There is no First Amendment right to overturn an election

Guno צְבִי

We fight, We win
Shortly after special counsel Jack Smith unveiled four new criminal charges against former president Donald Trump — all arising out of Trump’s failed efforts to overturn his defeat in the 2020 election — one of Trump’s lawyers revealed one of the legal arguments he plans to use to defend the former president.


“This is an attack on free speech and political advocacy,” Trump attorney John Lauro told CNN Tuesday evening. In a separate appearance on Fox News, Lauro claimed that Trump is being prosecuted for “what he believed in and the policies and the political speech that he carried out as president.”

Lauro, in other words, appears to be laying the groundwork for an audacious First Amendment defense. His argument appears to be that, even if Smith proves all the facts laid out in the recent indictment — which alleges that Trump pressured officials throughout the federal and state governments to change vote counts, appoint fake members of the Electoral College, and otherwise tamper with the 2020 election’s results — Trump’s actions were all political speech protected by the First Amendment.

There are at least two reasons Trump’s alleged actions are not protected speech. One is that Smith repeatedly accuses Trump of pressuring other government officials to commit criminal acts of election fraud, and it is well established that soliciting another individual to commit a crime is not protected by the First Amendment. As the Supreme Court held in United States v. Williams (2008), “offers to engage in illegal transactions are categorically excluded from First Amendment protection.”

Trump, for example, may not pressure a state elections official to “find” fraudulent votes that will change the electoral result in that state, for the same reason that he could not legally tell a hit man, “I will give you $50,000 if you kill my wife.” In both cases, Trump is engaged in speech. But the fact that this speech solicits another person to commit a specific crime generally removes it from the First Amendment’s protections.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/poli...p?cvid=75244f451df64538b6e9c4371e904d00&ei=16
 
The problem here with the charges Smith has filed is that he has to prove that Trump pressured officials and organized fake electors.

None of which he can do.

This is why these charges are bogus.

Who knows, maybe Smith is hiding some secret informant or something or has some audio on tape of Trump doing it.

If not the charges will never stand in court.
 
The problem here with the charges Smith has filed is that he has to prove that Trump pressured officials and organized fake electors.

None of which he can do.

This is why these charges are bogus.

Who knows, maybe Smith is hiding some secret informant or something or has some audio on tape of Trump doing it.

If not the charges will never stand in court.
even more, they have to prove he lied

If being an idiot were illegal, the democratic base would be decimated. He didn't lie, he just surrounds himself with yes men because he is a narcissist
 
even more, they have to prove he lied

If being an idiot were illegal, the democratic base would be decimated. He didn't lie, he just surrounds himself with yes men because he is a narcissist

Even if Trump gets an unsympathetic jury and they do find him guilty it will be overturned on appeals.

Even the charges coming from Georgia where Trump said to them to find votes can be argued away.

They would have to prove he told them to find them illegally and he never did and that is by far their strongest case and it's not that strong.

They would also need to prove that Trump somehow threatened them with retaliation which he never did.

None of these charges against Trump are going to hold up in a court of law.
 
Shortly after special counsel Jack Smith unveiled four new criminal charges against former president Donald Trump — all arising out of Trump’s failed efforts to overturn his defeat in the 2020 election — one of Trump’s lawyers revealed one of the legal arguments he plans to use to defend the former president.


“This is an attack on free speech and political advocacy,” Trump attorney John Lauro told CNN Tuesday evening. In a separate appearance on Fox News, Lauro claimed that Trump is being prosecuted for “what he believed in and the policies and the political speech that he carried out as president.”

Lauro, in other words, appears to be laying the groundwork for an audacious First Amendment defense. His argument appears to be that, even if Smith proves all the facts laid out in the recent indictment — which alleges that Trump pressured officials throughout the federal and state governments to change vote counts, appoint fake members of the Electoral College, and otherwise tamper with the 2020 election’s results — Trump’s actions were all political speech protected by the First Amendment.

There are at least two reasons Trump’s alleged actions are not protected speech. One is that Smith repeatedly accuses Trump of pressuring other government officials to commit criminal acts of election fraud, and it is well established that soliciting another individual to commit a crime is not protected by the First Amendment. As the Supreme Court held in United States v. Williams (2008), “offers to engage in illegal transactions are categorically excluded from First Amendment protection.”

Trump, for example, may not pressure a state elections official to “find” fraudulent votes that will change the electoral result in that state, for the same reason that he could not legally tell a hit man, “I will give you $50,000 if you kill my wife.” In both cases, Trump is engaged in speech. But the fact that this speech solicits another person to commit a specific crime generally removes it from the First Amendment’s protections.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/poli...p?cvid=75244f451df64538b6e9c4371e904d00&ei=16

Jack Smith is throwing spaghetti at the walls to see if anything sticks.
 
Low IQ boy

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The problem here with the charges Smith has filed is that he has to prove that Trump pressured officials and organized fake electors.

None of which he can do.

This is why these charges are bogus.

Who knows, maybe Smith is hiding some secret informant or something or has some audio on tape of Trump doing it.

If not the charges will never stand in court.

The officials testified to it. No informants are needed. Pence is coming clean too. Trump did his crimes on the phone and repeated them at rallies. No secret info is required when you brazenly commit crimes in public and brag about them. His ex-lawyer ,Ty Cobb said openly about what he was told to do and what Trump did. The charges are absolutely sure things.
 
The officials testified to it. No informants are needed. Pence is coming clean too. Trump did his crimes on the phone and repeated them at rallies. No secret info is required when you brazenly commit crimes in public and brag about them. His ex-lawyer ,Ty Cobb said openly about what he was told to do and what Trump did. The charges are absolutely sure things.

And what illegal activity did Trump tell Cobb to do exactly?

What illegal activity did Trump tell Pence to do?
 
The problem here with the charges Smith has filed is that he has to prove that Trump pressured officials and organized fake electors.

None of which he can do.

This is why these charges are bogus.

Who knows, maybe Smith is hiding some secret informant or something or has some audio on tape of Trump doing it.

If not the charges will never stand in court.

No shit Sherlock



You must have never admitted exactly what the evidence shows


Trump is totally fucked


He told Pense he was too honest when pense refused the fake electors plan


Pense told him it was not legal


Trump merely replied


You are too honest



That is the testimony of Vice Presidents testimony under oath


Every fucking witness to be called in this case are top tier republicans


The evidence mainly comes from their phones, texts, emails and personal testimony



Trump is utterly fucked



He’s going to die in prison unless he dies before the cell door clangs shut
 
No shit Sherlock



You must have never admitted exactly what the evidence shows


Trump is totally fucked


He told Pense he was too honest when pense refused the fake electors plan


Pense told him it was not legal


Trump merely replied


You are too honest



That is the testimony of Vice Presidents testimony under oath


Every fucking witness to be called in this case are top tier republicans


The evidence mainly comes from their phones, texts, emails and personal testimony



Trump is utterly fucked



He’s going to die in prison unless he dies before the cell door clangs shut

Telling someone they are too hones is not illegal.

If it is can you cite that law please.

Remember that Trump isn't going to a court of public opinion, you actually have to find real laws he violated to convict him.

That is Smith's problem, he doesn't have any.
 
The problem here with the charges Smith has filed is that he has to prove that Trump pressured officials and organized fake electors.

None of which he can do.

This is why these charges are bogus.

Who knows, maybe Smith is hiding some secret informant or something or has some audio on tape of Trump doing it.

If not the charges will never stand in court.
Why do you believe he can’t do it? You don’t believe he thought about what he can prove before getting the indictments?

You do know most of the evidence is yet to be disclosed. Why do you assume he can’t prove what he alleges?
 
The problem here with the charges Smith has filed is that he has to prove that Trump pressured officials and organized fake electors.

None of which he can do.

This is why these charges are bogus.

Who knows, maybe Smith is hiding some secret informant or something or has some audio on tape of Trump doing it.

If not the charges will never stand in court.

Informed Americans know that experienced prosecutors don't press charges unless they know they can win. After 3 years of investigation, I'm betting that Jack has all of his ducks in a row. LOL
 
Shortly after special counsel Jack Smith unveiled four new criminal charges against former president Donald Trump — all arising out of Trump’s failed efforts to overturn his defeat in the 2020 election — one of Trump’s lawyers revealed one of the legal arguments he plans to use to defend the former president.


“This is an attack on free speech and political advocacy,” Trump attorney John Lauro told CNN Tuesday evening. In a separate appearance on Fox News, Lauro claimed that Trump is being prosecuted for “what he believed in and the policies and the political speech that he carried out as president.”

Lauro, in other words, appears to be laying the groundwork for an audacious First Amendment defense. His argument appears to be that, even if Smith proves all the facts laid out in the recent indictment — which alleges that Trump pressured officials throughout the federal and state governments to change vote counts, appoint fake members of the Electoral College, and otherwise tamper with the 2020 election’s results — Trump’s actions were all political speech protected by the First Amendment.

There are at least two reasons Trump’s alleged actions are not protected speech. One is that Smith repeatedly accuses Trump of pressuring other government officials to commit criminal acts of election fraud, and it is well established that soliciting another individual to commit a crime is not protected by the First Amendment. As the Supreme Court held in United States v. Williams (2008), “offers to engage in illegal transactions are categorically excluded from First Amendment protection.”

Trump, for example, may not pressure a state elections official to “find” fraudulent votes that will change the electoral result in that state, for the same reason that he could not legally tell a hit man, “I will give you $50,000 if you kill my wife.” In both cases, Trump is engaged in speech. But the fact that this speech solicits another person to commit a specific crime generally removes it from the First Amendment’s protections.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/poli...p?cvid=75244f451df64538b6e9c4371e904d00&ei=16

I'm looking forward to the trial. Trump's lawyers will claim First Amendment but 1) Trump won't take the stand and 2) any depositions will be fill will him pleading the Fifth Amendment, not the First.

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/trump-deposed-ny-ag-civil-probe-business-practices-rcna42355
Trump invokes Fifth Amendment nearly 450 times in N.Y. AG’s civil probe of his business practices
An attorney for Trump said the former president answered only one question, about his name, during the four-hour deposition.
 
Informed Americans know that experienced prosecutors don't press charges unless they know they can win. After 3 years of investigation, I'm betting that Jack has all of his ducks in a row. LOL

Experienced prosecutors lose all the time, what are you talking about?
 
Why do you believe he can’t do it? You don’t believe he thought about what he can prove before getting the indictments?

You do know most of the evidence is yet to be disclosed. Why do you assume he can’t prove what he alleges?

Because it's for political show.

What proof has he been sitting on for three years and why weren't charges filed earlier instead of when the election is coming up?

He was more than likely forced into bringing charges and prosecutors often bring charges they know they can't prove.

I've had it done to me.

Plus he is getting paid lots of money and is getting famous, more than enough reason to file whatever he can.
 
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