Socialism for the Rich

T

Timshel

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Now Bush, Paulson and the Federal Reserve are going to bailout all the bad loans. Bush has, in effect, turned all of these companies into government agencies and destroyed the one real and effective regulation, i.e., failure in the marketplace. Well, at least if you are a huge corporation or bank.

Our prices will go up even more as the dollar is further devalued. Idiot lefties (including McCain) will blame it on greed.

I really can't see why anyone, who claims to support limited government, would bother voting Repub anymore. They are THE big government party. Guns and Butter 24/7. Free market my ass, with the GOP that's just for those not among the super rich. Meanwhile they tax us all to hand massive amounts of welfare to them.

We really need to switch to taxing corporate wealth rather than income. That can reduce the size of these corporations.

Maybe, even more antitrust enforcement is needed. Not for fear of the phantom coercive monopoly. But, because, maybe the next time the government encourages widespread malinvestment there will be fewer of these "too big to fail" corporations.
 
Now Bush, Paulson and the Federal Reserve are going to bailout all the bad loans. Bush has, in effect, turned all of these companies into government agencies and destroyed the one real and effective regulation, i.e., failure in the marketplace.

I agree, it is hypocritical for all those who espouse capitalism to plead for socialism when capitalism's faults become unpalatable.

However, the effects we are feeling are a result of the failures of capitalism and they are unpalatable. It simply isn't that efficient a method of distribution of resources as it is made out to be.
 
Not for fear of the phantom coercive monopoly.

Capitalism's inevitable consequence is monopoly.

Markets saturate, yet business' life force is growth. To grow in a saturated market you must eat up your competitors.

A classic example is the current merger in the UK banking system, HBOS (Halifax Bank of Scotland - two banks already merged) and Lloyds TSB (two banks already merged).

Innovative new banks don't make a showing in the market, not because of banking regulation but because of the dominance of the few huge players. Those few that do tend to be quickly swallowed up and become 'branches' of the huge groups.
 
Small banks like the one I work at will not be getting bailed out. Good thing we didn't leverage like these big investment banks. I guess our only reward is we should stay in buisiness because we wern't as reckless. I guess the reckless banks get to stay in buisiness too. This just shows if your big you don't have to be smart in Americas financial system./
 
AnyOldIron said:
However, the effects we are feeling are a result of the failures of capitalism and they are unpalatable. It simply isn't that efficient a method of distribution of resources as it is made out to be. [/B]
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Are you kidding, you know a system that is better at distributing resources?

Also, do you really think we would be in this mess if it wasn't for GSE's, 1% Funds rate, Community Re-Investment acts, tax breaks to encourage 1st time homeowners, the FHA? Seriously, blaming this on Capitalism when it was nothing close to Capitalism is insane misunderstanding of what Capitalism is.
 
Are you kidding, you know a system that is better at distributing resources?

I prefer the Nordic economic model, which I guess by US standards would be classed as socialistic.

And do I have to provide a better model to be able to point to the flaws in capitalism?

Also, do you really think we would be in this mess if it wasn't for GSE's, 1% Funds rate, Community Re-Investment acts, tax breaks to encourage 1st time homeowners, the FHA? Seriously, blaming this on Capitalism when it was nothing close to Capitalism is insane misunderstanding of what Capitalism is

It is precisely capitalism. Using the 'No True Scotsman' defence won't stand up.

You cannot have your cake and eat it. You cannot claim the accolades when capitalism succeeds and then blame its flaws on other entities.
 
GSE's are precisley Capitalism? Do you understand what they are? I doubt any pro Capitalist would agree with this pre or post "crises". Capitalism has it's excesses and it has it's corrections, this Mortgage crises was a direct result of bad Government policy.
 
Oh no. the bankers and their elite friends would never try to turn our society into a fascist state.

Can we rename the conspiracy theory section to the "The Truth" Secion. OR just move all the threads to current events?
 
AnyOldIron said:
Are you kidding, you know a system that is better at distributing resources?

I prefer the Nordic economic model, which I guess by US standards would be classed as socialistic.

And do I have to provide a better model to be able to point to the flaws in capitalism?

Also, do you really think we would be in this mess if it wasn't for GSE's, 1% Funds rate, Community Re-Investment acts, tax breaks to encourage 1st time homeowners, the FHA? Seriously, blaming this on Capitalism when it was nothing close to Capitalism is insane misunderstanding of what Capitalism is

It is precisely capitalism. Using the 'No True Scotsman' defence won't stand up.

You cannot have your cake and eat it. You cannot claim the accolades when capitalism succeeds and then blame its flaws on other entities.
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Sure they can. Just like they can privatize profits but socialize losses. And still…we have no money to save the 18 thousand Americans who die every year from lack of health care, the thousands more who go bankrupt over medical bills, the thousands again, who suffer with chronic conditions.

They can do whatever they want including breaking out into chants of “It wasn’t me” when their lunacy wreaks havoc and destroys life. This is America. Land of the free to be arrogant and stupid.
 
Darla said:
Sure they can. Just like they can privatize profits but socialize losses. And still…we have no money to save the 18 thousand Americans who die every year from lack of health care, the thousands more who go bankrupt over medical bills, the thousands again, who suffer with chronic conditions.
.
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That's Republican and Democrats and Buisiness men who use them to pursue their interest. It's not Free Marketers, or Austrian Economists ect. I'd prefer to socialize healthcare before I'd want to socialize the banking system. We decided to socialize the Housing Market with GSE's and bad regulation and we have this current mess.
 
AnyOldIron said:
I agree, it is hypocritical for all those who espouse capitalism to plead for socialism when capitalism's faults become unpalatable.
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Failure in the marketplace is not unpalatable. It's a good thing. See Schumpeter.

And these companies would not be this big without socialism or at least a poorly chosen method of taxation.
 
RStringfield said:
Failure in the marketplace is not unpalatable. It's a good thing. See Schumpeter.

And these companies would not be this big without socialism or at least a poorly chosen method of taxation.
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In theory, yes, failure weeds out and creates new opportunity. But in reality, the richest people game the system so they never fail. There is no actual free market society. We have varying degrees of fascism.

Our fiat currency system alone makes our nation essentially fascist.
 
I doubt String supports our current Monetary System. Plus Creative Destuction has been proven over and over and over again throughout history.
 
Obfuscate said:
I doubt String supports our current Monetary System. Plus Creative Destuction has been proven over and over and over again throughout history.
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Let's ask him. String, do you support creating money out of thin air?


Since fiat currency, companies can be declare too big to fail and bailed out with new money, causing massive inflation for everyone else. The cycle of creative destruction has ended, regardless of history. We are fascist now. A self selected permanent regime has seized control.
 
I have made my opposition to fiat currency quite clear and I have even answered this question from you before. It's getting tired nAHZi.
 
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