The 1% embraces their inner Gordon Gekko

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Darla said:
Listen up dummy - it was a joke equating right wingers with animals.

If you need your daily fix of bestiality porn you hit the wrong bookmark perv.
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Of course.....but the rest of his post was spot on the mark....
 
Darla said:
Is it a centrist position to cut Medicare, Medicaid, raise the retirement age on SS (and possibly other changes as well)?

How do we judge that? I see that as right of center.
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I think it's right of center, too. But compare raising the retirement age (which I think is insane, by the way) to privatization. Compare cutting Medicare (which I haven't really seen suggested by any Democrat of note, but I could be wrong) to turning it into a voucher program for seniors to buy insurance in the individual insurance market. There's right of center and then there's way out on the right wing fringe.
 
General Buck Turgidson said:
(1) I think the grand bargain bullshit is bullshit and will not happen. Frankly, I don't see how anyone could even begin to negotiate with the Republicans in the House after they reneged on the bargain that was struck last time.

(2) I don't think Romney said quite that and if you look at his actual tax plan and military spending plan and deficit promises what you end up with is the almost total destruction of the social safety net.

(3) There are three issues that I think the parties are relatively close on: (1) War on Drugs (2) Anti-Terrorism and (3) corporate regulation (but even here there si quite a spread where Democrats prefer minimal regulation while Republicans prefer self-regulation). On everything else, including most importantly tax policy, spending policy and social welfare policy, the parties are pretty damn far apart and don't even subscribe to the same realities.
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On the grand bargain, I feel that the consensus among the Beltway elites has pretty much settled on "what are we going to demand the middle and lower classes give up?" It seems to me that inflicting pain has become a litmus test of how "serious" someone is. So I do think it's going to happen. I'm not disputing that it's going to be a much worse deal if the R's control everything, but I just don't believe that the very idea of cutting those three programs is centrist.

I haven't looked at Romney's plans, I have to admit. I saw the article last week where he made news by saying that cutting spending right now, or austerity would lead to a new recession, or worsen this one, I forget the exact wording. I haven't really been thinking about him winning until recently. I believe what you say about his plans though.

I feel that the Democratic party has moved right of center, if we don't allow ourselves to move the center to the right in order to accommodate the lunacy of the Republican party and the corporatism of the Democrats. But you have made some good points. It's not that I want to believe these things you know.
 
General Buck Turgidson said:
I think it's right of center, too. But compare raising the retirement age (which I think is insane, by the way) to privatization. Compare cutting Medicare (which I haven't really seen suggested by any Democrat of note, but I could be wrong) to turning it into a voucher program for seniors to buy insurance in the individual insurance market. There's right of center and then there's way out on the right wing fringe.
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That's true.
 
General Buck Turgidson said:
Yes, yes and yes. Remember that budgets can pass through reconciliation procedures and pretty much everything that Romney and Ryan want to do cannot be filibustered.
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How can the Republican party be willing to decimate, destroy, all of those programs which enjoy such broad and strong support and survive? This seems an act of insanity, suicide actually. They are going to end Medicare and survive it?
 
General Buck Turgidson said:
I think it's right of center, too. But compare raising the retirement age (which I think is insane, by the way) to privatization. Compare cutting Medicare (which I haven't really seen suggested by any Democrat of note, but I could be wrong) to turning it into a voucher program for seniors to buy insurance in the individual insurance market. There's right of center and then there's way out on the right wing fringe.
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cutting Medicare (which I haven't really seen suggested by any Democrat of note, but I could be wrong)............YOU ARE...

: Jon Walker Tuesday July 19, 2011
When President Obama first openly put cuts the Medicare and Social Security benefits on the table during the debt ceiling negotiations many of his defenders went full 11th dimensional chess. The claimed Obama wasn’t so much putting these on the table because he wanted them cut right now, but to prove he was the more sensible adult in the room when Republican rejected this grand bargain.

http://washingtonexaminer.com/opini...es-slush-fund-camouflage-medicare-cuts/525626

Even Huffington don't deny it...

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/02/10/president-obama-budget-cuts-tax-hikes_n_1269702.html
 
bravo said:
Not a REAL budget....is that right....

Is it gonna be a first, that a man and his party, can go through an entire 4 year term without ever passing even one budget ?
Has it ever happened before ?
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I'll try again for a lefty response....

Has any other President ever submitted a budget that didn't get EVEN ONE VOTE FROM HIS OWN PARTY ? Twice ?

Another record.....
 
bravo said:
cutting Medicare (which I haven't really seen suggested by any Democrat of note, but I could be wrong)............YOU ARE...

: Jon Walker Tuesday July 19, 2011
When President Obama first openly put cuts the Medicare and Social Security benefits on the table during the debt ceiling negotiations many of his defenders went full 11th dimensional chess. The claimed Obama wasn’t so much putting these on the table because he wanted them cut right now, but to prove he was the more sensible adult in the room when Republican rejected this grand bargain.

http://washingtonexaminer.com/opini...es-slush-fund-camouflage-medicare-cuts/525626

Even Huffington don't deny it...

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/02/10/president-obama-budget-cuts-tax-hikes_n_1269702.html
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That was last summer during the original Grand Bargain negotiations when the Republicans were holding the debt ceiling hostage and the Republicans rejected those proposals. Do you have anything that's not in the context of hostage negotiations?
 
Darla said:
How can the Republican party be willing to decimate, destroy, all of those programs which enjoy such broad and strong support and survive? This seems an act of insanity, suicide actually. They are going to end Medicare and survive it?
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They don't care, their elections are bought and paid for by corporations, what do they really need the people for nowadays? Our elections are a sham, and the little people are just indentured servants.
 
bravo said:
cutting Medicare (which I haven't really seen suggested by any Democrat of note, but I could be wrong)............YOU ARE...

: Jon Walker Tuesday July 19, 2011
When President Obama first openly put cuts the Medicare and Social Security benefits on the table during the debt ceiling negotiations many of his defenders went full 11th dimensional chess. The claimed Obama wasn’t so much putting these on the table because he wanted them cut right now, but to prove he was the more sensible adult in the room when Republican rejected this grand bargain.

http://washingtonexaminer.com/opini...es-slush-fund-camouflage-medicare-cuts/525626

Even Huffington don't deny it...

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/02/10/president-obama-budget-cuts-tax-hikes_n_1269702.html
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What are you going to do Popeye when your federal pension goes way, thanks to your idea of government? Hope you have enough in your private savings.............................
 
General Buck Turgidson said:
That was last summer during the original Grand Bargain negotiations when the Republicans were holding the debt ceiling hostage and the Republicans rejected those proposals. Do you have anything that's not in the context of hostage negotiations?
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cutting Medicare (which I haven't really seen suggested by any Democrat of note

Did Obama suggest cutting Midicare or not ?

That is the crux of the issue.....it has not other context....is Huffington mis-stating the facts?
 
bravo said:
cutting Medicare (which I haven't really seen suggested by any Democrat of note

Did Obama suggest cutting Midicare or not ?

That is the crux of the issue.....it has not other context....is Huffington mis-stating the facts?
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No, I don't think it's accurate to say that Obama suggested cutting Medicare. I think it's accurate to say that Obama conceded it as part of a negotiation.
 
bravo said:
cutting Medicare (which I haven't really seen suggested by any Democrat of note

Did Obama suggest cutting Midicare or not ?

That is the crux of the issue.....it has not other context....is Huffington mis-stating the facts?
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Not MIDICARE, how will I operate my electric piano on my computer? Oh dear gawd, this is bad!
 
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