George Will leaving Republican Party

Right said:
Why are you buying into this Democrat mantra?
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We (Republicans) have lost five of the last six popular votes in Presidential elections and if today's polls hold true it's about to be six out of seven. Republicans have to expand the base of the party. Republicans cannot rely on white voters only going forward to win national elections. We're committing self suicide
 
cawacko said:
We (Republicans) have lost five of the last six popular votes in Presidential elections and if today's polls hold true it's about to be six out of seven. Republicans have to expand the base of the party. Republicans cannot rely on white voters only going forward to win national elections. We're committing self suicide
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Again, why are you buying the Democrat bullshit that we are?
 
Right said:
Again, why are you buying the Democrat bullshit that we are?
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Look at numbers today. We are getting crushed by all minority groups. Blacks and Hispanics specifically dislike/hate Trump.

Look at the numbers Romney got with minority voters. Not good.
 
cawacko said:
You'll notice I said minorities. Minorities include blacks, Hispanics and Asians. I didn't say black voters only. So either you are purposefully misrepresenting what I said or your reading comprehension is off.

Democrats don't win the union vote at near the same rate they do the minority vote. So of course Union votes have always been important to Democrats but in the context of Jarod's point minorities are the better analogy here so spare me this idiot sh*t.
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because the same divisive politics that democrats use to keep minorites can also be used to target them. I feel with the massive democrat support for illegal immigration which benefits hispanics and free trade then the black vote can be targetted.
 
cawacko said:
Look at numbers today. We are getting crushed by all minority groups. Blacks and Hispanics specifically dislike/hate Trump.

Look at the numbers Romney got with minority voters. Not good.
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Because minorities have accepted the premise that the Democrat Party has posited: "Republicans are the Party of white men." This same premise that you seem to have accepted and propagated.
 
Right said:
Because minorities have accepted the premise that the Democrat Party has posited: "Republicans are the Party of white men." This same premise that you seem to have accepted and propagated.
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We (Republicans) don't do anything to challenge or alter that narrative. Until we acknowledge the challenge/problem we can't or won't do anything to change it. The party did this big 'evaluation' post 2012 election and recognized we needed to do a much better job of reaching out to Hispanic voters for instance. And now we've nominated Trump who just reconfirms to them why they vote how they do.

Demographics are changing in this country and we are behind the curve in terms of national elections.
 
cawacko said:
We (Republicans) don't do anything to challenge or alter that narrative. Until we acknowledge the challenge/problem we can't or won't do anything to change it. The party did this big 'evaluation' post 2012 election and recognized we needed to do a much better job of reaching out to Hispanic voters for instance. And now we've nominated Trump who just reconfirms to them why they vote how they do.

Demographics are changing in this country and we are behind the curve in terms of national elections.
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I agree on both counts.

But WHY haven't 'we' challenged the democrats premise? I said 'we' meaning them.

Because there's considerable political risk in challenging it. What happens here when someone challenges it is a microcosm of what happens to conservative politicians when they challenge. And heaven help the black conservative who challenges it---they'll get the Uncle Tom treat.

And none of that, is Trump's fault. Trump's problem is he lobs softballs that the racialist demagogues can drive over the left center wall. And he may or may not learn better.
 
cawacko said:
We (Republicans) don't do anything to challenge or alter that narrative. Until we acknowledge the challenge/problem we can't or won't do anything to change it. The party did this big 'evaluation' post 2012 election and recognized we needed to do a much better job of reaching out to Hispanic voters for instance. And now we've nominated Trump who just reconfirms to them why they vote how they do.

Demographics are changing in this country and we are behind the curve in terms of national elections.
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The only challenge/ problem here is that people believe the false narrative. Public self-evaluation only serves to legitimize the narrative.

The Republican Party was formed on the basis of human rights, and fought the Democrat Party on this issue in Congress, using the judicial process, and even civil war. The GOP championed women's suffrage. A few decades go by, the Democrat Party claims high ground on these issues, and now you buy into it. Why?
 
cawacko said:
We (Republicans) don't do anything to challenge or alter that narrative. Until we acknowledge the challenge/problem we can't or won't do anything to change it. The party did this big 'evaluation' post 2012 election and recognized we needed to do a much better job of reaching out to Hispanic voters for instance. And now we've nominated Trump who just reconfirms to them why they vote how they do.

Demographics are changing in this country and we are behind the curve in terms of national elections.
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now this is partly true. Before 2016 there never was any reason to vote republican. The party would do everything it could to ship out your jobs faster than democrats and made sure you had no SS net to catch you when they suceeded.

I actually feel trumps message this time around does give some minorities a reason to vote r.
 
Right said:
The only challenge/ problem here is that people believe the false narrative. Public self-evaluation only serves to legitimize the narrative.

The Republican Party was formed on the basis of human rights, and fought the Democrat Party on this issue in Congress, using the judicial process, and even civil war. The GOP championed women's suffrage. A few decades go by, the Democrat Party claims high ground on these issues, and now you buy into it. Why?
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My position here has nothing to do with what Democrats say or think. I don't care about them. I'm basing my belief/position on three things. First, as was mentioned, is our record in the past six Presidential elections and current polls in this one. Two, the results of those elections and how Republicans did with minority voters and it has gotten progressively worse. And third is demographics in this country.
 
cawacko said:
My position here has nothing to do with what Democrats say or think. I don't care about them. I'm basing my belief/position on three things. First, as was mentioned, is our record in the past six Presidential elections and current polls in this one. Two, the results of those elections and how Republicans did with minority voters and it has gotten progressively worse. And third is demographics in this country.
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Yes, the GOP doesn't do well with minorities. But that's not the reason why; it's merely the result.

I've told you what I believe the reason is. I'm asking you what you think the reason is.

You have to know what the reason is before you can come up with a solution to counter it.
 
Right said:
Yes, the GOP doesn't do well with minorities. But that's not the reason why; it's merely the result.

I've told you what I believe the reason is. I'm asking you what you think the reason is.

You have to know what the reason is before you can come up with a solution to counter it.
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I think our efforts to reach out to minority voters has been poor. Democrats are going to sit back and call us racist etc. but ultimately it is upon us to make the effort and show these voters that the Democratic narrative is false. I know in some places we do this but it starts at the grass roots where we find young minority talent and help support them to grow within the party (as politicians). And it's going to speak and be seen at places where we traditionally haven't been like Jack Kemp use to do and Rand Paul did during his Presidential run here. George W. Bush had a connection to the Hispanic community for years and he did much better than other Republicans have.

And in the current Trump is killing us. He is the caricature that liberals and minorities describe to all Republicans. We are setting ourselves far back with him.
 
cawacko said:
You'll notice I said minorities. Minorities include blacks, Hispanics and Asians. I didn't say black voters only. So either you are purposefully misrepresenting what I said or your reading comprehension is off.
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lol.....and you think that makes a difference in the argument?.....

Democrats don't win the union vote at near the same rate they do the minority vote. So of course Union votes have always been important to Democrats but in the context of Jarod's point minorities are the better analogy here so spare me this idiot sh*t.
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the "evangelical" vote is no where near as plentiful as the pro-Dem union vote......
 
cawacko said:
We (Republicans) have lost five of the last six popular votes in Presidential elections and if today's polls hold true it's about to be six out of seven. Republicans have to expand the base of the party. Republicans cannot rely on white voters only going forward to win national elections. We're committing self suicide
Click to expand...

it is illogical to apply a racial demographic from "let's elect the first black president" elections to all elections.....the Democrats can't rely on heavy participation and 97% loyalty from blacks in all elections....
 
cawacko said:
I think our efforts to reach out to minority voters has been poor. Democrats are going to sit back and call us racist etc. but ultimately it is upon us to make the effort and show these voters that the Democratic narrative is false. I know in some places we do this but it starts at the grass roots where we find young minority talent and help support them to grow within the party (as politicians). And it's going to speak and be seen at places where we traditionally haven't been like Jack Kemp use to do and Rand Paul did during his Presidential run here. George W. Bush had a connection to the Hispanic community for years and he did much better than other Republicans have.

And in the current Trump is killing us. He is the caricature that liberals and minorities describe to all Republicans. We are setting ourselves far back with him.
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Our efforts have been poor, in my opinion, because GOP candidates and politicians accept the false narrative, or don't have the balls to attack it using history and facts.

You seem to be accepting the narrative yourself with a comment such as above "[Trump] is the caricature..."
 
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