Air India plane crash investigation suggests pilots may have made a fatal mistake just after takeoff

S

serendipity

Verified User
Investigators probing the deadly Air India crash that killed 260 people last month are focusing on the actions of the cockpit crew, with early assessments indicating no apparent fault with the Boeing 787 Dreamliner.

Preliminary findings suggest switches that control fuel flow to the aircraft's twin engines were turned off shortly after takeoff. This caused the jet to lose thrust, according to sources familiar with the US side of the investigation.

In aviation, the switches are used to start or shut down the engines and are typically left on during flight.

It remains unclear why they were turned off, and investigators have been left wondering whether it was deliberate, accidental or corrected too late.

According to a report in the Wall Street Journal, one potential sign that the switches were off was the deployment of the plane's emergency power system, a ram air turbine or RAT.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...tml?ito=native_share_article-nativemenubutton to
 
serendipity said:
Investigators probing the deadly Air India crash that killed 260 people last month are focusing on the actions of the cockpit crew, with early assessments indicating no apparent fault with the Boeing 787 Dreamliner.

Preliminary findings suggest switches that control fuel flow to the aircraft's twin engines were turned off shortly after takeoff. This caused the jet to lose thrust, according to sources familiar with the US side of the investigation.

In aviation, the switches are used to start or shut down the engines and are typically left on during flight.

It remains unclear why they were turned off, and investigators have been left wondering whether it was deliberate, accidental or corrected too late.

According to a report in the Wall Street Journal, one potential sign that the switches were off was the deployment of the plane's emergency power system, a ram air turbine or RAT.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...tml?ito=native_share_article-nativemenubutton to
Click to expand...
I'm thinking they had one engine failure and mistakenly turned the wrong engine off.
 
serendipity said:
A preliminary report on the Air India crash in June has found that both fuel control switches were in the cut-off position moments before the plane crashed in Ahmedabad.
Click to expand...
It appears that the investigators are incompetent morons. OK, we know that the fuel switches were turned off. Instead of projecting current confusion onto the pilots, investigators should be considering all scenarios that would lead a pilot to shut off the fuel switches and report on that.
 
Hawkeye10 said:
A lie.....the Ukrainians did it.
Click to expand...

I believe a Ukrainian pilot shot down an aircraft alleged to be MH 17. I've just heard that the aircraft may not in fact have been MH 17. Regardless, Russia certainly doesn't support the western conclusions as to who downed the aircraft alleged to be MH 17. The following RT article from May of this year gets into Russia's stance:
www.rt.com

Moscow reacts to UN aviation agency’s MH17 vote

The investigation into the downing of MH17 was deeply flawed, Russia has said
www.rt.com www.rt.com
 
serendipity said:
Investigators probing the deadly Air India crash that killed 260 people last month are focusing on the actions of the cockpit crew, with early assessments indicating no apparent fault with the Boeing 787 Dreamliner.

Preliminary findings suggest switches that control fuel flow to the aircraft's twin engines were turned off shortly after takeoff. This caused the jet to lose thrust, according to sources familiar with the US side of the investigation.

In aviation, the switches are used to start or shut down the engines and are typically left on during flight.

It remains unclear why they were turned off, and investigators have been left wondering whether it was deliberate, accidental or corrected too late.

According to a report in the Wall Street Journal, one potential sign that the switches were off was the deployment of the plane's emergency power system, a ram air turbine or RAT.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...tml?ito=native_share_article-nativemenubutton to
Click to expand...

Epoch Times revealed an interesting exchange between the pilot and co-pilot and the immediate aftermath:
**
In the plane’s cockpit voice recording, one pilot was heard asking the other why he had cut off the fuel switches, to which the copilot responded that “he did not do so,” according to the report.

Airport surveillance footage showed that the Ram Air Turbine—a small turbine on aircraft that serves as an alternate power source—was deployed during the plane’s initial climb just after takeoff. Flight AI171 began losing altitude before it crossed the airport perimeter wall, the report said.

“When fuel control switches are moved from CUTOFF to RUN while the aircraft is inflight, each engines full authority dual engine control automatically manages a relight and thrust recovery sequence of ignition and fuel introduction,” it stated.

Both engines showed signs of relighting, but one failed to arrest core speed deceleration. One of the pilots transmitted “Mayday, Mayday, Mayday” before the plane crashed outside the airport boundary, according to the report.
**

Source:
www.theepochtimes.com

Fuel to Air India Plane Was Cut Off Before Fatal Crash: Preliminary Report

In the plane’s cockpit voice recording, one pilot was heard asking the other why the fuel switches were turned off.
www.theepochtimes.com www.theepochtimes.com


Questions I have- could the fuel switch have been sabotaged? Or perhaps glitched?
 
Scott said:
I believe a Ukrainian pilot shot down an aircraft alleged to be MH 17. I've just heard that the aircraft may not in fact have been MH 17. Regardless, Russia certainly doesn't support the western conclusions as to who downed the aircraft alleged to be MH 17. The following RT article from May of this year gets into Russia's stance:
www.rt.com

Moscow reacts to UN aviation agency’s MH17 vote

The investigation into the downing of MH17 was deeply flawed, Russia has said
www.rt.com www.rt.com
Click to expand...
I forget the story but there is no doubt that the Ukrainians did it and the "experts" decided to blame Russia knowing that this is a lie. I dont remember if the Ukrainians did it by accident or on purpose.
 
Scott said:
Epoch Times revealed an interesting exchange between the pilot and co-pilot and the immediate aftermath:
**
In the plane’s cockpit voice recording, one pilot was heard asking the other why he had cut off the fuel switches, to which the copilot responded that “he did not do so,” according to the report.

Airport surveillance footage showed that the Ram Air Turbine—a small turbine on aircraft that serves as an alternate power source—was deployed during the plane’s initial climb just after takeoff. Flight AI171 began losing altitude before it crossed the airport perimeter wall, the report said.

“When fuel control switches are moved from CUTOFF to RUN while the aircraft is inflight, each engines full authority dual engine control automatically manages a relight and thrust recovery sequence of ignition and fuel introduction,” it stated.

Both engines showed signs of relighting, but one failed to arrest core speed deceleration. One of the pilots transmitted “Mayday, Mayday, Mayday” before the plane crashed outside the airport boundary, according to the report.
**

Source:
www.theepochtimes.com

Fuel to Air India Plane Was Cut Off Before Fatal Crash: Preliminary Report

In the plane’s cockpit voice recording, one pilot was heard asking the other why the fuel switches were turned off.
www.theepochtimes.com www.theepochtimes.com


Questions I have- could the fuel switch have been sabotaged? Or perhaps glitched?
Click to expand...
This is the cockpit of a 787.

27448568185_a0f1c338c9_k.jpg

The two large white topped handles in the middle are the throttles. The lever to the right of them is for flaps. The fuel switches for the engines are just below the throttles. They're the two darker ones just to the right of those two red switches. Up (towards the throttles is "Run" and down is "Cutoff."

I can't see how you'd turn both fuel switches off by accident. There's nothing near them that you'd have to touch during takeoff. The throttle handles are well above them. If the switches were both turned off the action would almost certainly have to be deliberate. The only time during a flight where flicking them off and killing the engines, as happened with this flight, is at the time it did happen. The plane can't recover and crashes. If it were higher and moving faster with the gear and flaps up, recovery through a relight would occur.
 
Scott said:
I believe a Ukrainian pilot shot down an aircraft alleged to be MH 17. I've just heard that the aircraft may not in fact have been MH 17. Regardless, Russia certainly doesn't support the western conclusions as to who downed the aircraft alleged to be MH 17. The following RT article from May of this year gets into Russia's stance:
www.rt.com

Moscow reacts to UN aviation agency’s MH17 vote

The investigation into the downing of MH17 was deeply flawed, Russia has said
www.rt.com www.rt.com
Click to expand...
It was definitely an S-300 missile. The damage pattern is completely consistent with that finding. Now, who fired on it...

jyim7j1qos491.jpg


What you see are hundreds to thousands of small fragment penetrations from the SAM warhead bursting a short distance from the plane. It would have wrecked the cockpit, killing or wounding the pilots, and the plane goes down.
 
T. A. Gardner said:
This is the cockpit of a 787.

27448568185_a0f1c338c9_k.jpg

The two large white topped handles in the middle are the throttles. The lever to the right of them is for flaps. The fuel switches for the engines are just below the throttles. They're the two darker ones just to the right of those two red switches. Up (towards the throttles is "Run" and down is "Cutoff."

I can't see how you'd turn both fuel switches off by accident. There's nothing near them that you'd have to touch during takeoff. The throttle handles are well above them. If the switches were both turned off the action would almost certainly have to be deliberate. The only time during a flight where flicking them off and killing the engines, as happened with this flight, is at the time it did happen. The plane can't recover and crashes. If it were higher and moving faster with the gear and flaps up, recovery through a relight would occur.
Click to expand...

How likely could it have been a glitch? At this point, I'm even willing to believe that the flight recorder could have been tampered with.
 
Scott said:
How likely could it have been a glitch? At this point, I'm even willing to believe that the flight recorder could have been tampered with.
Click to expand...
There are three options:

1) Lie to cover Air India maintenance

2) Lie to cover Boeing

3) Murder Suicide....which has happened before....for instance Germanwings 9525
 
Scott said:
How likely could it have been a glitch? At this point, I'm even willing to believe that the flight recorder could have been tampered with.
Click to expand...
I can't see how it could have happened accidentally. Both switches turned off at a critical moment when neither pilot should have been messing with the throttles or flaps but focused on getting the wheels up. It clearly isn't a maintenance issue either.

I understand that the flight recorder shows the pilot(s) tried to restart the engines and that was in progress (one or the other turned the fuel back on) and one engine had relit and was coming up to power while the other had just relit when the plane crashed.

So, it appears to be deliberate on the part of one of the cockpit crew.
 
T. A. Gardner said:
It was definitely an S-300 missile. The damage pattern is completely consistent with that finding. Now, who fired on it...

jyim7j1qos491.jpg


What you see are hundreds to thousands of small fragment penetrations from the SAM warhead bursting a short distance from the plane. It would have wrecked the cockpit, killing or wounding the pilots, and the plane goes down.
Click to expand...

I believe I once started a long thread on the evidence as to who downed the plane alleged to be MH 17, as well as whether it was actually MH 17 to begin with. Unfortunately, the site that thread was on has been taken down and apparently even the way back machine never tracked it. My browser still remembers the link, so if you know of another wayback type site that might have it, it's here:

As I usually do with threads, the title was from an article from the American Free Press. That article, at least, is still up:

Who Really Shot Down Malaysian Flight MH17? – American Free Press

americanfreepress.net americanfreepress.net

The article was published soon after the plane alleged to be MH 17 was shot down. Quoting the article's conclusion:
**
When the jetliner was brought down from the sky on July 17, Russia’s Defense Ministry recorded satellite images of a Buk-M1 system operating within the zone of Kiev forces in Eastern Ukraine along the Donetsk border near the MH17 crash site. Radiation from a battery’s Kupol radar, deployed as part of a Buk-M1 battery near Styla (a village some 30 kilometers south of Donetsk) was detected by the Russian military.

But was it even a surface-to-air missile that took the plane down?

Russian Air Force chief Lieutenant General Igor Makushev said that Russian radar had spotted a second aircraft in the ill-fated airliner’s vicinity just before the crash and that it was likely a Ukrainian fighter jet.

A BBC report confirms the general’s claim of a Ukrainian fighter jet.

“The inhabitants of the nearby villages are certain they saw military aircraft in the sky shortly before the catastrophe,” reported the BBC. “According to them, it was the jet fighter that brought down the Boeing.”

“There were two explosions,” a villager told the BBC. She added: “This is how it broke apart,” and then she gestured with her arms. “And there was another aircraft, a military one beside it,” she told the BBC. “Everybody saw it. It was proceeding underneath, below the civilian one.”

“[The fighter jets] use civilian jets to hide behind them,” another villager told the BBC. Eleven people were reportedly killed in his apartment building recently when it was bombed by a Ukrainian fighter jet. “Civilian aircraft are always flying above us,” he said.

Kiev was also in charge of air traffic control once the Malaysian plane was over Ukrainian airspace. Flight 17 was directed about 150 miles north from the usual flight path taken by Malaysian Airlines, for no apparent reason, placing it right into the war zone.

It is unclear still who shot down the plane or why. But one thing is clear: Without a full investigation, it cannot at this point be claimed with any certainty that pro-Russian forces were behind it.
**
 
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