a bit on a car, and my home, but I own everything for my business (about 75 grand or so worth of stuff--off the top of my head), and really don't need to buy anything for a while. I don't need credit to make money. I don't need credit to pay people who work for me. I will buy a $2,500 tig wleder before the end of the year though with cash, and I should have all I need for a long time. I don't live on debt, and I am not going to be looking for a loan, hopefully for the rest of my life. I never owned a credit card, but took out loans for things in the past and had a 792 credit score when I bought my home. If you don't run on debt---letting them fail will not effect you much. It might even make oppertunities for you. If you live on debt, like F&F did---sucks to be you for trusting socialism.

If you are good at what you do as a small business--you will be fine. I choose not to live on debt--looks like I made a good choice. I win--socialism looses. A real American individual wins--socialism looses. --and I can still pay my employees over $20.00/hr. That of course is not as much as a government employees makes--but it beats most of the private industry in my area by about 10 bucks for a simular job. I am paying people twice what the area considers their worth--because I am a individual that moves away from the masses when I see it. If I fail--I can get back up. When the masses fail (only masses fail with socialism)---I am glad I am not part of it.

The best short advise I heard about 5 years ago--that I wish I heard 20 years before is. "NEVER TAKE OLUT A LOAN FOR ANYTHING THAT IS NOT GOING TO MAKE YOU MONEY!"

Yes---a home usually makes a person money--and a lot of people made a lot of money flipping homes--espically in the CA area. The socialism went rampid with no checks and balances-($300,000 affordable homes for everybody--and we print more money)-the celing came down as predicted many years ago by many people (mostly reupubs if your into that partisan thikng). Socialism (mostly dems) ignored the predictions---and I don't want to bail out socialism--they failed and we have to pay no matter what now!!

How many socialistic/marxists societies have totally collapsed their economy when we were America? You should be able to name a few--and F&F socialism is a sub example of all of them.

Americans will beat this thing--even with irresponsible world trade (which I predict will be changed some fairly soon now) because I have faith in people!---socialism caused this failure---but I will admitt--the republicans (todays republicans who lost real consertative values and went more left--like mdeia nominated McCain) seem more responsible as a whole for irresponsible world trade. We have to make stuff here again---or we will not have a chance of gaining again for any long term.
 
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Darla said:
Onceler, how can you say the world markets are collapsing today, when they dropped less than was expected, and the DOW futures showed it set to open up. Don't get me wrong, I think it will close down. But foriegn markets seemed to react as if this were bad news, but not dire new? Unless I am missing something, which considering this is not my topic, I could be.
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It was the 'you're joking day'... in other words... those markets held off a panic in the hopes that the idiots in DC would see how ignorant they were and would get this done asap.

Our market today is a dead cat bounce. It will likely end down about 500 points again if there are no signs from DC of a fix.

Tiana.... mortgage backed securities are backed by the principal and interest payments of MORTGAGES. The problems with the CDO's is that the idiots didn't keep good records of which mortgages went where. Which is why they are having such a hard time pricing the damn things. This is why they need to be bought up and unwound. It is a mess. Which is why some people who were being foreclosed upon are laughing... because no one can prove who owns their mortgage.
 
theMAJORITY said:
I buy everything with cash now. I owe a bit on a car, and my home, but I own everything for my business, and really don't need to buy anything for a while. I don't need credit to make money. I don't need credit to pay people who work for me. I will buy a $2,500 tig wleder before the end of the year though with cash, and I should have all I need for a long time. I don't live on debt, and I am not going to be looking for a loan, hopefully for the rest of my life. If you don't run on debt---letting them fail will not effect you much. It might even make oppertunities for you. If you live on debt, like F&F did---sucks to be you for trusting socialism.

If you are good at what you do as a small business--you will be fine. I choose not to live on debt--looks like I made a good choice. I win--socialism looses.
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And when no one has jobs to buy your services your business will fail.
 
Darla said:
Ok well, even with the bailout, Americans, regular Americans are going to be hurting over the next year to 18 months at least. I'd like to see changes in the bankruptcy code, extended and INCREASED umemployment benefits so that those losing their jobs have a shot of hanging onto their homes, at least in this bill. You don't want it viewed as a fat cat bailout, then bailout the little guy too, because he is getting fucked over the next couple of years no matter what happens, and we all know it.
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Now that I can get behind 110%
 
Darla said:
Ok well, even with the bailout, Americans, regular Americans are going to be hurting over the next year to 18 months at least. I'd like to see changes in the bankruptcy code, extended and INCREASED umemployment benefits so that those losing their jobs have a shot of hanging onto their homes, at least in this bill. You don't want it viewed as a fat cat bailout, then bailout the little guy too, because he is getting fucked over the next couple of years no matter what happens, and we all know it.
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How about a big fat tax deduction for those of us who payed our bill on time and borrowed a normal fixed mortgage and not some fancy pants gimmick voodoo mortgage so we can live in a mansion when we can really only afford a trailer.
 
Good article T.

This IS a bailout for the rich that invested in risky vehicles. Fuck them! Let them go down. All this fear mongering is being generated for the benefit of a select few.

We can keep credit moving without this bailout.
 
uscitizen said:
Are they still talking about bailing our foreign banks that have a US presence too ?
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That’s an excellent question, and one I have not seen addressed, but I have been wondering about. Is Phil Gramm’s UBS still getting bailed out on the American taxpayer’s dime?
 
Chapdog said:
How about a big fat tax deduction for those of us who payed our bill on time and borrowed a normal fixed mortgage and not some fancy pants gimmick voodoo mortgage so we can live in a mansion when we can really only afford a trailer.
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No.

Next request?
 
Darla said:
Ok well, even with the bailout, Americans, regular Americans are going to be hurting over the next year to 18 months at least. I'd like to see changes in the bankruptcy code, extended and INCREASED umemployment benefits so that those losing their jobs have a shot of hanging onto their homes, at least in this bill. You don't want it viewed as a fat cat bailout, then bailout the little guy too, because he is getting fucked over the next couple of years no matter what happens, and we all know it.
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Unemployment benefits have ALREADY been increasing:
http://www.accessmylibrary.com/coms2/summary_0286-6269304_ITM

And the year before that they ALREADY were extended when Repubs proposed a bill to accelerate tax cuts, they could only get some Dems to sign on by adding on the extending of unemployment benefits. See HR 622 (Roll Call 38) of the 2002 house votes.
 
Does anyone know how much the average taxpayer could get hit with the $700 billion bailout?

My guess is that the 50%+ of us who already have 401K's have already lost as much if not more, and the rest will soon see equivalent losses in terms of lost overtime, benefits, services or even job losses.

$700 billion isn't a penny, but this is one of those pennywise/pound foolish things. I'm absolutely amazed at how many don't seem to understand how intricately the market is linked to their employer & ultimately, to their job.
 
leaningright said:
The dems ought to jump on that and say something like, "See, if we had let Bush tinker with SS in the way he wanted ..."
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So in other words you would be expressing the view that the market will not recover over the next 20 to 30 years. That's a bad thing for everyone.
 
Onceler said:
Does anyone know how much the average taxpayer could get hit with the $700 billion bailout?

My guess is that the 50%+ of us who already have 401K's have already lost as much if not more, and the rest will soon see equivalent losses in terms of lost overtime, benefits, services or even job losses.

$700 billion isn't a penny, but this is one of those pennywise/pound foolish things. I'm absolutely amazed at how many don't seem to understand how intricately the market is linked to their employer & ultimately, to their job.
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Onceler, this is the hold a gun to your head, we’ll kill your kid if you don’t give us everything we want. That’s BS. Bail out the average American too. We are in a recession Onceler, and it’s getting worse, and this is WITH a presumed bailout. I want things for the taxpayer. The guy who is going to lose his job and not get another one in 6 weeks. Extend unemployment, and also, raise the ridiculous amount of the benefits you get. So you can hold onto your housing during and extended bout of unemployment. Dump the R’s off the bill, and craft a bill that will bring on the congressional progressives and we’ll have a better economy for ALL of us because of it. This plan as is isn’t going to work I hate to tell you that Onceler. It’s a goddamned stop gap. We have to insist that the workers are protected from what’s coming too. What is this BS that we surrender the minute we have a gun pointed at us?
 
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