Liberals hate freedom

1: I seriously doubt anyone who must ask permission of their government to do something like travel which people in democratic societies take for granted would consider themselves "free". Unless they had the same prefrontal lobotomy the poster of this submoronic morality play did...

This is why you are a conservative and vote against freedom even though you think the opposite. Consider how 911 restricted our freedoms? Have you traveled outside the US lately, very much a hassle. Don't get me wrong it is necessary but hardly freedom in the sense you define it. And just for jollies try traveling to someplace your so called democratic society deems bad - good luck. Let us know how freedom works for you.

But the point is - re-write:

A child is born of privilege, she has everything including tutors and superior medical care. Her every need is met. She succeeds in life and travels everywhere. Another child, this girl is born into a home where both parents are forced to work long hours. They work in non-union businesses with no benefits, this child gets no medical treatment and tutors are out of the question. The local library which offered her an opportunity to learn is closing (this is happening in Philly right now), her public school is underfunded and poorly maintained. But each lives under the same constitution and each believes in the postulates of that constitution. Are they both free, remember they are children.
 
This is why you are a conservative and vote against freedom even though you think the opposite. Consider how 911 restricted our freedoms? Have you traveled outside the US lately, very much a hassle. Don't get me wrong it is necessary but hardly freedom in the sense you define it. And just for jollies try traveling to someplace your so called democratic society deems bad - good luck. Let us know how freedom works for you.

But the point is - re-write:

A child is born of privilege, she has everything including tutors and superior medical care. Her every need is met. She succeeds in life and travels everywhere. Another child, this girl is born into a home where both parents are forced to work long hours. They work in non-union businesses with no benefits, this child gets no medical treatment and tutors are out of the question. The local library which offered her an opportunity to learn is closing (this is happening in Philly right now), her public school is underfunded and poorly maintained. But each lives under the same constitution and each believes in the postulates of that constitution. Are they both free, remember they are children.

"Forced" by whom? Seriously man, you need to get a grip.
 
Midcan thinks that the airline shouldn't have ownership of the ticket because property is bad. The woman cannot try to badger her way onto someone else's property without getting into trouble. It is not she whose freedom is being encroached upon, but the airline's. Oh well...
 
Midcan thinks that the airline shouldn't have ownership of the ticket because property is bad. The woman cannot try to badger her way onto someone else's property without getting into trouble. It is not she whose freedom is being encroached upon, but the airline's. Oh well...
Yes, she tried to steal a product. She had as much permission as the other to fly, she shouldn't have tried to 'lift a ride.
 
This is why you are a conservative and vote against freedom even though you think the opposite. Consider how 911 restricted our freedoms? Have you traveled outside the US lately, very much a hassle. Don't get me wrong it is necessary but hardly freedom in the sense you define it. And just for jollies try traveling to someplace your so called democratic society deems bad - good luck. Let us know how freedom works for you.

But the point is - re-write:

A child is born of privilege, she has everything including tutors and superior medical care. Her every need is met. She succeeds in life and travels everywhere. Another child, this girl is born into a home where both parents are forced to work long hours. They work in non-union businesses with no benefits, this child gets no medical treatment and tutors are out of the question. The local library which offered her an opportunity to learn is closing (this is happening in Philly right now), her public school is underfunded and poorly maintained. But each lives under the same constitution and each believes in the postulates of that constitution. Are they both free, remember they are children.
Midcan, you are a moron studying to be an idiot.

Why is it every time someone disagrees with the extremism of socialism/marxism (which is VERY apparent where these morality plays come from) they must be conservatives that agree with the utter BS that the current government used 9/11/01 to justify? Violation of the Constitution - no matter WHAT the justification, is an encroachment on personal liberty. Any legislation that increases government authority is an encroachment on liberty. I don't care WHO proposes it or why, if it encroaches on liberty, I am opposed.

As to the “revised” version of your idiot morality plays, how about a third character - which happens to be a TRUE character, specifically a man I know quite well. He grew up in a two room shack (that's two rooms total, not two bedrooms) in a family of 6, including the grandmother. Diet was wild game (poached because they could not afford the price of a hunting license), vegetables from a garden raised on squatted land, and grain gleaned from what the harvesters missed in a nearby wheat field, and what they could get from trading labor and home-made leather goods.

The school had two classrooms, 1-6 (no kindergarten) and 7-12. Very seldom were there enough texts to go around, so they were shared. The high school "science" class was limited to 5 Skilcraft chemistry sets donated by a local rancher. There was no public library within 50 miles. Health care? Forget it.

The man, as a child, worked hard at school from the day he entered, and worked hard at home from the time he was old enough to swing basic chores. They all worked hard, even the grandmother. When he was old enough he hitched rides from school to a cafe/rest stop 30 miles away to work as a gas station attendant. He earned a minimal scholarship to the state university and worked his ass off paying for the rest. He graduated with top honors in nursing and added a masters on top of that, again with top honors. He is now married, has 4 children (all grown and married themselves, plus giving him three grandkids) and has good career as a pediatric nurse instructor. Needless to say, he can travel when and where he wants. (Not that that defines freedom, but it’s to illustrate a point.)

He is my younger brother, and I could not be more proud of him.

I, myself, left behind the conditions of poverty by making a career of the United States Marine Corps.

So don't give me a line of shit about different conditions growing up defining levels of freedom. I lived through far worse than most. I also know a hell of a lot more about how that affects liberty than most. In short, it did not. Poverty has no effect on liberty. But depending on government for assistance from poverty - THAT affects liberty.

We were a free, proud people, while most others we knew were living on the reservation and were a broken, despondent people dependent on government handouts. The reservation families often had more material things than we did because we refused to accept reservation life. But for freedom, we had more of that. There is far more to freedom than the availability of material goods - in fact materialism does not even enter the picture of genuine liberty. Anyone who equates freedom, in part or in whole, to material wealth is a moron. Freedom is quite simply the ability to make one’s own decisions, which in turn includes independence from a government that fucks you up the ass while telling you how good you have it with their "help".
 
LOL The comeback I heard from some ex-Marines (now Airmen) was "yeah, the Marines are a department of the Navy--the men's department!"
Yea, I spent much of 40 years trading insults with Navy. The parts I was not insulting them were spent slogging in the mud where squids dast not travel.
 
BTW: there is no such thing as an EX-Marine, even if they did turn into a wing wiper. The term is FORMER Marine.
 
The marines already have their "few good men". Its the navy corpsmen.

I spent several years trading the same insults and barbs, GoodLuck. Except mine was from the Navy, and my brother-in-law was a Marine.

But the most fun we had insulting a branch of the military was when a little air force jerk thought it would be fun to insult marines. The navy may insult the jarheads, but nobody else gets to do that.
 
Zoomies are in no position to insult any of the other three, they can go after the Coast Guard I guess....

Shoot, even when I was in MASH (Make a Sailor Hurt, or in Orlando it was "Cycling" it is the massive amounts of exercise you all get to do because some idiot forgot a button on his shirt...) wasn't allowed in their "Basic Training" and it lasted all of 6 weeks.
 
Zoomies are in no position to insult any of the other three, they can go after the Coast Guard I guess....

Shoot, even when I was in MASH (Make a Sailor Hurt, or in Orlando it was "Cycling" it is the massive amounts of exercise you all get to do because some idiot forgot a button on his shirt...) wasn't allowed in their "Basic Training" and it lasted all of 6 weeks.

The only reason I like the air force is because they are the only ones who send the officers to the front and keep the enlisted behind them.

Always made more sense to me.
 
Only wing wipers I really got to know were members of SAC. (Marines always are on guard duty where nucs are involved - wonder why that is?) There was one little mechanic (E7) whom I had a goodly amount of respect for. Took crap off of no one, and made it a habit to bitch out flight officers in a loud public voice for the way they handled their planes on the flight line. Could drink the entire base under the table, too.

The rest of them weren't worth wasting a good insult on.
 
Only wing wipers I really got to know were members of SAC. (Marines always are on guard duty where nucs are involved - wonder why that is?) There was one little mechanic (E7) whom I had a goodly amount of respect for. Took crap off of no one, and made it a habit to bitch out flight officers in a loud public voice for the way they handled their planes on the flight line. Could drink the entire base under the table, too.

The rest of them weren't worth wasting a good insult on.

I was in one of the few areas that the Navy guarded their own nukes. But then, the submarine force didn't fit in with the surface fleet that well anyway.
 
Zoomies are in no position to insult any of the other three, they can go after the Coast Guard I guess....

Shoot, even when I was in MASH (Make a Sailor Hurt, or in Orlando it was "Cycling" it is the massive amounts of exercise you all get to do because some idiot forgot a button on his shirt...) wasn't allowed in their "Basic Training" and it lasted all of 6 weeks.

They are changing it to 8.5 weeks now. They want to march around with M16s now instead of just for the week of field training that came in 8 years ago for the current training deal.

Oh, and our dining facilities are better than everyone else's! :tongout:
 
Midcan, you are a moron studying to be an idiot.

Why is it every time someone disagrees with the extremism of socialism/marxism (which is VERY apparent where these morality plays come from) they must be conservatives that agree with the utter BS that the current government used 9/11/01 to justify? Violation of the Constitution - no matter WHAT the justification, is an encroachment on personal liberty. Any legislation that increases government authority is an encroachment on liberty. I don't care WHO proposes it or why, if it encroaches on liberty, I am opposed.

As to the “revised” version of your idiot morality plays, how about a third character - which happens to be a TRUE character, specifically a man I know quite well. He grew up in a two room shack (that's two rooms total, not two bedrooms) in a family of 6, including the grandmother. Diet was wild game (poached because they could not afford the price of a hunting license), vegetables from a garden raised on squatted land, and grain gleaned from what the harvesters missed in a nearby wheat field, and what they could get from trading labor and home-made leather goods.

The school had two classrooms, 1-6 (no kindergarten) and 7-12. Very seldom were there enough texts to go around, so they were shared. The high school "science" class was limited to 5 Skilcraft chemistry sets donated by a local rancher. There was no public library within 50 miles. Health care? Forget it.

The man, as a child, worked hard at school from the day he entered, and worked hard at home from the time he was old enough to swing basic chores. They all worked hard, even the grandmother. When he was old enough he hitched rides from school to a cafe/rest stop 30 miles away to work as a gas station attendant. He earned a minimal scholarship to the state university and worked his ass off paying for the rest. He graduated with top honors in nursing and added a masters on top of that, again with top honors. He is now married, has 4 children (all grown and married themselves, plus giving him three grandkids) and has good career as a pediatric nurse instructor. Needless to say, he can travel when and where he wants. (Not that that defines freedom, but it’s to illustrate a point.)

He is my younger brother, and I could not be more proud of him.

I, myself, left behind the conditions of poverty by making a career of the United States Marine Corps.

So don't give me a line of shit about different conditions growing up defining levels of freedom. I lived through far worse than most. I also know a hell of a lot more about how that affects liberty than most. In short, it did not. Poverty has no effect on liberty. But depending on government for assistance from poverty - THAT affects liberty.

We were a free, proud people, while most others we knew were living on the reservation and were a broken, despondent people dependent on government handouts. The reservation families often had more material things than we did because we refused to accept reservation life. But for freedom, we had more of that. There is far more to freedom than the availability of material goods - in fact materialism does not even enter the picture of genuine liberty. Anyone who equates freedom, in part or in whole, to material wealth is a moron. Freedom is quite simply the ability to make one’s own decisions, which in turn includes independence from a government that fucks you up the ass while telling you how good you have it with their "help".

Oh for Christ's sakes don't make this a "liberal vs conservative" argument. Hell the root word for liberal is liberty.

Let's be clear, no extremist, liberal, conservaitve or other wise wants people to be free and conservatives particularly have a horrible track record where individual liberties are concerned. Their concept of liberty and freedom only applies to themselves. Those who do actually practice a free and independant lifestyle are almost universally condemned by conservatives who don't want freedom for others but demand and insist upon conformity.

or as I simply put it "Conservatives are all for freedom and liberty, untill someone actually practices it."
 
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