fast and furious... Obama Admin LIES again...

[Cancel 2016.2]

http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2012/09/19/fast-and-furious-report-finds-doj-management-failures/

"I have reviewed the Office of the Inspector General’s report on Operation Fast and Furious and the key conclusions are consistent with what I, and other Justice Department officials, have said for many months now: The inappropriate strategy and tactics employed were field-driven and date back to 2006; The leadership of the Department did not know about or authorize the use of the flawed strategy and tactics; and The Department’s leadership did not attempt to cover up information or mislead Congress about it," Attorney General Eric Holder said in a statement.

LIE

"Today’s report affirms the problem of gunwalking was a field-driven tactic that dated back to the previous Administration, and it was this Administration’s Attorney General who ended it," spokesman Eric Schultz said in a statement

LIE

How many times are they going to lie to the face of the American public and pretend that somehow Fast and Furious was a Bush program?

Fast and Furious dates back to 2009. Obviously the Obama admin is too ignorant to comprehend who was in office at that time.

 

[canceled.2021.1]

Yeah, but did you hear what Romney said?

 

[Bonestorm]

http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2012/09/19/fast-and-furious-report-finds-doj-management-failures/



LIE



LIE

How many times are they going to lie to the face of the American public and pretend that somehow Fast and Furious was a Bush program?

Fast and Furious dates back to 2009. Obviously the Obama admin is too ignorant to comprehend who was in office at that time.

Surely you have some language from the IG report that shows that Holder is lying.

Also, too, Holder didn't say that Fast and Furious was a Bush program. He said that the IG found that the tactics used in Fast and Furious date back to the Bush Administration, which is true.

 

[hazlnut]

http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2012/09/19/fast-and-furious-report-finds-doj-management-failures/



LIE



LIE

How many times are they going to lie to the face of the American public and pretend that somehow Fast and Furious was a Bush program?

Fast and Furious dates back to 2009. Obviously the Obama admin is too ignorant to comprehend who was in office at that time.

When you get around to proving these are lies, let us know.

Otherwise, I recommend putting your protective head gear back on.... you know, for safety.

 

[Cancel 2016.2]

Surely you have some language from the IG report that shows that Holder is lying.

Also, too, Holder didn't say that Fast and Furious was a Bush program. He said that the IG found that the tactics used in Fast and Furious date back to the Bush Administration, which is true.

No Dear Polly, it is not true. The tactics used in Fast and Furious were NOT the same as the program under the Bush Admin. They were different. It is a flat lie to state that they were the same. It is also highly misleading given to state Holder 'ended them'. They had already been stopped prior to the Obama admin coming into play. So under his DOJ they BEGAN and ENDED. Pretending there wasn't a cessation in the 'tactics' is deliberately misleading.

 

[Bonestorm]

No Dear Polly, it is not true. The tactics used in Fast and Furious were NOT the same as the program under the Bush Admin. They were different. It is a flat lie to state that they were the same. It is also highly misleading given to state Holder 'ended them'. They had already been stopped prior to the Obama admin coming into play. So under his DOJ they BEGAN and ENDED. Pretending there wasn't a cessation in the 'tactics' is deliberately misleading.

Surely you can point me to the portions of the IG report that support what you're saying here.

Whether investigative activity in Operation Wide Receiver was over by the time Holder was sworn in has nothing to do with the veracity of Holder's statement. The IG found that the tactics used in Fast and Furious date back to 2006 and Operative Wide Receiver.

 

[Cancel 2016.2]

When you get around to proving these are lies, let us know.

Otherwise, I recommend putting your protective head gear back on.... you know, for safety.

1) FACT: The tactics of the Bush admin program ended before Obama took office. Therefore Holder did not end those.

2) FACT: The tactics of Obama admin's program were altered in several ways, they were not the same as the program used under Bush. Similar, but not the same. It is a lie to state they dated back to the previous Admin.

 

[Phantasmal]

When you get around to proving these are lies, let us know.

Otherwise, I recommend putting your protective head gear back on.... you know, for safety.

I have a mental image of SF in his protective head gear. Thanks, I will chuckle all day!

 

[Cancel 2016.2]

Surely you can point me to the portions of the IG report that support what you're saying here.

Whether investigative activity in Operation Wide Receiver was over by the time Holder was sworn in has nothing to do with the veracity of Holder's statement. The IG found that the tactics used in Fast and Furious date back to 2006 and Operative Wide Receiver.

yes and Penn State found that they had done nothing wrong with Mann and Joe Pa. East Anglia also had some of their friends say they did nothing wrong.

The programs were similar, but different in key aspects, the two biggest being:

1) Mexican authority involvement
2) Tracking Chips

Add in that Wide receiver was shut down in 2007 due to its failures. Trying to tie the tactics to a program that had been shut for almost two years is a vain attempt at a white wash in conjunction with a pathetic attempt to try and shift blame to the previous admin. It most certainly does matter that the program was shut down for two years. Why not just say the 'tactics date back to the earliest periods of gun smuggling'??? Because they have just as much in common 'tactically' as Wide Receiver did to Fast and Furious.

I know you are incapable of being realistic on this, your cracker is at stake. Keep chirping Polly.

 

[Bonestorm]

You clearly haven't read much (or any) of the IG report and really have no basis for claiming that Holder lied about it's contents. Your gripe seems to be that the IG report doesn't conform to your opinions on the matter and that Holder is lying about what the report says as a result. You're entitled to that view, but that doesn't make Holder a liar.

 

[Cancel 2016.2]

You clearly haven't read much (or any) of the IG report and really have no basis for claiming that Holder lied about it's contents. Your gripe seems to be that the IG report doesn't conform to your opinions on the matter and that Holder is lying about what the report says as a result. You're entitled to that view, but that doesn't make Holder a liar.

You clearly have no ability to be objective on this. You haven't refuted a thing I have stated. He is flat out lying. The two programs were run very differently. To proclaim that they are the same tactics because they both involved guns is fucking moronic. Whether the whitewashing IG report stated the same thing is irrelevant. The point is that Holder is lying and deliberately misleading the public into thinking it was an ongoing program since 2006. It was not. He and the whitewashers are trying to shift responsibility onto the previous admin by stating otherwise.

 

[Bonestorm]

You clearly have no ability to be objective on this. You haven't refuted a thing I have stated. He is flat out lying. The two programs were run very differently. To proclaim that they are the same tactics because they both involved guns is fucking moronic. Whether the whitewashing IG report stated the same thing is irrelevant. The point is that Holder is lying and deliberately misleading the public into thinking it was an ongoing program since 2006. It was not. He and the whitewashers are trying to shift responsibility onto the previous admin by stating otherwise.

But the tactics were the same - to allow known straw purchasers to purchase large numbers of firearms and to let those guns "walk." Holder isn't misleading anyone by saying that the tactics were the same. No one is shifting blame by acknowledging that fact. It doesn't let anyone off the hook. You're reading a whole lot into what Holder said (and obviously haven't read the IG report at all) because you want to call him a liar.

 

[NOVA]

But the tactics were the same - to allow known straw purchasers to purchase large numbers of firearms and to let those guns "walk." Holder isn't misleading anyone by saying that the tactics were the same. No one is shifting blame by acknowledging that fact. It doesn't let anyone off the hook. You're reading a whole lot into what Holder said (and obviously haven't read the IG report at all) because you want to call him a liar.

Holder did lie....fool
Quayle said in a phone interview. “I mean, he lied to me — to my face — during questioning, saying they had reviewed the wiretap applications after the fact and claiming that there was no reference to gunwalking, which is blatantly false.”

Read more: http://dailycaller.com/2012/09/19/q...my-face-during-house-testimony/#ixzz271soBQzB

http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/201...-holder-lied-to-congress-on-fast-and-furious/

You can't remain ignorant with the facts staring you right in the face....

 

[Bonestorm]

According to the IG report, there weren't references to gun walking in the affidavits. If there was, the IG would have said so. But he didn't. Instead, he said that the affidavits "included information that would have caused a prosecutor who was focused on the question of investigative tactics, particularly one who was already sensitive to the issue of ‘gun walking,’ to have questions about ATF’s conduct of the investigations,” which is altogether different.

 

[NOVA]

According to the IG report, there weren't references to gun walking in the affidavits. If there was, the IG would have said so. But he didn't. Instead, he said that the affidavits "included information that would have caused a prosecutor who was focused on the question of investigative tactics, particularly one who was already sensitive to the issue of ‘gun walking,’ to have questions about ATF’s conduct of the investigations,” which is altogether different.

Thats spin is about as lame as you can manufacture and keep a straight face.....

Fast and Furious was a 'gun walking' program by definition....

 

[Bonestorm]

Thats spin is about as lame as you can manufacture and keep a straight face.....

What spin? I quoted the IG. The IG, who reviewed the affidavits, didn't say that the affidavits referenced gun walking.

 

[Cancel 2016.2]

But the tactics were the same - to allow known straw purchasers to purchase large numbers of firearms and to let those guns "walk." Holder isn't misleading anyone by saying that the tactics were the same. No one is shifting blame by acknowledging that fact. It doesn't let anyone off the hook. You're reading a whole lot into what Holder said (and obviously haven't read the IG report at all) because you want to call him a liar.

LMAO... like I stated, why not just state that gun running has been done since guns were first created, blah blah blah. They are SIMILAR, but they are not the same.

Why do you continue to ignore the DIFFERENCES in tactics??? Are you afraid to address them? Or does it just make you feel retarded to keep chirping on this Polly?

1) The Mexican Authorities were involved with Wide Receiver, they were left out of F&F
2) The Guns had tracking chips in Wide Receiver, they did not in F&F

Those are major differences in tactic. Wide Receiver was shut down because they felt it was a failure. F&F started up two years later and didn't even have the two attempts at safeguards that Wide Receiver had. To sit there and proclaim that they are the same tactics is absurd. He is a liar on this point alone. He is a liar to continue misleading the public into thinking it was a continuation of the same tactics. Just as you are Polly.

Your continued 'you didn't read the complete whitewashing' is irrelevant. I am talking about the comments made by Holder and Schultz.

If you care to look at the 500 page report and point me to the whitehousewashers justification of saying they are the same, then do so. I am not going to recite each page of the report until I find what it is you are looking to discuss. Put it out there Polly.

 

[hazlnut]

spin, spin, spin...

get those sean limbaugh quotes up, fast and furiously...

 

[Cancel 2016.2]

What spin? I quoted the IG. The IG, who reviewed the affidavits, didn't say that the affidavits referenced gun walking.

Who does the IG work for again?

 

[Bonestorm]

LMAO... like I stated, why not just state that gun running has been done since guns were first created, blah blah blah. They are SIMILAR, but they are not the same.

Why do you continue to ignore the DIFFERENCES in tactics??? Are you afraid to address them? Or does it just make you feel retarded to keep chirping on this Polly?

1) The Mexican Authorities were involved with Wide Receiver, they were left out of F&F

The Mexican authorities were informed of Wide Receiver, but the idea that it was a cooperative investigation performed in conjunction with Mexican authorities is laughable. Mexican authorities didn't actually do anything. This doesn't change the tactics. It just changes who was made aware of them.

2) The Guns had tracking chips in Wide Receiver, they did not in F&F

Actually, they didn't.

Those are major differences in tactic. Wide Receiver was shut down because they felt it was a failure. F&F started up two years later and didn't even have the two attempts at safeguards that Wide Receiver had. To sit there and proclaim that they are the same tactics is absurd. He is a liar on this point alone. He is a liar to continue misleading the public into thinking it was a continuation of the same tactics. Just as you are Polly.

One of those different "tactics" is just a flat out lie. The other isn't a difference in tactics but a difference about who is made aware of the tactics.

Your continued 'you didn't read the complete whitewashing' is irrelevant. I am talking about the comments made by Holder and Schultz.

The comments by Holder and Schultz are comments about what the report says. You can't know if they are lying about the report without looking at the actual report.

If you care to look at the 500 page report and point me to the whitehousewashers justification of saying they are the same, then do so. I am not going to recite each page of the report until I find what it is you are looking to discuss. Put it out there Polly.

Page 500 of the report is page 1 of Grassley's letter.