Looking forward to reducing the power of the EPA

Not one of you nay sayers has answered my basic question except Damo. What the fuck do you know about EPA that you didn't learn from a Michigan Militia flyer?
 
Superfreak said:
by the way... do you ever get tired of your constant attempts to try to demean the sources of articles rather than actually discussing them?

I suppose the Washington Times is not good enough for you either? Neither are the others from the two separate links provided???

You are such a complete hack. Go drink some more kool aid
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I read the separate links. What they reveal is that NASA is not perfect and when errors are pointed out they are promptly corrected. I see those links as evidence that NASA is transparent with its data such that opponents can check their work and call NASA out where errors are made. That's healthy and appropriate, even coming from CEI.

That Washington Times "article" is an entirely different matter. The entire basis for the Times article is that some guy at CEI says that he "suspects" that NASA scientists have engaged in "data shaving," although he has zero grounds to support it. Basically, he's saying that because some scientists somewhere did some bad thing, he "suspects" that all scientists everywhere have done the same bad thing. I wouldn't accept that at face value from anyone anywhere. The fact that he's from CEI doesn't help matters.

Additionally, I don't automatically discount a source when they report factual matters that are supported and supportable. I do discount sources when they say things that are either pure matters of opinion or based on pure speculation. This falls into the latter category.

Finally, I'd like to see the internal emails and correspondence at the CEI pertaining to climate change matters. Surely those calling for disclosure are willing to do what they ask of others, right?
 
NigelTufnel said:
I read the separate links. What they reveal is that NASA is not perfect and when errors are pointed out they are promptly corrected. I see those links as evidence that NASA is transparent with its data such that opponents can check their work and call NASA out where errors are made. That's healthy and appropriate, even coming from CEI.

That Washington Times "article" is an entirely different matter. The entire basis for the Times article is that some guy at CEI says that he "suspects" that NASA scientists have engaged in "data shaving," although he has zero grounds to support it. Basically, he's saying that because some scientists somewhere did some bad thing, he "suspects" that all scientists everywhere have done the same bad thing. I wouldn't accept that at face value from anyone anywhere. The fact that he's from CEI doesn't help matters.

Additionally, I don't automatically discount a source when they report factual matters that are supported and supportable. I do discount sources when they say things that are either pure matters of opinion or based on pure speculation. This falls into the latter category.

Finally, I'd like to see the internal emails and correspondence at the CEI pertaining to climate change matters. Surely those calling for disclosure are willing to do what they ask of others, right?
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Isn't the Washington Times owned by the Moonies?
 
NigelTufnel said:
I read the separate links. What they reveal is that NASA is not perfect and when errors are pointed out they are promptly corrected. I see those links as evidence that NASA is transparent with its data such that opponents can check their work and call NASA out where errors are made. That's healthy and appropriate, even coming from CEI.

That Washington Times "article" is an entirely different matter. The entire basis for the Times article is that some guy at CEI says that he "suspects" that NASA scientists have engaged in "data shaving," although he has zero grounds to support it. Basically, he's saying that because some scientists somewhere did some bad thing, he "suspects" that all scientists everywhere have done the same bad thing. I wouldn't accept that at face value from anyone anywhere. The fact that he's from CEI doesn't help matters.

Additionally, I don't automatically discount a source when they report factual matters that are supported and supportable. I do discount sources when they say things that are either pure matters of opinion or based on pure speculation. This falls into the latter category.

Finally, I'd like to see the internal emails and correspondence at the CEI pertaining to climate change matters. Surely those calling for disclosure are willing to do what they ask of others, right?
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yes... you see them correct their errors after the people checking their data had to fight to get access to the data....


why does it continue to take so long for the data to be released???? What legitimate scientist would CONTINUE to see his department make one error after another, continue to fight/stall release of the underlying data and methods of 'adjustment'?

http://epw.senate.gov/public/index....a-23ad-43c4-70550d05c3a2&Region_id=&Issue_id=

LMAO... if you don't know the difference between releasing the data behind the scientific 'studies' and releasing emails, then you should simply go back to drinking your kool aid.

If the CEI is releasing climate studies then they should most certainly be held to the same standard of releasing all supporting data and methods used.
 
Taichiliberal said:
And you miss the point...it was the Shrub's administration that IGNORED the report. Hell, recall all the flack caused when it was revealed that the Shrub & company were altering reports.
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I'm not missing a point. I personally don't care which admin did what. All these alphabet agencies are suspect in their constitutionality anyway, but as it stands, all of them have more power than they are supposed to have. They should all be done away with.
 
SmarterThanYou said:
43. does a persons age influence your appraisal of their opinions?
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No, but it gives me some perspective. You would be old enough then to understand what it was like in this nation pre-EPA then. That you could get away with a Love Canal or a Valley of the Drums, that rivers could catch on fire and most of the fish in navigable waters you couldn't eat which was ok cause they were pretty much all dead anyways and how you can go to Pittsburgh and tell which houses were built prior to the CAA or that in the past you could of had your head up your ass and it would smell better than Youngstown, OH. Not to mention there were no treatment standards for managing hazardous waste. Just dig a hole in the ground and throw it in and and fuck the neighbors when their kids died from liver cancer due to the Methyl Ethyl Ketone you contaminated their water with. Let's not forget you could smell the south shores of lake Erie and Michigan 20 miles before you got to them and that they you had to wade through 20 yards of dead fish to get to the water. Then there was all those days where LA, Houston and Denver were covered in smog. When was the last time we saw that? Oh yea, prior to the CAA. God Damn That EPA!

So go ahead and tell me what little you know about EPA.
 
Mott the Hoople said:
No, but it gives me some perspective. You would be old enough then to understand what it was like in this nation pre-EPA then. That you could get away with a Love Canal or a Valley of the Drums, that rivers could catch on fire and most of the fish in navigable waters you couldn't eat which was ok cause they were pretty much all dead anyways and how you can go to Pittsburgh and tell which houses were built prior to the CAA or that in the past you could of had your head up your ass and it would smell better than Youngstown, OH. Not to mention there were no treatment standards for managing hazardous waste. Just dig a hole in the ground and throw it in and and fuck the neighbors when their kids died from liver cancer due to the Methyl Ethyl Ketone you contaminated their water with. Let's not forget you could smell the south shores of lake Erie and Michigan 20 miles before you got to them and that they you had to wade through 20 yards of dead fish to get to the water. Then there was all those days where LA, Houston and Denver were covered in smog. When was the last time we saw that? Oh yea, prior to the CAA. God Damn That EPA!

So go ahead and tell me what little you know about EPA.
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But we have lawsuits to take care of that.
 
Mott the Hoople said:
No, but it gives me some perspective. You would be old enough then to understand what it was like in this nation pre-EPA then. That you could get away with a Love Canal or a Valley of the Drums, that rivers could catch on fire and most of the fish in navigable waters you couldn't eat which was ok cause they were pretty much all dead anyways and how you can go to Pittsburgh and tell which houses were built prior to the CAA or that in the past you could of had your head up your ass and it would smell better than Youngstown, OH. Not to mention there were no treatment standards for managing hazardous waste. Just dig a hole in the ground and throw it in and and fuck the neighbors when their kids died from liver cancer due to the Methyl Ethyl Ketone you contaminated their water with. Let's not forget you could smell the south shores of lake Erie and Michigan 20 miles before you got to them and that they you had to wade through 20 yards of dead fish to get to the water. Then there was all those days where LA, Houston and Denver were covered in smog. When was the last time we saw that? Oh yea, prior to the CAA. God Damn That EPA!

So go ahead and tell me what little you know about EPA.
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He didn't see the value of a college education, you expect him to buy into the EPA value.:clink:
 
Mott the Hoople said:
No, but it gives me some perspective. You would be old enough then to understand what it was like in this nation pre-EPA then. That you could get away with a Love Canal or a Valley of the Drums, that rivers could catch on fire and most of the fish in navigable waters you couldn't eat which was ok cause they were pretty much all dead anyways and how you can go to Pittsburgh and tell which houses were built prior to the CAA or that in the past you could of had your head up your ass and it would smell better than Youngstown, OH. Not to mention there were no treatment standards for managing hazardous waste. Just dig a hole in the ground and throw it in and and fuck the neighbors when their kids died from liver cancer due to the Methyl Ethyl Ketone you contaminated their water with. Let's not forget you could smell the south shores of lake Erie and Michigan 20 miles before you got to them and that they you had to wade through 20 yards of dead fish to get to the water. Then there was all those days where LA, Houston and Denver were covered in smog. When was the last time we saw that? Oh yea, prior to the CAA. God Damn That EPA!

So go ahead and tell me what little you know about EPA.
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here's the thing. I grew up in a little town of 3,000 people. a few creeks, two rivers, and a small lake in my area. One of the rivers was terribly polluted because of a large hog farm upriver. when the barrier to that farm broke, all that hog crap flowed in to the river and killed all the fish. The county sued, won in court, shut them down and sold off all assets to pay for the cleanup and restock of the river. This is how it should be. The EPA did nothing.

so, for what 'little' i know of the EPA....

If they can call carbon dioxide (what we humans exhale during the normal course of us breathing) a pollutant, a gas that plants and trees live off of and use to create oxygen itself.....well that's just plain retarded and shows them to be nothing more than fear mongerers to an uneducated public in order for them to amass more power.
 
SmarterThanYou said:
here's the thing. I grew up in a little town of 3,000 people. a few creeks, two rivers, and a small lake in my area. One of the rivers was terribly polluted because of a large hog farm upriver. when the barrier to that farm broke, all that hog crap flowed in to the river and killed all the fish. The county sued, won in court, shut them down and sold off all assets to pay for the cleanup and restock of the river. This is how it should be. The EPA did nothing.

so, for what 'little' i know of the EPA....

If they can call carbon dioxide (what we humans exhale during the normal course of us breathing) a pollutant, a gas that plants and trees live off of and use to create oxygen itself.....well that's just plain retarded and shows them to be nothing more than fear mongerers to an uneducated public in order for them to amass more power.
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Dude, anythign, ANYTHING, in a excess that upsets ecosystems and the biosphere is a pollutant. That includes oxygen and nitrgen too.
 
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