If Obamacare Worked as Promised, No One Would Need Subsidies

Jake Starkey said:
That describes you, Uncensored, and TA. You have no clue as to what socialism is or how ACA works.
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I understand better than you how it works. In brief, there are two parts to Obamacare:

The first is the insurance marketplace. This allows you to buy a policy (4 levels, bronze to platinum) based on the deductible. All four offer essentially the same services. Each county in the US has available providers with a single one being the most common allowing no choice on who you can pick.
Policies are subsidized up to 400% of poverty level. The subsidies were to be covered from a pool of profits the insurers paid into. That has failed to materialize as they never made anywhere close to the level of profit necessary to provide that. Worse, the Democrats used government funds to cover the shortages entirely.
There was also a tax penalty if you were not covered by employer, Medicaid, or an Obamacare policy. The penalty was often far less than the cost of insurance so many younger, healthy people paid that rather than buy a plan. That fed into the lack of profits from policies sold as they overwhelmingly went to those with health issues or older individuals meaning higher payouts.
The tax penalty was HATED by the public and eventually dropped. As for who was covered, in this group somewhere close to 90% of the policies go to those that had individual health insurance prior to Obamacare so they didn't reduce the number of uninsured significantly

On the other side of Obamacare was expanded Medicaid. This covered about 60% of those in the overall plan nationwide, This was purely a subsidized, socialized health insurance plan. The feds were supposed to subsidize it on a declining basis with states taking over almost entirely. That failed to materialize and massive federal subsidies needed to continue, likely forever.
Since the blue states were primarily the ones that bought into that plan, they would be the ones suffering the biggest loses if the federal subsidies ended, which they are about to (end of 2026). This means those states will have to double or triple their state income taxes or other revenue sources to get the money to cover this system. Blue states generally opted in partially or not at all so they can, on the whole, have little problem with federal subsidies ending.
This is the group that significantly increased the number of people ensured.

So, the Democrats set up a fucked-up health insurance scheme that did little or nothing other than raise the cost of health insurance outside employer plans dramatically to astronomically while providing worse coverage and poorer healthcare.


Jake Starkey said:
It's not going away.
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That's too bad because it sucks and is a potential route to national bankruptcy.
 
Uncensored2008 said:
Good analysis - I have only one change - the current healthcare insurance monopoly wrote it - not congress. Particularly Kaiser and Blue Cross, the major beneficiaries of the bill. democrats are mere toadies serving corporate masters.
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In part. I'm sure there were quite a few congressional toadies and insiders that had a say on how the bureaucracy would work too.
 
T. A. Gardner said:
Healthcare was decent and affordable up to WW 2. Then FDR, indirectly, got the government involved and it's been downhill ever since.


Non sequitur.


The US had a great economy coming out of WW 2 because the US was the only heavily industrialized nation on the planet that hadn't been bombed into a crater.


That would be the Democrat's fault, starting with FDR. LBJ was the next big disaster. Nixon, was also a progenitor of much of these problems.


I bet the top 5 to 10% of incomes do. That is in line with how things were in the late 19th century and for much of recorded history.


No, everything is changing much as occurred in the first century of the Industrial revolution. We're going through the Electronics revolution now and that's causing much of the problems just as it did in the last two technological revolutions.


I don't think so. I think Biden in four years was a major fuck up. That's why Trump got elected. People took a look at Biden, then Harris, and thought, Hell no! We don't need four more years of that shit!
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You are so into the cult "philosophy" that there is nothing that can be done to extricate you. American conservatism as presently polluted by the MAGA movement is now the most dangerous force facing humanity.

You people may get your way. If you do, even people as fucked up as you will regret it.

I pity you and the others like you...and I pity those of us who will suffer for what you may be permitted to do.

I think the only advice I can give all of you is: Work on getting rid of your hatred. It is ruling you.
 
The original ACA was a huge compromise. The lobbying power of PHARM, hospitals, doctors and insurance pressed hard to keep power. Obama did what was possible then. he accomp[lished important things that the people loved. There was supposed to be a modification later that would make it even better. The Repugs and Dems, afraid of losing their seats, killed it.
 
Jake Starkey said:
That describes you, Uncensored, and TA. You have no clue as to what socialism is or how ACA works.

It's not going away.
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ObamaCare has already gone away in many respects, Sybil.

Socialism is a fairly new word, though the concepts it embodies are as old as the hills. This word first entered the English lexicon around the early 1800's, stemming from the French socialisme, which means to share, as in property, food, etc.

Socialism is forced sharing. It comes in three major forms:

Fascicm, or the government manipulation of markets. This is the government telling you how to run your business without actually owning the business. It is the government telling you what kind of light bulb you can buy, what kind of toilet you can buy, who you can hire, who you can fire, what your operating hours are, who you must buy your raw materials from, what you can sell your product for, etc. This form of socialism is a stepping stone to the next one, communism.

Communism, or the government owning the market. This is the government actually owning a business, typically outlawing any private ownership in that market. Examples in the United States include the Federal Reserve system (fiat currency), Social Security, Medicaid, ObamaCare, etc. Communism is a stepping stone to the next one, slavery.

Slavery, or ownership of labor. This is forced labor. Examples include sex slaves (supported by Democrats), slavery due to racism (supported by Democrats), and of course, the slavery of government welfare, where Democrats encourage people to remain dependent on the government for everything. The natural path of treating government as a god.

ALL forms of socialism are based on theft. Either theft of how you run your business, to the theft of your property, to the theft of your labor.
ALL forms of socialism can ONLY succeed where capitalism also exists, because it must have something to steal from.

Socialism exists in every nation, including the United States, where it is supported by Democrats.
Capitalism exists in every nation as well, including the United States, where it is supported by conservatives.

Capitalism is the voluntary production and sale of products and services for the agreed upon price (price discovery). It requires NO government to function. It quite literally built the cities out of the wilderness. It is the only system where the poor can build stake for themselves and no longer be poor. It is the only system where the poor can become rich as well. All you need is the initiative to do it. It is the free market. You can't kill it. This market is immortal. No matter how you try, capitalism will always be there.

Given the choice, people generally choose capitalism, not socialism. Socialism must generally be implemented by force, hence the tyrannical nature of it.

For those that read the Bible:

You will find that Jesus Christ and God teach essentially capitalism. They WANT people to succeed and to build their own prosperity.
You will also find that Satan teaches compulsion, and always has. This is the very essence of socialism.

Hence, socialism is a thing to be avoided. It is based on theft. It is based on tyranny. It progresses from fascism, through communism, to slavery. Sooner or later, a revolt forms, which often turns ugly. A civil war. This war is being fought in the United States even now. This is what the rioters, the looters, the organized crime, and the Democrats want. They've called for civil war many times. It is now here, and they will LOSE.
 
Uncensored2008 said:
Jake is what is commonly known as "stupid." Even after things are explained, he fails to grasp them.
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Yet...I explain...not for the benefit of Jake, but for the benefit of all. For conservatives, as well as for Democrats becoming disenchanted with the radical nature of their party.

Jake (Sybil) refuses to listen. He is a prisoner of his own hate, in a prison of his own making.
 
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