What Are the Costs for America's Biased Support for Israel?

B

blackascoal

The Force is With Me
Do the advantages of blind support for Israel outweigh the disadvantages?

1. Our blind and biased support for Israel continues to put us at odds with the rest of the world .. a world that we are increasingly dependent on. Around the world, including the United States, loathing of Israel is widespread and steadily mounting. In Asia and Europe, political and business leaders increasingly regard Israel and its policies as harmful to global order and stability.

2. Our biased support for Israel continues to pour billions of dwindling and badly needed US TAXPAYER dollars into this shithole without any return. The monetary costs were estimated to be about THREE TRILLION dollars back in 2002. Not only is the burden realized in billion dollar giveaways to Israel that they never pay back, but also in increased fuel costs due to interuptions in supply, oil embargoes, and decreased trade. Israel has never been self-supporting, nor will it be anytime in the near future. It has always required massive subsidies from the outside

How long can American taxpayers be asked to shoulder the financial burden of Israel, particularly when we teeter on the edge of finacial disaster ourselves?

3. Our biased support of Israel further endangers US troops stationed in Iraq and Afghanistan and it continues to empower Iran, Al Queda, and the Taliban. It not only adds to the "war on terror" being a total failure, but also highlights the absurdity and hypocrisy of it.

4. Our biased support of Israel creates tremendous opportunities for China, Russia, and the entire Shanghai Cooperation Organization to make gains and inroads into the arab world and gives them greater access to their resources. This would include Iran, Pakistan, and Venezuela.

5. Our biased support of Israel endangers so-called moderate arab regimes like Egypt, Saudia Arabia, and Turkey. It puts them at odds with their own population and empowers more radical elements within.

6. Our biased support of Israel mutes global American influence, leadership, and power and makes it less likely other nations will follow .. Afghanistan and Iraq are prime examples. It even alienates our traditional partners like Britian.

7. Israel is not a democracy and our support of it makes the "democracy" argument false and hypocritical. Contrary to claims made by American and Israeli political leaders, US support for Israel has never been in America’s authentic national interest, nor has it been based on a commitment to democracy and freedom.

America’s pro-Israel policy has proven terribly costly to the United States in wasted billions of dollars, in lost international credibility and standing, and in lives squandered for the interests of a foreign state. In the years ahead, the price paid by Americans for our biased commitment to Israel will undoubtedly rise and the relative global power of the US will continue to steadily decline.

8. Our biased support of Israel effectively destroys the argument against nuclear proliferation. If Israel can have an arsenal of nuclear weapons, then surely so can anyother nation in the world.

I'd like to hear what the advantages are to the American people that outweigh the massive disadvantages that comes from our undeniably blind and biased support for Israel.
 
Usually that means they either agree, or they don't have the time to read the whole post.

Personally I think blind support is never within the nation's best interest. There is no possible way that every decision that Israel makes is "right" and the US should judge on a more even keel.

This does not mean that I agree that Israel is evil, or that their goal is to remove Palestinians from the ME or something equally dense (for them to try, not for people to think as there are extremists in Israel who do indeed think this would be a great idea but it is just dense, just as there are extremists in the Palestinian controlled areas that think Israel should just go away and both sides have elected at times people from those extremist groups.)

Personally, as I said earlier in another thread, we should stop giving them our money, it would be better spent here and they are rich enough to buy their own stuff and should only support them if we are using our nations best interest as a guide rather than "friend". Nations have interests, not friends.
 
blackascoal said:
Do the advantages of blind support for Israel outweigh the disadvantages?

1. Our blind and biased support for Israel continues to put us at odds with the rest of the world .. a world that we are increasingly dependent on. Around the world, including the United States, loathing of Israel is widespread and steadily mounting. In Asia and Europe, political and business leaders increasingly regard Israel and its policies as harmful to global order and stability.

2. Our biased support for Israel continues to pour billions of dwindling and badly needed US TAXPAYER dollars into this shithole without any return. The monetary costs were estimated to be about THREE TRILLION dollars back in 2002. Not only is the burden realized in billion dollar giveaways to Israel that they never pay back, but also in increased fuel costs due to interuptions in supply, oil embargoes, and decreased trade. Israel has never been self-supporting, nor will it be anytime in the near future. It has always required massive subsidies from the outside

How long can American taxpayers be asked to shoulder the financial burden of Israel, particularly when we teeter on the edge of finacial disaster ourselves?

3. Our biased support of Israel further endangers US troops stationed in Iraq and Afghanistan and it continues to empower Iran, Al Queda, and the Taliban. It not only adds to the "war on terror" being a total failure, but also highlights the absurdity and hypocrisy of it.

4. Our biased support of Israel creates tremendous opportunities for China, Russia, and the entire Shanghai Cooperation Organization to make gains and inroads into the arab world and gives them greater access to their resources. This would include Iran, Pakistan, and Venezuela.

5. Our biased support of Israel endangers so-called moderate arab regimes like Egypt, Saudia Arabia, and Turkey. It puts them at odds with their own population and empowers more radical elements within.

6. Our biased support of Israel mutes global American influence, leadership, and power and makes it less likely other nations will follow .. Afghanistan and Iraq are prime examples. It even alienates our traditional partners like Britian.

7. Israel is not a democracy and our support of it makes the "democracy" argument false and hypocritical. Contrary to claims made by American and Israeli political leaders, US support for Israel has never been in America’s authentic national interest, nor has it been based on a commitment to democracy and freedom.

America’s pro-Israel policy has proven terribly costly to the United States in wasted billions of dollars, in lost international credibility and standing, and in lives squandered for the interests of a foreign state. In the years ahead, the price paid by Americans for our biased commitment to Israel will undoubtedly rise and the relative global power of the US will continue to steadily decline.

8. Our biased support of Israel effectively destroys the argument against nuclear proliferation. If Israel can have an arsenal of nuclear weapons, then surely so can anyother nation in the world.

I'd like to hear what the advantages are to the American people that outweigh the massive disadvantages that comes from our undeniably blind and biased support for Israel.
Click to expand...


I don't understand it, I have yet to hear a believable theory on how we got to this place. You can't even open your mouth without being called anti-semitic, or suspected of it.
 
Honestly I don't know what folks want us (Barak Obama) to do. IMO Israel shouldn't even exist as a nation in that part of the world. I think they were placed there by religiously misguided people in the 40's and continue to be supported partly by religiously misguided people today. But that doesn't change the fact that they are there and are the targets of terrorist attacks and bombs being lobbed into their country. What is Obama going to do? Allow the destruction and deplacement of Israel. I don't think so. So the fighting goes on, as sad as it is.....all because our politcians from the 40's onward are trying to help God out. It is truly a bad situation and I don't have the answers and don't think anyone else does either.
 
for thoes of you who think we are such supporters of Israel:

The United States and Russia are bidding hard against each other to give the Lebanese army heavy weapons, a contest which Israeli diplomacy has failed to deter, DEBKAfile's military sources report.

Defense ministry official Amos Gilead arrived in Moscow Friday, Dec. 19 only to watch his train leaving the station: Sophisticated Russian S-300 air defense systems were already speeding toward Tehran to guard its nuclear sites and MiG-29 fighter jets had been pledged to Lebanon.

In Washington, too, Israeli diplomats pleaded in vain with Bush administration leaders to refrain from giving Lebanon tanks and a fleet of combat helicopters. Ten Cobras have led the way. They argued that there are no safeguards against American hardware falling into the hands of the Lebanese terrorist Hizballah, whose leaders vowed again Friday to destroy the Jewish state by launching a regional conflagration.

The spillover has a precedent: In the Israel-Hizballah war of 2006, the Lebanese army, then only lightly armed, let the Shiite terrorists fire missiles at Israel's Mediterranean naval ships from its coastal radar positions.

Next time round, Israel faces a far tougher, upgraded arsenal of anti-air missiles made in Iran and Russia -supplied in the last two years by Tehran and Damascus, plus the new influx of US-made tanks and helicopters.

Israel's strategic standing has thus been allowed to drop another notch thanks to the spineless incompetence of Israel's current leaders, Ehud Olmert, Tzipi Livni and Ehud Barak.

David Hale of the state department announced the US package for Lebanon Friday, Dec. 19, while denying Washington was competing with Moscow after the Russians gave Beirut a gift of 10 MiG fighters. After meeting Lebanese prime minister Fouad Siniora in Beirut, Hale said that, in addition to M-50 Supersherman tanks, the US package under preparation included "air support capabilities (helicopters) with precision weapons and urban combat gear." He did not go into numbers or types of weaponry.

The US was helping the Lebanese army "to maintain internal security and fighting terrorism in Lebanon," Hale said.

On Dec. 12, DEBKAfile reported exclusively that al Qaeda had relocated some of its Iraq terror force to Lebanon and that UNIFIL's peacemakers had been placed on the alert in the southern Sidon-Ain Hilwa region where the incoming jihadis were preparing attacks for Lebanon and across the border into Israel as well.

For article, click HERE.

American official visits to Beirut have become more frequent in recent weeks.

In late November, the head of the US Central Command, Gen. David Petraeus, held talks with Lebanese leaders, followed on Dec. 10, by the coordinator of anti-terror operations at the state department, Dell Dailey.

The last arrival, Hale, may choose to play down the competition with Moscow, but DEBKAfile's military sources see American and Russian military instructors working cheek by jowl to teach the Lebanese army how to use their respective weapons, especially air defense tactics. Close competition in these circumstances is bound to lead to the piling on of advanced hardware offers by the contestants. The big American military mission in Beirut at the moment will no doubt be followed by a Russian delegation of comparable size.

Washington has not prevented Moscow from building up a rival military presence in Lebanon capital, a development in which Israel has a high security stake. Whereas Russia's strategic orbit focused earlier on new naval bases in Syria's Mediterranean ports of Latakia and Tartous, it has since stretched to a military foothold 250 km to the south, right up to Israel's back door from Lebanon.

While the tanks America is giving Lebanon are ageing models, Israeli military experts comment that they form the nucleus of the Lebanese army's first tank corps, along with its first helicopters – two valuable resources coming within the Hizballah's grasp and in whose use Iranian officers will quickly instruct them.

DEBKAfile also reveals that a group of Hizballah operatives recently paid a secret visit to Moscow and asked for Russian hardware. The Russians did not respond. But by supplying the Lebanese army with heavy equipment along with experts and instructors, it has opened the way for these assets to be diverted to the Shiite terrorists.

Jerusalem is too busy spinning fairy tales about the feasibility of peace with Syria to pay proper attention to the hectic, hostile activity on Israel's northern border.
http://www.debka.com/article.php?aid=1370
 
Chapdog said:
for thoes of you who think we are such supporters of Israel:

The United States and Russia are bidding hard against each other to give the Lebanese army heavy weapons, a contest which Israeli diplomacy has failed to deter, DEBKAfile's military sources report.

Defense ministry official Amos Gilead arrived in Moscow Friday, Dec. 19 only to watch his train leaving the station: Sophisticated Russian S-300 air defense systems were already speeding toward Tehran to guard its nuclear sites and MiG-29 fighter jets had been pledged to Lebanon.

In Washington, too, Israeli diplomats pleaded in vain with Bush administration leaders to refrain from giving Lebanon tanks and a fleet of combat helicopters. Ten Cobras have led the way. They argued that there are no safeguards against American hardware falling into the hands of the Lebanese terrorist Hizballah, whose leaders vowed again Friday to destroy the Jewish state by launching a regional conflagration.

The spillover has a precedent: In the Israel-Hizballah war of 2006, the Lebanese army, then only lightly armed, let the Shiite terrorists fire missiles at Israel's Mediterranean naval ships from its coastal radar positions.

Next time round, Israel faces a far tougher, upgraded arsenal of anti-air missiles made in Iran and Russia -supplied in the last two years by Tehran and Damascus, plus the new influx of US-made tanks and helicopters.

Israel's strategic standing has thus been allowed to drop another notch thanks to the spineless incompetence of Israel's current leaders, Ehud Olmert, Tzipi Livni and Ehud Barak.

David Hale of the state department announced the US package for Lebanon Friday, Dec. 19, while denying Washington was competing with Moscow after the Russians gave Beirut a gift of 10 MiG fighters. After meeting Lebanese prime minister Fouad Siniora in Beirut, Hale said that, in addition to M-50 Supersherman tanks, the US package under preparation included "air support capabilities (helicopters) with precision weapons and urban combat gear." He did not go into numbers or types of weaponry.

The US was helping the Lebanese army "to maintain internal security and fighting terrorism in Lebanon," Hale said.

On Dec. 12, DEBKAfile reported exclusively that al Qaeda had relocated some of its Iraq terror force to Lebanon and that UNIFIL's peacemakers had been placed on the alert in the southern Sidon-Ain Hilwa region where the incoming jihadis were preparing attacks for Lebanon and across the border into Israel as well.

For article, click HERE.

American official visits to Beirut have become more frequent in recent weeks.

In late November, the head of the US Central Command, Gen. David Petraeus, held talks with Lebanese leaders, followed on Dec. 10, by the coordinator of anti-terror operations at the state department, Dell Dailey.

The last arrival, Hale, may choose to play down the competition with Moscow, but DEBKAfile's military sources see American and Russian military instructors working cheek by jowl to teach the Lebanese army how to use their respective weapons, especially air defense tactics. Close competition in these circumstances is bound to lead to the piling on of advanced hardware offers by the contestants. The big American military mission in Beirut at the moment will no doubt be followed by a Russian delegation of comparable size.

Washington has not prevented Moscow from building up a rival military presence in Lebanon capital, a development in which Israel has a high security stake. Whereas Russia's strategic orbit focused earlier on new naval bases in Syria's Mediterranean ports of Latakia and Tartous, it has since stretched to a military foothold 250 km to the south, right up to Israel's back door from Lebanon.

While the tanks America is giving Lebanon are ageing models, Israeli military experts comment that they form the nucleus of the Lebanese army's first tank corps, along with its first helicopters – two valuable resources coming within the Hizballah's grasp and in whose use Iranian officers will quickly instruct them.

DEBKAfile also reveals that a group of Hizballah operatives recently paid a secret visit to Moscow and asked for Russian hardware. The Russians did not respond. But by supplying the Lebanese army with heavy equipment along with experts and instructors, it has opened the way for these assets to be diverted to the Shiite terrorists.

Jerusalem is too busy spinning fairy tales about the feasibility of peace with Syria to pay proper attention to the hectic, hostile activity on Israel's northern border.
http://www.debka.com/article.php?aid=1370
Click to expand...



So we don't support israel?
 
leaningright said:
Honestly I don't know what folks want us (Barak Obama) to do. IMO Israel shouldn't even exist as a nation in that part of the world. I think they were placed there by religiously misguided people in the 40's and continue to be supported partly by religiously misguided people today. But that doesn't change the fact that they are there and are the targets of terrorist attacks and bombs being lobbed into their country. What is Obama going to do? Allow the destruction and deplacement of Israel. I don't think so. So the fighting goes on, as sad as it is.....all because our politcians from the 40's onward are trying to help God out. It is truly a bad situation and I don't have the answers and don't think anyone else does either.
Click to expand...

Olam Ha Ba or Bust!
 
Global Human Rights Groups Protest Slaughter in Gaza

On June 16, 2008, noted Israeli historian Ilan Pappe explained "The Israeli Recipe for 2008: Genocide in Gaza, Ethnic Cleaning in the West Bank." He wrote:

"Not long ago, I claimed that Israel is employing genocidal policies in the Gaza Strip." After re-thinking this highly-charged term, he "concluded with even stronger conviction: it is the only appropriate way to describe what the Israeli army is doing in Gaza" because of its repeated atrocities now greater than ever.

In his January 3 "Israel's Righteous Fury and Its Victims in Gaza" article, Pappe updates his outrage:

Once again, "Israel is engulfed....with righteous fury that translates into destructive policy in the Gaza Strip. This appalling self-justification for the inhumanity and impunity....is based first and foremost on sheer lies transmitted with a newspeak reminiscent of (Nazi Germany). Every half an hour," radio and TV bulletins call Gaza victims "terrorists and Israel's massive (slaughter) self-defense."

Israel is the righteous victim. Gazan men, women, and children "a great evil....There are no boundaries to the hypocrisy....It seems that even the most horrendous crimes, such as the genocide in Gaza, are treated as discrete events, unconnected to anything (from the past) and not associated with any ideology or system."

Today, as Israel slaughters Gazans, "world outrage continues to resonate - on city streets, by solidarity activists, and by human rights groups globally....By connecting Zionist ideology and the policies of the past with the present atrocities, we will be able to provide a clear and logical explanation (to galvanize) public opinion not only against the present genocidal policies in Gaza, but hopefully (to) prevent future atrocities."

Most important is to "puncture the balloon of self-righteous fury that suffocates the Palestinians every time it inflates (and) end Western immunity to Israel's impunity." Without it, "more people in Israel (America and everywhere) will see the real nature of (these) crimes" so their fury will be directed where it belongs.

The Global BDS Movement

The BDS (Boycott, Divestment and Sanctions for Palestine) Movement demands: "Stop the Massacre in Gaza - Boycott Israel Now." From Occupied Ramallah, it reported on the bloodbath, "far more ruthless than all its predecessors," the slaughter of innocent civilians, young children going to and from school, "an act of genocide against the 1.5 million Palestinians in the occupied coastal strip. Israel seems intent to mark the end of its 60th (anniversary year) the same way it established itself - perpetuating massacres against the Palestinian people."

More than ever, the BDS Movement calls on international civil society to condemn the massacre, join its efforts to end Israel's impunity, and hold it accountable for its persistent crimes of war and against humanity.

UN General Assembly President, Miguel D'Escoto Brockman agrees, and in a recent address before the Assembly said:

"More than twenty years ago we in the United Nations took the lead from civil society when we agreed that sanctions were required to provide a nonviolent means of pressuring South Africa to end its violations. Today, perhaps we....should consider following the lead of a new generation of civil society, who are calling for a similar campaign of boycott, divestment and sanctions to pressure Israel to end its violations."

Israeli writer/activist Uri Avnery founded Gush Shalom ("The Peace Bloc") in 1993 "to influence Israeli public opinion and lead it towards peace and conciliation with the Palestinian people." He calls the killing and destruction in Gaza "a vicious folly of a bankrupt government (that) let itself be dragged by adventurous officers and cheap nationalist demagoguery (into a futile conflict that) will bring no solution to any problem" - either to Israel or "besieged Gaza."

He says Israel, not Hamas, broke the truce, and the IDF followed up with "calculated raids and killings....The war in Gaza is (Ehud) Barak's elections campaign, a cynical attempt to buy votes with the blood and suffering" of Gazans.

-- more at link
OpEdNews » Global Human Rights Groups Protest Slaughter in Gaza

Anti-Israel Protests Target US Firms, Jewish Businesses
http://money.cnn.com/news/newsfeeds/articles/djhighlights/200901090708
DOWJONESDJONLINE000485.htm

UK company boycotts Israeli consumers

Israeli computer engineer discovers he cannot order scarf online from London-based Pashmina company because it has joined Muslim consumer boycott against IDF operation in Gaza

-- more at link
UK company boycotts Israeli consumers - Israel Money, Ynetnews

British telecom firm severs ties with Israeli counterparts

UK's FreedomCall informs Israeli company of decision via email, blames Gaza operation

British telecommunications firm FreedomCall has terminated its cooperation with Israel's MobileMax due to the IDF operation in Gaza.

"We received an email from the British company informing us that it is severing all ties with us and any other Israeli company following Israel's strike in Gaza," said CEO Raanan Cohen.

"We weren't expecting this from them and there was no prior warning. I don't intend to appeal to them or answer the letter."

The email from FreedomCall said, "As a result of the Israeli government action in the last few days we will no longer be in a position to consider doing business with yourself or any other Israeli company."

MobileMax, established in 2004, produces a program providing cellular phones with inexpensive international service.
British telecom firm severs ties with Israeli counterparts - Israel Money, Ynetnews

With rising unemployment in the US, the timing is perfect to boycott US made products as well.
 
We need more senators who think like BAC and Darla. We should cut off isreal. Those fuckers are rich. And shut down most of the hunndreds of foreign bases we have costing us trillions.
 
Topspin said:
We need more senators who think like BAC and Darla. We should cut off isreal. Those fuckers are rich. And shut down most of the hunndreds of foreign bases we have costing us trillions.
Click to expand...

And me, we need more senators who think like me.

I mean, damn, Im even denied credit for being anti-semitic? Sweet moses.
 
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