Italian scientist reproduces Shroud of Turin

I'll spank your dumb ass on any topic you choose .. and you know it.

You didn't address my question, which I can only assume means you deny that Jesus was a historical person, but you know the overwhelming evidence is against you. In other words, when reality doesn't fit with your ideology, you ignore reality ... that's what every socialist does.
 
You didn't address my question, which I can only assume means you deny that Jesus was a historical person, but you know the overwhelming evidence is against you. In other words, when reality doesn't fit with your ideology, you ignore reality ... that's what every socialist does.

Here is the reality about the Ararat anomaly .... It sits on a moving glacier.

4,500 years .. moving glacier.

Is this your Noah's Ark?

317nark.jpg


NOTHING conclusive has ever been found to indicate this was the Ark of legend other than the legend itself.

How about this from ChristianAnswers

Over the last two decades the search for Noah's Ark has received international attention. Dozens of expeditions to the Ararat region of eastern Turkey, mostly by American Christian groups, have led to numerous claims - but no proof.

According to the Bible, Noah's Ark was a large barge constructed of wood and sealed with bitumen. Its overall dimensions were at least 450 feet long, 75 feet wide and 45 feet high with three interior decks. A “window” appeared to be constructed around the top (Genesis 6:14-16). Incidentally, the overall size of the Ark makes it the largest seagoing vessel known before the 20th century, and its proportions are amazingly similar to the large ocean liners of today.

The Bible says Noah's boat came to rest on “the mountains of Ararat” (Genesis 8:4). “Ararat” probably designated a region (the ancient kingdom of Urartu) and not a specific mountain peak. After Noah and his family left the Ark on the mountain, the boat virtually disappeared from the pages of the Bible. Later Biblical writers never suggested they knew it could still be seen.

The mountain called Ararat today is more like a mountain range with twin peaks. Interestingly, there have been numerous reports throughout history of a large boat on a mountain in this region. Earliest references (beginning in the 3rd century B.C.) suggested it was common knowledge that the Ark could still be viewed on Mount Ararat.

Reports over the past century range from visits to the vessel, to recovery of wooden timber, to aerial photographs. It is generally believed that at least large part of the Ark is intact, not on the highest peak, but somewhere above the 10,000 foot level. Apparently encased in snow and ice for most of the year, only during certain warm summers can the structure be witnessed or accessed. Some have spoken of climbing onto the roof, others say they have walked inside.

In the 1980s, “ark-eology” was given an air of respectability with the active participation of former NASA astronaut James Irwin in expeditions up the mountain. In addition, Ark investigation was also given a boost with the breakup of the former Soviet Union, because the mountain was right on the Turkey-Soviet border. Expeditions up the mountain had been considered a security threat by the Soviet government.

Unfortunately, return visits to proposed sites have produced no further evidence, the whereabouts of all photographs are presently unknown, and different sightings do not suggest the same location on the mountain. Furthermore, Astronaut James Irwin has since died, a purported eyewitness has recently recanted publicly, and there have been few new expeditions up the mountain in the 1990s. Further expeditions have taken place in the new millennium, but no proof of the Ark has yet been found.
http://www.christiananswers.net/q-abr/abr-a001.html

CHRISTIAN ANSWERS

As for the historical Jesus, a teacher .. yes, I do believe a historical Jesus did exist .. but the historical one was not the Son of God. A mythical Jesus was designed by christians and Constantine that patterned the myths of ancient religions .. and the life of Hercules .. complete with ressurection.

All christians know of Jesus is from birth to 12 years old and 3 years from 30 to 33?

Many accounts suggest the historical Jesus travelled to the east during those "lost years."

Are you aware of how many Jesus figures there were before Jesus?

Do I believe a historical Jesus existed .. yes.

Do I beleive he was the Son of God .. Hell no.
 
not the least of which is re-populating the world from 8 people
????...isn't it the understanding of secular liberals that we originally populated the world from two single cell creatures?......what's so hard about doing it with 8 people?....seems like a considerable head start to me......
 
Additionally, religion is for the most part, just passed down mythology, and most of christianity comes from Mythraism.
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sorry BAC, you just lost all the credibility you spent pages building up....this single comment demonstrates you are as ignorant of history as anyone you've been complaining about......
 
Does anyone remember seeing pictures of Jesus that looked anything like this?

picture.php


But this is closer to reality than the tall, fair-skinned, blue eyed man with long flowing hair that we commonly see.
 
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????...isn't it the understanding of secular liberals that we originally populated the world from two single cell creatures?......what's so hard about doing it with 8 people?....seems like a considerable head start to me......

The best estimates for when the "Noah's Ark" thing would have happened is between 2100 and 2500 BCE.

8 people to populate the world in 4500 years? Your comparison to the theory of evolution is laughable, considering that the single celled organisms that started it all would have appeared between 3.8 & 4 billion years ago.
 
Just to play devil's advocate here: :rolleyes:

Ancient civilizations that have been discovered all over the world refer to a time or times where the "world" as they new it was flooded out or burned. The "faithful" heeded the word of God or God's, and took appropriate measures to survive. I don't off hand know of any that refered to other cultures, people or nations that weren't in their geographical realm of experience. And let's not forget the physical evidence our modern day scientist reveal that much of what is now mountains and deserts were once under water (or damned near) millions of years ago.

Something happened, and the recordings that survived were religious allegories that are expected to be taken literally...

The ever popular Judeo-Christian take on the history of the world leaves out a LOT....like dinosaurs, the Cro-magnons, stuff like that. But once you sift through the muck, there are some global truths there.

amazing....the first time since I arrived that Taiche posted something intelligent and he did while posing as the devil's advocate.....
 
then how do you explain the fact that virtually every civilization in the world has a recollection of a tremendous killing flood in it's lore?.......

Floods are common. Religion trying to use fear to control a population is also common.

If there was a planetary flood, where did the water go? Because currently there is not enough water to cover the planet, even if you melt the icecaps.

How did the multitude of species survive? You cannot possibly claim that every speciesof land animal on earth was put on a single boat?
 
The best estimates for when the "Noah's Ark" thing would have happened is between 2100 and 2500 BCE.

lol, who's estimate?.....Ussher's?.....it could as easily have occurred in 25,000 B.C.......there are some who think that because Genesis 3 is the next page after Genesis 2 that Adam and Eve could only have spent 48 hours in the Garden before they sinned.....the Bible makes no such statement about when the events of early Genesis occurred.....
 
lol, who's estimate?.....Ussher's?.....it could as easily have occurred in 25,000 B.C.......there are some who think that because Genesis 3 is the next page after Genesis 2 that Adam and Eve could only have spent 48 hours in the Garden before they sinned.....the Bible makes no such statement about when the events of early Genesis occurred.....

And it could just as easily be explained with "It was God's will, so it happened".
 
If there was a planetary flood, where did the water go? Because currently there is not enough water to cover the planet, even if you melt the icecaps.

a planetary flood was unnecessary, you only needed enough water to drown every living human....why do you assume that one of them managed to climb to the top of Mt Everest and God had to provide enough water to wash him off?....

How did the multitude of species survive? You cannot possibly claim that every speciesof land animal on earth was put on a single boat?
lol, I thought you believed in evolution......since there are 37million species of beetles today do you assume there were 37 million species of beetles then?.....what did they need, a couple of canines, a couple of felines, a couple of bovines?.....
 
so, when faced with scientific possibilities, you decide to base your argument on nothing more than mysticism?........

When faced with scientific possibilities I will listen.

But when faced with vague attempts at facts, I ignore it. Just a couple of felines would produce the huge variety of cats today?

You are insisting that it would be possible to gather enough animals on one boat to have all the species we have today?

Considering how long ago the australian continent separated from the major land mass, Noah saving the animals there is not feasible.
 
Just a couple of felines would produce the huge variety of cats today?

when did man start domesticating dogs?.....we have St. Bernards and Chihuahuas....they were both wolves what, 3000, 5000, 7000 years ago?.....and that's taking in consideration a human designer unsure of his results (not to mention the secular concept of evolution, which needs millions of years of trial and error)......shucks, I figure a truly intelligent designer could pull if off in a half dozen generations at the most.....
 
He was a Jew, which is a unique ethnicity.

considering the fact that the eastern edge of the Mediterranean was a passageway of choice for nearly every people in Asia, Africa, and Europe I suspect the natives of that area are likely to be the least "unique" ethnicity in the entire world.....

and that also is why I believe God chose that area uniquely representative of all humanity to be his "birthplace"....rather than Norway, the center of sub-sahara Africa, or Mongolia.....
 
considering the fact that the eastern edge of the Mediterranean was a passageway of choice for nearly every people in Asia, Africa, and Europe I suspect the natives of that area are likely to be the least "unique" ethnicity in the entire world.....

and that also is why I believe God chose that area uniquely representative of all humanity to be his "birthplace"....rather than Norway, the center of sub-sahara Africa, or Mongolia.....
Yet Joseph's lineage can be traced back many generations, and ethnic mixing with Jews at that time in history was a rarity. I suspect that Jesus looked pretty similar to other Jews of that period: dark curly hair, brown eyes, olive complexion.
 
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