If George Bush had saved millions of white people from cancer ..

Thing1 said:
I support the policy, but not the man, and I certainly don't feel compelled to praise him.

Africa doesn't give him a get-out-of-jail free card for Iraq. Iraq is egregious enough, imo, to negate most of whatever good GW Bush did. It wasn't just a bad policy; it was a defining event in his Presidency, and something for which I could write endlessly about the arrogance of the decision, the incompetence of the execution, and the wanton death & desctruction that resulted from both.
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To me if you say 'I like this policy by this person' it does not mean you are stating you like all of their policies or that you voted for them or that you support them. It simply means you like that particular policy.
 
cawacko said:
To me if you say 'I like this policy by this person' it does not mean you are stating you like all of their policies or that you voted for them or that you support them. It simply means you like that particular policy.
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Which is exactly what I've said.

Thanks
 
Chapel The Evergreen said:
So then Vietnam casts the same shadow over Kennedy (who also has the Bay of Pigs) and LBJ?
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LBJ's Gulf of Tonkin lie led to the deaths almost 60,000 American soldiers .. and a million Vietnamese .. far more than Bush killed in Iraq. Among those killed was my cousin and two of my friends.

Yet, I applaud LBJ's attempt at a Great Society and its policies.
 
blackascoal said:
.. would democrats acknowledge that?

Of course they would .. irrespective of what he did in Iraq.

Yet, George Bush DID save MILLIONS of black and brown people from AIDS, malaria, and other diseases .. and many democrats who claim to care about minorities and under-served people treat that as no big deal .. don't want to talk about it .. don't want anyone else talking about it.

It's just black people .. not like Bush saved real people.
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At least you admit that there are people who are underserved in this country.
 
The basic principals of GWB's cowboy, anti-intellectual mentality are not consistent with the duties of an American President. His unwillingness to listen to the possibility that he might be wrong and do or die at all costs approach toward starting the war in Iraq were major flaws in his ability to perform the duties of President. The voters should have seen that going in, and a Majority did, but not enough to prevent him from taking office.
 
Jarod said:
The basic principals of GWB's cowboy, anti-intellectual mentality are not consistent with the duties of an American President. His unwillingness to listen to the possibility that he might be wrong and do or die at all costs approach toward starting the war in Iraq were major flaws in his ability to perform the duties of President. The voters should have seen that going in, and a Majority did, but not enough to prevent him from taking office.
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I absolutely agree.

But much of the same is true of Obama.

He doesn't give a damn what the American people think. He believes he's the smartest guy in the room .. a serious flaw for a president.
 
blackascoal said:
I absolutely agree.

But much of the same is true of Obama.

He doesn't give a damn what the American people think. He believes he's the smartest guy in the room .. a serious flaw for a president.
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I don't see that as much with Obama as I did with Bush. President Obama was talked into Libya by HRC, he changed his position on Gay Marriage, and he is studying what to do in Syria. He has taken a balanced approach to most major decisions and appears to not make his mind up before setting out to accomplish something. He accepted compromise on the biggest priority of his first term, the Health Care Bill. Many say too much compromise. He has given much on the tax increase debate, with no compromise from the other side. I cant think of any issue he has been excessively pigheaded on. HE gave up on closing the prison at Guantamano, and he eventually gave Congress the information they requested re the drone program. President Obama has his flaws, but being uncompromising and unwilling to listen to his advisors is not one of them. He's no cowboy and he's not an anti-intellectual.
 
blackascoal said:
.. would democrats acknowledge that?

Of course they would .. irrespective of what he did in Iraq.

Yet, George Bush DID save MILLIONS of black and brown people from AIDS, malaria, and other diseases .. and many democrats who claim to care about minorities and under-served people treat that as no big deal .. don't want to talk about it .. don't want anyone else talking about it.

It's just black people .. not like Bush saved real people.
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The fact of the matter is,
[h=2] If George Bush had saved millions of white people from cancer[/h]
Democrats like thingy1, darla, rana, zippy, tclibber, liverlipshowey, etc......would be accusing Bush of major racism today....
 
Jarod said:
It is funny to me that the one thing GWB did that we can almost ALL agree was his best move was in conflict with his basic principals.
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That remark is as close to insane an any you've posted....are you seriously accusing Bush of being a racist and if so, on what evidence...?

By that logic, was LBJ's Civil Rights bill that he is credited for getting passed against his basic principals ? or even Democrats basic principals....considering he is
one of the hero's of the Democrats, as was Sen. KKK Byrd who joined with Southern senators to filibuster the Civil Rights Act for 83 days.....


 
Jarod said:
I don't see that as much with Obama as I did with Bush. President Obama was talked into Libya by HRC, he changed his position on Gay Marriage, and he is studying what to do in Syria. He has taken a balanced approach to most major decisions and appears to not make his mind up before setting out to accomplish something. He accepted compromise on the biggest priority of his first term, the Health Care Bill. Many say too much compromise. He has given much on the tax increase debate, with no compromise from the other side. I cant think of any issue he has been excessively pigheaded on. HE gave up on closing the prison at Guantamano, and he eventually gave Congress the information they requested re the drone program. President Obama has his flaws, but being uncompromising and unwilling to listen to his advisors is not one of them. He's no cowboy and he's not an anti-intellectual.
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What your describing is a man that is obviously doing everything that is politically expedient for his own good....he looks out for himself, No.1, and couldn't care
less what his actions do to the country....if it makes him look good, that all that counts.

He's had zero ideas of his own in all his time in office.....all his policys are Bush policies...even the healthcare debacle was cooked up by the Clintons...
 
NOVA said:
That remark is as close to insane an any you've posted....are you seriously accusing Bush of being a racist and if so, on what evidence...?

By that logic, was LBJ's Civil Rights bill that he is credited for getting passed against his basic principals ? or even Democrats basic principals....considering he is
one of the hero's of the Democrats, as was Sen. KKK Byrd who joined with Southern senators to filibuster the Civil Rights Act for 83 days.....
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Squirrel...
 
blackascoal said:
George Bush is the same contradiction that LBJ was.

LBJ lied us into a serious escalation of the Vietnam War .. and almost 60,000 American soldiers lost their lives and never came home because of his lie.

Yet, I can applaud LBJ for his attempts at a Great Society .. which was essentially socialism.

Much of the same is true of Bush. A monster and a fool on foreign policy .. and a saint who almost single-handedly saved millions of lives.
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I don't think thingy wants to hear about LBJ and Vietnam.....and almost 60,000 DEAD American soldiers, not to mention the MILLIONS, yes, millions of others
that died directly because of LBJ......

but it certainly puts the victory in the Iraq War and ousting of Saddam in some perspective....
 
Jarod said:
I don't see that as much with Obama as I did with Bush. President Obama was talked into Libya by HRC, he changed his position on Gay Marriage, and he is studying what to do in Syria. He has taken a balanced approach to most major decisions and appears to not make his mind up before setting out to accomplish something. He accepted compromise on the biggest priority of his first term, the Health Care Bill. Many say too much compromise. He has given much on the tax increase debate, with no compromise from the other side. I cant think of any issue he has been excessively pigheaded on. HE gave up on closing the prison at Guantamano, and he eventually gave Congress the information they requested re the drone program. President Obama has his flaws, but being uncompromising and unwilling to listen to his advisors is not one of them. He's no cowboy and he's not an anti-intellectual.
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I disagree on all counts.

Obama and Robert Gibbs made fun of liberals and the "professional" left during the health care process.

“I hear these people saying he’s like George Bush. Those people ought to be drug tested,” Gibbs said. “I mean, it’s crazy.” The press secretary dismissed the “professional left” in terms very similar to those used by their opponents on the ideological right, saying, “They will be satisfied when we have Canadian healthcare and we’ve eliminated the Pentagon. That’s not reality.
http://swampland.time.com/2010/08/1...ght-with-the-professional-left/#ixzz2SA2dHciD

Obama ignored each and every plea to stand up for SP as he had promised.

Why Obama Says He Won't Release Drone Documents
April 30, 2013
http://www.beachwoodreporter.com/politics/why_obama_says_he_wont_release.php

U.S. court pressures Obama for drone policy details
March 13, 2013
http://news.yahoo.com/appeals-court-revives-suit-over-cia-drone-records-143449710.html

He has not released all of the documents .. and the documents that he has released demonstrate why he had to be forced to do so.

Intelligence Documents Suggest Obama Administration Lied About Who Drones Kill
April 19, 2013
The reports, obtained by McClatchy, show targeted assassinations go beyond Al Qaida leaders.
http://www.alternet.org/civil-liber...ama-administration-lied-about-who-drones-kill

I'm not talking about listening to his advisers .. I'm talking about listening to his base and the American people.

One of the differences between Bush and Obama is that Bush would tell you what he thinks in an inarticulate way.

Obama tells you what he thinks you want to hear articulately .. but doesn't mean a word of it.
 
NOVA said:
I don't think thingy wants to hear about LBJ and Vietnam.....and almost 60,000 DEAD American soldiers, not to mention the MILLIONS, yes, millions of others
that died directly because of LBJ......

but it certainly puts the victory in the Iraq War and ousting of Saddam in some perspective....
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How stupid, my war is better than your war, when both were unnecessary and both caused far too many deaths, and neither worth the price.
 
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