A good example of why people are screaming for HC reform.

Dungheap said:
Um, is what I said not a fair reading of this post?
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No, it is a complete load of crap. I said that you and others continue to try and blame the doctor for not telling Mutt the price up front. I did not state that 'doctors bear no blame for unnecessary treatments' nor did I state 'people should not follow the advice of their physicians'. Are you that much of a dishonest piece of shit that you actually expect others to believe they are the same?
 
Rana said:
Yeah, good advice, since I know so much about medicine, when I was diagnosed with cancer, it was what I told my oncologist every visit? Sometimes, I would call him on the phone in between visits just to let him know I really mean it!
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I am talking about the COSTS Rana. Not understanding what each procedure was or why it was necessary. I am talking about his concern over the COSTS. There is a serious lack of reading comprehension capabilities by the left on this board.
 
Dungheap said:
LOL.

Just out of curiosity, is there any field in which you are not an expert?
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MORON... I am not proclaiming to be an expert on medicine. I am stating that is blatantly absurd to pretend he couldn't have gotten the pricing. He chose not to. Then he bitches about it after the fact. Is there any field in which your are not a complete douche bag?
 
Rana said:
Ridiculous analogy, you don't die from a faulty battery, but you do go into a bit of shock when the word "heart" is mentioned.

We as patients need to be pro active, but sometimes there is just no choice.
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1) Unless it was a 'get to the hospital now, your life depends on it' then there is no reason he could not have gotten a cost estimate
2) The car analogy is a good one... there are certain things that can go wrong, that if left unfixed will not lead to potential death. Other things, you have to do or you do risk death. Same in medicine. Certain things must be done. Others you can wait. In this case with Mutt, he had the time to demand the cost estimate. He chose to accept their non answer. Even had he left, he would have known to get it checked out. He would simply have done so at another doctors office.
 
Superfreak said:
MORON... I am not proclaiming to be an expert on medicine. I am stating that is blatantly absurd to pretend he couldn't have gotten the pricing. He chose not to. Then he bitches about it after the fact. Is there any field in which your are not a complete douche bag?
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What does the practice of defensive medicine and whether physicians are "forced" to do it have to do with Mott?

I love how you make blanket generalized statements about things (The truth of the matter is, you continue to try and place the blame on the doctor rather than on the dumbass patient. The truth of the matter is that their are a lot of people who are just too fucking retarded to get the price up front) and then pretend that the conversation is only about Mott and his doctor.
 
The Dude said:
It shows serious lack of economics to think insurance profits re the only cause of extreme medical cost!
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True dat but they are a seriously significant factor. The rest of the world views our health care paradigm as being.....really odd.....why the hell would you run a nations health care systems on a for profit basis? The outcome would be pretty obvious. Only those who can afford to pay out the nose recieve adequate health care.
 
Superfreak said:
1) Unless it was a 'get to the hospital now, your life depends on it' then there is no reason he could not have gotten a cost estimate
2) The car analogy is a good one... there are certain things that can go wrong, that if left unfixed will not lead to potential death. Other things, you have to do or you do risk death. Same in medicine. Certain things must be done. Others you can wait. In this case with Mutt, he had the time to demand the cost estimate. He chose to accept their non answer. Even had he left, he would have known to get it checked out. He would simply have done so at another doctors office.
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Well, hopefully you will never be in a position to understand. You don't think rationally at the time, your emotions take over, but maybe not for a god...
 
Mott the Hoople said:
Last month I went for a physical. Just a garden variety annual physical. The GP does a general physical, BP, blood, ekg and says there's a little blip on my ekg, he doesn't think it's serious but thinks maybe he should send me to the cardiologist. So every step along the way I'm asking "How much is this going to cost?". I'm told "Don't know for sure but since it's a physical with out a diagnosis it shouldn't cost you much, your insurance should pick up most of it. Never once to I get told "Total cost is going to be X dollars.".

So I go see the cardiologist. He does a BP and an EKG. Say's theirs a blip on it that he can't even point out to me on the cardiogram it's so small. He want's to do a stress test. Again "how much is this going to cost" I get the same BLAH, BLAH, BLAH and no straight answer to my question.

So this week I get the Bill and for going over to a cardiologist and for literally putting me on a treadmill for 10 minutes with a blood pressure cup and a heart rate monitor they charged my ass $2500!!

Some fucking stress test. I read the bill and my heart started beating faster than when I did the stress test. What a fucking racket. How do they get away with this shit? They're the only mother fuckers I know who can bill you for a service and not tell you what that service is going to cost you.
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It's too bad America didn't get any health care reform when Obama said we did.
 
Mott the Hoople said:
LOL Oh the results were fine and those kind of out of pocket charges are pretty standard with todays ubiquetous high deductable policies. What really pisses me off was I went there in the first place to schedule a colonoscopy and it got side tracked by this bullshit. Grrrrrrrr.
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I'd have to be dragged kicking and screaming to a colonoscopy.
 
Mott the Hoople said:
I was confused. France has its national health insurance. It's the hospitals/clinics which are non-profits.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1447687/

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Health_care_in_France
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thanks mott...i could not find anything to support this statement:

In fact in all modern industrialized nations except the US all health insurance companies are operated as non-profits. It's a big factor in controling costs.

were confused about that as well?
 
Rana said:
SF, when it is your heart, when it is cancer, when they say certain buzz words, you want to know the costs, you asks for the costs, but bottom line, you do what your doctor suggests, there are just certain things that you just do.

The frustrating part is that these professionals know you will do it. There is little service to the consumer when it comes to medical practices. They know they have you between a rock and a hard place.

When I had elective surgery all the costs were estimated and presented to me, the same was not supplied when I went through cancer treatment and the bottom line is, you not care, you do what you have to to live.

It sucks.
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Well-stated. For a serious problem like cancer they have you over a barrel, and they know it.
 
Darla said:
Did your insurance pay it? Are you saying it cost you 2,500 out of pocket?
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This is an example of the problem.

Who do you think pays for insurance?

Even if it's 100% pure government paying for all of it. Who pays for that??

The collective blindness is absolutely astounding.

The problem of the US health care system is COST.

Not who pays for it! WE pay for it! (And don't talk to me about pooling risk with insurance. A route stress test is about 100% likely to happen for just about everybody at some point).
 
Rana said:
SF, when it is your heart, when it is cancer, when they say certain buzz words, you want to know the costs, you asks for the costs, but bottom line, you do what your doctor suggests, there are just certain things that you just do.
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Yes, I understand that. Don't fall into Dungs stupidity of pretending I am suggesting that you should not do what the doctor tells you to. That is his straw man and is not what I stated. I stated that you, the individual, have a choice in finding out the costs ahead of time or not. If you choose to go along without getting the costs, then it is quite stupid to come on here and bitch about it being the doctors fault. Unless it was a life threatening moment where you simply had to get in or die, there is no reason that you can't get that information ahead of time if you truly want it. None. Mutt even agreed to that. But Dung wants to create his stupid little straw men, because that is all he can knock down.

The frustrating part is that these professionals know you will do it. There is little service to the consumer when it comes to medical practices. They know they have you between a rock and a hard place.
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I agree with the above. Of course we are going to do it if they give us reason to believe our lives are in danger. But unless the danger is immediate, we have the time to get the facts.

When I had elective surgery all the costs were estimated and presented to me, the same was not supplied when I went through cancer treatment and the bottom line is, you not care, you do what you have to to live.

It sucks.
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I know it does. My sister went through it and it was a massive ordeal. But that didn't stop us from getting the estimate on costs ahead of time. She did not have anywhere near the money nor the insurance coverage to cover the total costs. But in knowing up front the estimate, my brother and I were able to start setting money aside to help her. No one should ever make a decision based on emotion if it can be helped. In an emergency situation, you don't always have the time and you do what you must. But in most cases, you have time... and if you feel overwhelmed, you can turn to family and friends to help in the decision.
 
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