The Power Broker - Robert Moses

cawacko

cawacko

Well-known member
I've had this book on my to read list for a long time. After finishing it this week, I can't believe I waited so long to do so. Pretty clear why it won the Pulitzer Prize and has been called one of the best nonfiction books of the 20th century.

There are so many different layers to the book, you could start multiple threads on them.

How many others have read it? I know we have (had) several New Yorkers here. Thoughts on Moses? I believe some here were alive while he was still in power. Do you remember him then?
 
Never heard of him until I bought tickets for a Bob Moses/Cannons concert that will be held in Tacoma this coming July.
I thought bob moses was the name of the artist but it’s a band named after your guy.
 
cawacko said:
I've had this book on my to read list for a long time. After finishing it this week, I can't believe I waited so long to do so. Pretty clear why it won the Pulitzer Prize and has been called one of the best nonfiction books of the 20th century.

There are so many different layers to the book, you could start multiple threads on them.

How many others have read it? I know we have (had) several New Yorkers here. Thoughts on Moses? I believe some here were alive while he was still in power. Do you remember him then?
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Never heard of him until I bought tickets for a Bob Moses/Cannons concert that will be held in Tacoma this coming July.
I thought bob moses was the name of the artist but it’s a band named after your guy.
 
Spitballing here. His legacy is still debated because he was known as one of the world's most renowned builders, with parks, highways and bridges throughout New York City and Long Island. But it was his methods, especially from a modern perspective, that drew such backlash.

Politically it was such a different time, it almost feels foreign today. It's not that partisanship didn't exist but Moses actions were driven by "getting sh*t done", not advancing power for a political party.

And big public projects, such as building highways, was seen as progressive and progress and supported by the elites at the time. Whereas the same actions today would have a very different response.
 
Final one. It's wild to think what Manhattan would look like today if Moses' dreams had come to fruition, with freeways cutting right through the heart of it.

I've seen renderings from around that same time period of something similar in San Francisco, with multiple freeways dividing the city. It would be a totally different place if that had happened.
 
cawacko said:
Final one. It's wild to think what Manhattan would look like today if Moses' dreams had come to fruition, with freeways cutting right through the heart of it.

I've seen renderings from around that same time period of something similar in San Francisco, with multiple freeways dividing the city. It would be a totally different place if that had happened.
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Why was the book so compelling? No offense but I just don’t see how some guy from the somewhat distant past who had lotsa influence would be of interest today.
 
cawacko said:
I've had this book on my to read list for a long time. After finishing it this week, I can't believe I waited so long to do so. Pretty clear why it won the Pulitzer Prize and has been called one of the best nonfiction books of the 20th century.

There are so many different layers to the book, you could start multiple threads on them.

How many others have read it? I know we have (had) several New Yorkers here. Thoughts on Moses? I believe some here were alive while he was still in power. Do you remember him then?
Click to expand...
I grew up during his time, some good things like the long island parkways and jones beach, the not so good he made it difficult for people in the city without cars to access them with busses as the parkways had low overpasses , He did foster city housing for low and middle income families which was good and needed after the war , I lived in one growing up. The bad he bisected minority neighborhoods causing access issues with highways cutting through neighborhoods
 
anonymoose said:
Why was the book so compelling? No offense but I just don’t see how some guy from the somewhat distant past who had lotsa influence would be of interest today.
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Fair question (and at 1,200 pages it's not a quick read).

It's not a book anyone has to read but at its core the book is about power, how Moses got it and how he maintained it. Ultimately its about how power operates within democratic systems, and even if done differently in present times it's still very relevant.
 
Guno צְבִי said:
I grew up during his time, some good things like the long island parkways and jones beach, the not so good he made it difficult for people in the city without cars to access them with busses as the parkways had low overpasses , He did foster city housing for low and middle income families which was good and needed after the war , I lived in one growing up. The bad he bisected minority neighborhoods causing access issues with highways cutting through neighborhoods
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I think your response and experience sum up well why his legacy is still being discussed and debated today.
 
Guno צְבִי said:
I grew up during his time, some good things like the long island parkways and jones beach, the not so good he made it difficult for people in the city without cars to access them with busses as the parkways had low overpasses , He did foster city housing for low and middle income families which was good and needed after the war , I lived in one growing up. The bad he bisected minority neighborhoods causing access issues with highways cutting through neighborhoods
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Do you recall Tammany Hall, and people's opinion of it, being discussed during your youth?

Separately, there's a reason Robert Caro is considered one of the greatest nonfiction writers ever. I’ve always thought that we as partisans tend to attribute noble motives to the politicians we support. Caro does such an amazing job pulling the curtain back on how politicians actually operate and respond to incentives. Democracy isn't always pretty.
 
cawacko said:
Do you recall Tammany Hall, and people's opinion of it, being discussed during your youth?

Separately, there's a reason Robert Caro is considered one of the greatest nonfiction writers ever. I’ve always thought that we as partisans tend to attribute noble motives to the politicians we support. Caro does such an amazing job pulling the curtain back on how politicians actually operate and respond to incentives. Democracy isn't always pretty.
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I know of it but it was way before my time, we learned about in school in NY history
 
cawacko said:
Do you recall Tammany Hall, and people's opinion of it, being discussed during your youth?

Separately, there's a reason Robert Caro is considered one of the greatest nonfiction writers ever. I’ve always thought that we as partisans tend to attribute noble motives to the politicians we support. Caro does such an amazing job pulling the curtain back on how politicians actually operate and respond to incentives. Democracy isn't always pretty.
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my understanding is that nothing has changed since.
 
Guno צְבִי said:
I know of it but it was way before my time, we learned about in school in NY history
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I'm just spitballing here about the book. One of the hard things to read was when he was building all these parks, how he basically put none in Harlem (and maybe the lower east side as well).

Hearing the story of kids who almost had almost no place to go play, or to see grass, was pretty heartbreaking.
 
Guno צְבִי said:
I know of it but it was way before my time, we learned about in school in NY history
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Sorry for continuing to respond to you, feel free to ignore me. But having just finished the book, I have NYC on the brain.

I turned 3 in 1975 so I don't remember the City's fiscal crisis, but the book really shows how it evolved to that position over the decades.

It's also wild to think the City had six or maybe even seven daily newspaper at one point. My understanding is once the evening news became a thing, I believe in the '60's, it hit the afternoon papers hard.
 
cawacko said:
I'm just spitballing here about the book. One of the hard things to read was when he was building all these parks, how he basically put none in Harlem (and maybe the lower east side as well).

Hearing the story of kids who almost had almost no place to go play, or to see grass, was pretty heartbreaking.
Click to expand...
There were small playgrounds in all neighbourhoods and a short subway or bus ride to central park or the bronx zoo and coney island that families went to. The lower east side where my Mother lived they had settlement houses for activities and summer camp in the upstate for a few weeks each summer
 
cawacko said:
Sorry for continuing to respond to you, feel free to ignore me. But having just finished the book, I have NYC on the brain.

I turned 3 in 1975 so I don't remember the City's fiscal crisis, but the book really shows how it evolved to that position over the decades.

It's also wild to think the City had six or maybe even seven daily newspaper at one point. My understanding is once the evening news became a thing, I believe in the '60's, it hit the afternoon papers hard.
Click to expand...
Yep, 7 daily news papers some with both morning and afternoon additions, in the 50's mail delivered twice daily and we had 7 TV stations

Free community centers for after school staffed by teachers with arts and crafts like pottery and pool tables .
 
cawacko said:
Sorry for continuing to respond to you, feel free to ignore me. But having just finished the book, I have NYC on the brain.

I turned 3 in 1975 so I don't remember the City's fiscal crisis, but the book really shows how it evolved to that position over the decades.

It's also wild to think the City had six or maybe even seven daily newspaper at one point. My understanding is once the evening news became a thing, I believe in the '60's, it hit the afternoon papers hard.
Click to expand...
Where I grew up in NYC

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CDEwSnWJN2g
 
Guno צְבִי said:
There were small playgrounds in all neighbourhoods and a short subway or bus ride to central park or the bronx zoo and coney island that families went to. The lower east side where my Mother lived they had settlement houses for activities and summer camp in the upstate for a few weeks each summer
Click to expand...
I feel like he was describing the inequality of the distribution of parks, especially in the ‘30’s and ‘40’s.

But your experience shows how people dealt with it.
 
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