Hillary Clinton is Barbara Walters' Most Fascinating Person of 2013.

maineman said:
And I think it is profoundly hypocritical to make a huge deal about Clinton's actions to avoid service there while giving Dick Cheney a free pass on the same thing.
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Cheney didn't dodge the draft.....Clinton did...the Col. knows, only you Clinton apologists are in denial...
 
christiefan915 said:
What does military service have to do with running for president? Maybe you should lobby for an amendment.

Age and Citizenship requirements - US Constitution, Article II, Section 1
No person except a natural born citizen, or a citizen of the United States, at the time of the adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the office of President; neither shall any person be eligible to that office who shall not have attained to the age of thirty-five years, and been fourteen years a resident within the United States.
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Nothing.....dodging the draft does. Joining the ROTC with the full knowledge you would never honor that commitment does...organizing foreign demonstrations against you're own
country does...
 
People like nova who could never get into college, upon not even getting a min wage job join the navy to mop decks.
With the other dregs of society!
Thanks for keeping the decks clean
 
NOVA said:
Nothing.....dodging the draft does. Joining the ROTC with the full knowledge you would never honor that commitment does...organizing foreign demonstrations against you're own
country does...
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apparently, the majority of Americans disagreed with you and didn't think that had much to do with being president.
 
NOVA said:
Cheney didn't dodge the draft.....Clinton did...the Col. knows, only you Clinton apologists are in denial...
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applying for multiple deferments was certainly a means of dodging the draft. clearly, he didn't WANT to go and die in the rice paddies of Vietnam. I don't blame him... I don't blame anyone of my generation who made that choice. In retrospect, it was a wise one.
 
The Dude said:
People like nova who could never get into college, upon not even getting a min wage job join the navy to mop decks.
With the other dregs of society!
Thanks for keeping the decks clean
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Good to know you think the enlisted men in the navy, hourly workers and those who have to get up in the morning and go to work are "dregs of society".

Dunce.
 
maineman said:
applying for multiple deferments was certainly a means of dodging the draft. clearly, he didn't WANT to go and die in the rice paddies of Vietnam. I don't blame him... I don't blame anyone of my generation who made that choice. In retrospect, it was a wise one.
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Yet you attempt to impugn him; you're quite the confused hyper partisan lying liberal dimwit aren't you?
 
NOVA said:
Cheney didn't dodge the draft.....Clinton did...the Col. knows, only you Clinton apologists are in denial...
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First, Merry Christmas bravs, Even though you're a mean one, Mr. Grinch, you're our mean one. :D

Second, are you out of your ever-lovin' mind? "Dodging" v. "deferring" is a distinction without a difference. Neither cheney nor Clinton fit the criteria of doing something illegal, however immoral or unethical we think it is. The illegality comes in if the draftee deserted "without receiving a valid leave of absence or discharge and without any intention of returning to the service."
 
maineman said:
I'll say again... there were a whole lot of people - young AND old - who were deeply upset by, and vehemently opposed to our nation's military actions in Vietnam. Even though I was in uniform from 1968 until 1993, I was personally opposed to our country's misuse of its military in that war, as were many of my shipmates. Standing for one's principles is an honorable position to take. My lifelong best friend was a conscientious objector. I had another great friend who went to Canada to avoid serving in that horrible, stupid conflict. Both of those men are still my close friends and I admire their integrity. I, on the other hand, was a career naval officer. I may have personally disagreed with the decisions of our civilian leadership to take us into that conflict, but I never hesitated to enthusiastically and loyally carry out any lawful command during that, or any other period of my service. I loathed the Vietnam war. Lots of career military men were. That being said, I don't think I was ever a disgrace to my uniform and my advancement, awards and commendations are proof that the Navy didn't think so either.
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This isn't about you and your opposition to the Vietnam War...its about your unbending devotion to Democrats in general and your acute state of denial
when it comes to Bill Clinton.....his undeniable admission of 'loathing the military'...his joining the ROTC to avoid and draft....his admission of never having
any intention of actually going through with his obligation to the report for ROTC duty, his lying, dishonesty and complete lack of honor, etc....

Thats what makes you a disgrace in my view....you can't face the truth, you won't face the facts, you ignore what is obvious.....
and your continued defense of draft dodgers and deserters you mention in you own post...their 'integrity'....
If you were ordered to Vietnam and expected to kill for LBJ, would your "integrity" take you to Canada ?

You admire "Standing for one's principles" as an honorable position to take until its a Conservative or a devout Christian that stands for their principles....
Its how we define a hypocrite....
 
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NOVA said:
This isn't about you and your opposition to the Vietnam War...its about your unbending devotion to Democrats in general and your acute state of denial
when it comes to Bill Clinton.....his undeniable admission of 'loathing the military'...his joining the ROTC to avoid and draft....his admission of never having
any intention of actually going through with his obligation to the report for ROTC duty, his lying, dishonesty and complete lack of honor, etc....

Thats what makes you a disgrace in my view....you can't face the truth, you won't face the facts, you ignore what is obvious.....
and your continued defense of draft dodgers and deserters you mention in you own post...their 'integrity'....
If you were ordered to Vietnam and expected to kill for LBJ, would your "integrity" take you to Canada ?

You admire "Standing for one's principles" as an honorable position to take until its a Conservative or a devout Christian that stands for their principles....
Its how we define a hypocrite....
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what principles did Dick Cheney stand on when he sought and received five deferments?

And you are wrong about me, of course. I don't think Bill Clinton is perfect... I don't think any politician is perfect. I do stand with the democratic party because I have always admired their platform since I was a teenager. When their platform changes, I will look for another political affiliation. That's how I think politics ought to work... you stand with the party that most closely matches your principles... elections are about platforms and directions and policies... and they ought not to be personality contests, imo.

I don't think that anyone who stands on their principles is dishonorable - liberal or conservative.

I started my service when LBJ was president, and I retired when Clinton was president. During those years, I followed - and would have followed - any legal order from any of my superiors... AND, as far as my subordinates ever knew, I vigorously and enthusiastically supported all of those orders. That's what professional officers do.
 
Big Money said:
Thanks.

I have to admire your bravado regarding the possibility of such a commonplace event in your adopted country.
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no bravado at all. I am sure that there are scary places within Mexico just as there are scary places in the US. I didn't live in a scary place in the US, and I live in the absolute safest town in the safest state in all of Mexico.
 
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