The Original 1%--When Was That Golden Age of Liberty and Democracy?

Dantès

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The Original 1%--The Myth of the Golden Age

We have long been led to believe that the people of the country, the so-called founders were of a different breed and that the country once experienced a gold en age when there was a leveling of some sort and there was little difference betweent eh rich and poor and that what we are seeing here with the huge gap between the rich and poor today is something new and that we are somehow supposed to remember that golden age when there was no such thing in this country as the rich and the poor. When I ask repeatedly here when was that golden age I seldom get even a guess. Yet, a careful or perhaps even cursory review of this country’s history seldom reveals any period when the class struggle, and the wealth gap between the rich and the poor that sustains it, did not exist.

During the waning years of John Adams’ administration the rhetoric between the rich and the poor heated up. One Federalist wrote that; “If some means were not adopted to prevent the indiscriminate admission of wild Irishmen and others to the right of suffrage, there will soon be an end to liberty and property.” Of course, such rhetoric always prompts the question: whose liberty and whose property?

One doesn’t have to look far to discover the answer to this question. This quotation—like the one above—comes from The History of The Labor Movement in The United States, Vol. 1: From Colonial Times to the Founding of the American Federation of Labor (1947) by Philip S. Foner, who in his career produced an incredible list of works on labor and African American history. The following quotation comes from a pamphlet printed and posted by David Brown who in November 1798, led a group that protested the concentration of wealth and ownership of property in the hands of a few. As Foner writes Brown was an “itinerant mechanic” living in Massachusetts, who the Federalists of the day named the “Wandering Apostle of Sedition” for his opinions on the disparity and wealth concentration, which included this statement:


Here is the 1,000 out of 5,000,000 that receive all the benefits of public property and all the rest no share in it. Indeed all our administration is as fast approaching to the Lords and Commons as possible—that a few men should possess the whole Country and the rest be tenants to the others. There [always] has been an actual struggle between the labouring part of the community and those lazy rascals that have invented every means that the Devil has put into their heads to destroy the labouring part of the community….I never knew a Government supported long after the confidence of the people was lost, for the people are the Government. (brackets and ellipses in original)


David Brown was given 18 months in prison and fined $400 under the Alien and Sedition Acts for erectying a liberty pole in Dedham, Massachusetts on which he posted a leaflet that contained this statement and these sentiments. So when was this Golden Age of equality and liberty, please point to it! Evidently sometime before 1798! It must have been a doozy because it certainly didn’t last long, did it?


There are no bans on this thread because I encourage all modern day Tories, rascals and other defenders of the rich and wealth in this country to step forward and identify yourselves.
 
The Original 1%--The Myth of the Golden Age

We have long been led to believe that the people of the country, the so-called founders were of a different breed and that the country once experienced a gold en age when there was a leveling of some sort and there was little difference betweent eh rich and poor and that what we are seeing here with the huge gap between the rich and poor today is something new and that we are somehow supposed to remember that golden age when there was no such thing in this country as the rich and the poor. When I ask repeatedly here when was that golden age I seldom get even a guess. Yet, a careful or perhaps even cursory review of this country’s history seldom reveals any period when the class struggle, and the wealth gap between the rich and the poor that sustains it, did not exist.

During the waning years of John Adams’ administration the rhetoric between the rich and the poor heated up. One Federalist wrote that; “If some means were not adopted to prevent the indiscriminate admission of wild Irishmen and others to the right of suffrage, there will soon be an end to liberty and property.” Of course, such rhetoric always prompts the question: whose liberty and whose property?

One doesn’t have to look far to discover the answer to this question. This quotation—like the one above—comes from The History of The Labor Movement in The United States, Vol. 1: From Colonial Times to the Founding of the American Federation of Labor (1947) by Philip S. Foner, who in his career produced an incredible list of works on labor and African American history. The following quotation comes from a pamphlet printed and posted by David Brown who in November 1798, led a group that protested the concentration of wealth and ownership of property in the hands of a few. As Foner writes Brown was an “itinerant mechanic” living in Massachusetts, who the Federalists of the day named the “Wandering Apostle of Sedition” for his opinions on the disparity and wealth concentration, which included this statement:


Here is the 1,000 out of 5,000,000 that receive all the benefits of public property and all the rest no share in it. Indeed all our administration is as fast approaching to the Lords and Commons as possible—that a few men should possess the whole Country and the rest be tenants to the others. There [always] has been an actual struggle between the labouring part of the community and those lazy rascals that have invented every means that the Devil has put into their heads to destroy the labouring part of the community….I never knew a Government supported long after the confidence of the people was lost, for the people are the Government. (brackets and ellipses in original)


David Brown was given 18 months in prison and fined $400 under the Alien and Sedition Acts for erectying a liberty pole in Dedham, Massachusetts on which he posted a leaflet that contained this statement and these sentiments. So when was this Golden Age of equality and liberty, please point to it! Evidently sometime before 1798! It must have been a doozy because it certainly didn’t last long, did it?


There are no bans on this thread because I encourage all modern day Tories, rascals and other defenders of the rich and wealth in this country to step forward and identify yourselves.

Correct me if you believe I’m wrong, but didn’t Thomas Jefferson and the Congress therewith repeal the Tory Adams Alien & Sedation Act? And isn’t the gap between the rich and poor today because of the BIG government’s crony capitalist collaboration with BIG corporate Wall Street? And please tell us where in America we can find the poor starving in the streets.

“Capitalism is the unequal sharing of the blessings and socialism is the equal sharing of the misery.” (Sr. Winston Churchill)
 
Isn't the "Golden Age Of Liberty And Democracy" now and for the last 5 years under the direction of the Messiah occupying our White House? After all he had Congress all to himself for 2 of those 5 years, list his accomplishments please. Oh! That's right the ACA and doubling down on the food stamp society, huh?
 
Correct me if you believe I’m wrong, but didn’t Thomas Jefferson and the Congress therewith repeal the Tory Adams Alien & Sedation Act? And isn’t the gap between the rich and poor today because of the BIG government’s crony capitalist collaboration with BIG corporate Wall Street? And please tell us where in America we can find the poor starving in the streets.

“Capitalism is the unequal sharing of the blessings and socialism is the equal sharing of the misery.” (Sr. Winston Churchill)

I think you have missed the whole point. And your post is historically inaccurate: It was four separate acts thus the phrase "Alien and Sedition Acts"! And repealing those acts did not change the wealth disparity one single bit. And my comment wasn't about the Alien and Sedition Acts but about wealth disparity thus the title. You will notice if you check that the phrase "Alien and Sedition Acts" doesn't appear in the title! And yes, I know what Jefferson did, he also commuted all the sentences of those imprisoned under the acts, but this too did not change the wealth disparity! But You know that. This is just more bullshit right wing, misdirection and diversion.
 
The Original 1%--The Myth of the Golden Age

We have long been led to believe that the people of the country, the so-called founders were of a different breed and that the country once experienced a gold en age when there was a leveling of some sort and there was little difference betweent eh rich and poor

I reject your premise which makes the rest of your post irrelevant. Where were you led to believe this? I was never led to believe this. I don't consider myself a "defender" of the rich. I defend free markets, property rights and freedom.
 
I think you have missed the whole point.

Oh! But I didn’t miss the point one smidgen. The point of course is the tired old leftist neo-commie tactic of ”CLASS WARFARE’ divide and conquer.

And your post is historically inaccurate: It was four separate acts thus the phrase "Alien and Sedition Acts"! And repealing those acts did not change the wealth disparity one single bit.

Funny though isn’t it how America became the world’s largest economic power with a middleclass standard of living the envy of the globe, considering how the commies and neo-commies have preached your preposterous “divide and conquer bullshit” endlessly since Marx had his first wet dream, huh?

And my comment wasn't about the Alien and Sedition Acts but about wealth disparity thus the title. You will notice if you check that the phrase "Alien and Sedition Acts" doesn't appear in the title! And yes, I know what Jefferson did, he also commuted all the sentences of those imprisoned under the acts, but this too did not change the wealth disparity! But You know that. This is just more bullshit right wing, misdirection and diversion.

“Wealth Disparity” in America has only two instigators, Crony Capitalist Government/Wall Street conspiracy and a nation full to the rim with lazy bastards and high-school dropouts who’s incentive to work and exhibit some amount of personal responsibility has been eradicated by government bribery buyouts of their votes with socialist programs, cheered on by the neo-commie left.

Again, where in America can we find the poor starving in the streets? Last I noticed most of the poor in America had boom-boxes, color TVs, automobiles, food stamps, welfare checks and subsidized housing, courtesy of the government’s extortion of hardworking American middleclass taxpayers.
 
The Original 1%--The Myth of the Golden Age

We have long been led to believe that the people of the country, the so-called founders were of a different breed and that the country once experienced a gold en age when there was a leveling of some sort and there was little difference betweent eh rich and poor and that what we are seeing here with the huge gap between the rich and poor today is something new and that we are somehow supposed to remember that golden age when there was no such thing in this country as the rich and the poor. When I ask repeatedly here when was that golden age I seldom get even a guess. Yet, a careful or perhaps even cursory review of this country’s history seldom reveals any period when the class struggle, and the wealth gap between the rich and the poor that sustains it, did not exist.

During the waning years of John Adams’ administration the rhetoric between the rich and the poor heated up. One Federalist wrote that; “If some means were not adopted to prevent the indiscriminate admission of wild Irishmen and others to the right of suffrage, there will soon be an end to liberty and property.” Of course, such rhetoric always prompts the question: whose liberty and whose property?

One doesn’t have to look far to discover the answer to this question. This quotation—like the one above—comes from The History of The Labor Movement in The United States, Vol. 1: From Colonial Times to the Founding of the American Federation of Labor (1947) by Philip S. Foner, who in his career produced an incredible list of works on labor and African American history. The following quotation comes from a pamphlet printed and posted by David Brown who in November 1798, led a group that protested the concentration of wealth and ownership of property in the hands of a few. As Foner writes Brown was an “itinerant mechanic” living in Massachusetts, who the Federalists of the day named the “Wandering Apostle of Sedition” for his opinions on the disparity and wealth concentration, which included this statement:


Here is the 1,000 out of 5,000,000 that receive all the benefits of public property and all the rest no share in it. Indeed all our administration is as fast approaching to the Lords and Commons as possible—that a few men should possess the whole Country and the rest be tenants to the others. There [always] has been an actual struggle between the labouring part of the community and those lazy rascals that have invented every means that the Devil has put into their heads to destroy the labouring part of the community….I never knew a Government supported long after the confidence of the people was lost, for the people are the Government. (brackets and ellipses in original)


David Brown was given 18 months in prison and fined $400 under the Alien and Sedition Acts for erectying a liberty pole in Dedham, Massachusetts on which he posted a leaflet that contained this statement and these sentiments. So when was this Golden Age of equality and liberty, please point to it! Evidently sometime before 1798! It must have been a doozy because it certainly didn’t last long, did it?


There are no bans on this thread because I encourage all modern day Tories, rascals and other defenders of the rich and wealth in this country to step forward and identify yourselves.

A great subject!
 
I think you have missed the whole point. And your post is historically inaccurate: It was four separate acts thus the phrase "Alien and Sedition Acts"! And repealing those acts did not change the wealth disparity one single bit. And my comment wasn't about the Alien and Sedition Acts but about wealth disparity thus the title. You will notice if you check that the phrase "Alien and Sedition Acts" doesn't appear in the title! And yes, I know what Jefferson did, he also commuted all the sentences of those imprisoned under the acts, but this too did not change the wealth disparity! But You know that. This is just more bullshit right wing, misdirection and diversion.

The reason the poor aren't starving in the streets, Classic Liberal, at a greater rate, because there are those that are currently food challenged, is because of the "social" programs that help to feed them.

The Republicans in Congress are trying to do away with those programs, so, maybe we will have a lot more starving in the streets for you in the future.

Sorry, talking around you, Dante's, to Classic Liberal.
 
Our middle class is rated #27, we aren't #1.

We like to be #1, you would think this would be something worthwhile to obtain.
 
Wealth disparity; one of the many painfully stupid arguments in the leftists arsenal.

For 50 years dunces on the left waged their war on poverty and adjusting these gross inequities fabricated from the economic stupidity the left loves to wallow in. Twenty Trillion dollars and fifty years later there are more than 111 thousand MORE in poverty than when their war began, AND, we still hear their shrill cries that there is higher inequity than ever.

Their politicians ruled the Congress for nearly all those fifty years as well. Constantly manufacturing societal crises after societal crises demanding ever greater amounts of the Federal budget to right these inequities while declaring all who opposed them as uncaring bigots.

Here we are, fifty plus years later looking at the incredible failure of these Marxist class envy rants facing yet a renewed demand for....higher taxes. To the dunces on the left ALL of societies inequities and dispair can be solved; but only if we elect arrogant unintelligent leftist intellects and hand over ever greater amounts of our hard earned wealth.

It is a stupid and repugnant ideology that ignores the failures of its past and continues to survive well beyond its shelf life by denigrating those who refuse to go along with it as uncaring, selfish, racist bigots.

It is also an ignorant ideology in that it's wealth equity and income disparity disinformation campaign also requires one to ignorantly believe that economies are finite; and therefore, if some earn a larger piece of the economic pie, someone else must have gotten less.

Here liberals are, decades later supposedly better educated than their parents and grand parents; yet still uttering such painful and stupid memes thinking that making themselves feel better by declaring they care more than anyone else on the planet, they can solve the worlds problems by ignoring their realities.

It really is a dunces ideology that only the most stupid among us can continue to believe in.
 
Wealth disparity; one of the many painfully stupid arguments in the leftists arsenal.

When someone starts with the insane notion that everyone must or should be blessed with the same amount of wealth, all you can
do is walk away from them, it is of no use to argue or debate....like 'income disparity', which is an equally insane idea that it should be or can be a
righteous goal in any society....the 'game' of life, need only be played on an equal playing field with rules obeyed and enforced with equal force on all participants....
That is the best we can ask for in society....

That should be the goal of every citizen....equal treatment under the laws....and that is the problem we must deal with.....that is our fight.
There is no one side that is the enemy, no one side that is only to blame. Corruption is not any more or less prevalent in one political
party than it is in the other...that is a lesson that has yet to be learned by just about everyone....
 
Wealth disparity; one of the many painfully stupid arguments in the leftists arsenal.

For 50 years dunces on the left waged their war on poverty and adjusting these gross inequities fabricated from the economic stupidity the left loves to wallow in. Twenty Trillion dollars and fifty years later there are more than 111 thousand MORE in poverty than when their war began, AND, we still hear their shrill cries that there is higher inequity than ever.

Their politicians ruled the Congress for nearly all those fifty years as well. Constantly manufacturing societal crises after societal crises demanding ever greater amounts of the Federal budget to right these inequities while declaring all who opposed them as uncaring bigots.

Here we are, fifty plus years later looking at the incredible failure of these Marxist class envy rants facing yet a renewed demand for....higher taxes. To the dunces on the left ALL of societies inequities and dispair can be solved; but only if we elect arrogant unintelligent leftist intellects and hand over ever greater amounts of our hard earned wealth.

It is a stupid and repugnant ideology that ignores the failures of its past and continues to survive well beyond its shelf life by denigrating those who refuse to go along with it as uncaring, selfish, racist bigots.

It is also an ignorant ideology in that it's wealth equity and income disparity disinformation campaign also requires one to ignorantly believe that economies are finite; and therefore, if some earn a larger piece of the economic pie, someone else must have gotten less.

Here liberals are, decades later supposedly better educated than their parents and grand parents; yet still uttering such painful and stupid memes thinking that making themselves feel better by declaring they care more than anyone else on the planet, they can solve the worlds problems by ignoring their realities.

It really is a dunces ideology that only the most stupid among us can continue to believe in.

This tire argument again? How much has the population increased in the last 50 years? How much worse would the lot of the poor be if not for the Great Society?
 
Our middle class is rated #27, we aren't #1.

We like to be #1, you would think this would be something worthwhile to obtain.
So tell me, please, how taxing the shit out of the Left's idea of "rich" will get our middle class to #1?
 
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When someone starts with the insane notion that everyone must or should be blessed with the same amount of wealth, all you can
do is walk away from them, it is of no use to argue or debate....like 'income disparity', which is an equally insane idea that it should be or can be a
righteous goal in any society....the 'game' of life, need only be played on an equal playing field with rules obeyed and enforced with equal force on all participants....
That is the best we can ask for in society....

That should be the goal of every citizen....equal treatment under the laws....and that is the problem we must deal with.....that is our fight.
There is no one side that is the enemy, no one side that is only to blame. Corruption is not any more or less prevalent in one political
party than it is in the other...that is a lesson that has yet to be learned by just about everyone....

First it's "income disparity" and then it will be "housing disparity", "vehicle disparity", "clothing disparity", "vacation disparity", etc., etc., etc.
 
This tire argument again? How much has the population increased in the last 50 years? How much worse would the lot of the poor be if not for the Great Society?

You mean by "worse" them having to get a fucking job instead of sucking the government tit that provides their "disincentive" for anything resembling "personal responsibility?"
 
First it's "income disparity" and then it will be "housing disparity", "vehicle disparity", "clothing disparity", "vacation disparity", etc., etc., etc.

Whatever it takes for the neo-commie left to buy the vote. It's the perfect bribery system and the only thing politically they have going for them.
 
You mean by "worse" them having to get a fucking job instead of sucking the government tit that provides their "disincentive" for anything resembling "personal responsibility?"

You do realize that "benefits" are not nearly enough and that those receiving them would much rather have a decent job, right?
That there is a 5 year lifetime cap on welfare benefits?
That foodstamps don't provide close to enough food to survive on?
That since Clinton, welfare is actually workfare, and that one MUST work to continue receiving benefits?
That corporate welfare far exceeds personal welfare, by almost double (and is a complete waste of taxpayer money, since it feeds no one, prevents no suffering)?

That personal responsibility has become so identifiable a cliche as to immediately indicate your ignorance?

That you *might* even have *some* validity were there sufficient jobs in this country?
 
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