the ATF has some 'splaining' to do

S

SmarterthanYou

rebel
for anyone who hasn't been paying attention, and even for those of us who have, it looks like Senator Grassley is not going to back down.

cliff notes for those who might care are as follows,

1) Border Patrol Agent Bryan Terry shot and killed with 'assault' weapon bought from an American FFL.

2) DoJ and ATF add this incident to 'emergency' need to start recording ALL sales of long guns from gunstores in border states.

3) ATF arrests a few illegal immigrant individuals associated with death of Agent Terry. One for buying the rifle, one for transporting the rifle, and one for killing agent terry. only then does the mainstream media start to look at story.

4) ATF whistleblowers contact several media outlets and congress critters stating that the ATF KNEW those rifles had been sold and approved the sale of such rifles and that said ATF bureaucrats are now trying to cover up other info to link ATF to rifle sales.

5) After months of mainstream media ignoring the story while it proliferated through gun rights advocacy groups, Senator Grassley (R) Iowa schedules hearing with acting director of ATF.

6) acting ATF director sidesteps any and all questions related to the sale of rifles and related death of Agent Terry. After hearing, director is heard cussing and bitching about who the fuck Senator Grassley is demanding answers to how they do their job. All of this relayed by ATF insider whistleblowers.

7) Grassley sends letter to Eric Holder demanding more specific answers on how, why, and what was done when Agent Terry was killed.
http://armsandthelaw.com/archives/GrassleyToHolder16Feb2011.pdf

8) Holders response is to immediately order the deportation of the illegals in order to prevent any testimony from them.
http://www.kold.com/Global/story.asp?S=14037331

Three illegal aliens will not face charges in connection with the murder of U.S. Border Patrol agent, Brian Terry.

That Late Breaking word coming Tuesday afternoon from the U.S. Attorney's Office in Phoenix.

Instead, Jesus Soria-Ruiz, Jose Angel-Camacho and Francisco Rosario Camacho-Alameda will be deported to Mexico, after pleading guilty to illegal entry charges.

The U.S. Attorney Office released the following statement:

"Based upon an extensive investigation conducted to date, there is no evidence tying these three individuals to the shooting of Border Patrol (BP) Agent Brian Terry. The goal of the ongoing FBI-lead Joint Investigation into that shooting is to achieve justice for BP Agent Terry, and bring criminal charges against those responsible for this murder. We continue to devote significant resources and manpower to this investigation. This investigation is extremely active and progressing."

Agent Terry died on December 14, 2010 west of Rio Rico.

Investigators say border bandits shot him while he was on a stake out.We'll have more on this Late Breaking story on KOLD News 13 LIVE at 5 and 10 PM.
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This is great stuff, because the ATF has been a rogue organization for decades and needs to be eliminated.
 
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Booyah! said:
I don't get it, are you saying the ATF killed a border patrolman?
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indirectly, yes. they set up the buy, approved the buy, and then when the agent was killed, did everything they could to hide any of their misdeeds.

in other words, this iron pipeline of assault weapons to mexican drug cartels looks like a setup operation on part of the ATF.
 
No said:
Basically, the premise is the ATF was/is selling guns illegally to Mexican cartels. I posted this about 2 or 3 weeks ago.
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all credit to you, sir. I just wanted to follow up with grassleys letter and the sudden deportation orders of the 'arrestees'.
 
SmarterThanYou said:
indirectly, yes. they set up the buy, approved the buy, and then when the agent was killed, did everything they could to hide any of their misdeeds.

in other words, this iron pipeline of assault weapons to mexican drug cartels looks like a setup operation on part of the ATF.
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i agree with you on the cover up, whoever is involved in the cover up should be criminally charged if such cover up violates any laws.

why do you think the ATF is a rogue organization? given that no president has dismantled this organization. further, congress continues to fund them with over a billion dollars a year.....
 
Yurt said:
i agree with you on the cover up, whoever is involved in the cover up should be criminally charged if such cover up violates any laws.

why do you think the ATF is a rogue organization? given that no president has dismantled this organization. further, congress continues to fund them with over a billion dollars a year.....
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Probably because the ATF is less similar to a police organization and more similar to the Nazi SA.
 
No said:
Probably because the ATF is less similar to a police organization and more similar to the Nazi SA.
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perhaps...you rarely ever hear of an ATF agent or the agency being sued for violations of the constitution while they are acting under the color of law
 
Yurt said:
i agree with you on the cover up, whoever is involved in the cover up should be criminally charged if such cover up violates any laws.

why do you think the ATF is a rogue organization? given that no president has dismantled this organization. further, congress continues to fund them with over a billion dollars a year.....
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the ATF, like almost all other alphabet agencies, has no constitutional basis, their power is derived via unconstitutional methods, and their mandates violate the 2nd Amendment.
 
Yurt said:
perhaps...you rarely ever hear of an ATF agent or the agency being sued for violations of the constitution while they are acting under the color of law
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You know that the ATF has almost no written standards for the execution of any of their duties right? Like literally, NONE.
 
No said:
You know that the ATF has almost no written standards for the execution of any of their duties right? Like literally, NONE.
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never thought about to be honest. figured they would abide by the constitution and federal law. does the CIA or the FBI have written standards for that matter?

btw, isn't thte ATF an executive agency? do all executive agencies have written standards? say the office of homeland security?
 
Yurt said:
never thought about to be honest. figured they would abide by the constitution and federal law. does the CIA or the FBI have written standards for that matter?

btw, isn't thte ATF an executive agency? do all executive agencies have written standards? say the office of homeland security?
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Yes, the FBI and CIA have tons of SOPs for how they're supposed to execute their duties. The ATF doesn't, especially with regards to guns. Basically they just make it up to suit whatever the particular agent wants. And the ATF falls under Department of Treasury, same with the Secret Service.
 
No said:
Yes, the FBI and CIA have tons of SOPs for how they're supposed to execute their duties. The ATF doesn't, especially with regards to guns. Basically they just make it up to suit whatever the particular agent wants. And the ATF falls under Department of Treasury, same with the Secret Service.
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i thought the ATF was an arm of the justice department...maybe their "sops" as you call it, are the same as the DOJ.....how does the treasury have the power to have the ATF? i knew that about the secret service, when i learned that, i was surprised.
 
Yurt said:
i thought the ATF was an arm of the justice department...maybe their "sops" as you call it, are the same as the DOJ.....how does the treasury have the power to have the ATF? i knew that about the secret service, when i learned that, i was surprised.
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No, they don't follow any governing SOP. Plenty of cases demonstrate that. I'll double check on whether they're treasury or justice though.
 
Yurt said:
executive agencies violate the constition? and how does their mandate violate the constition?
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'shall not be infringed' for one.

there is also the little matter of them knowing that their class 3 database is all jacked up, but they'll lie on the stand and say that it's perfectly up to date. then labeling a chain, shoestring, and an AR 15 constitutes a machine gun.
 
Yurt said:
i thought the ATF was an arm of the justice department...maybe their "sops" as you call it, are the same as the DOJ.....how does the treasury have the power to have the ATF? i knew that about the secret service, when i learned that, i was surprised.
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the ATF was originally organized to collect taxes on booze, tobacco, and guns. that's how it was originally in treasury.
 
SmarterThanYou said:
'shall not be infringed' for one.

there is also the little matter of them knowing that their class 3 database is all jacked up, but they'll lie on the stand and say that it's perfectly up to date. then labeling a chain, shoestring, and an AR 15 constitutes a machine gun.
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an agency in and of itself does not violate the constitution. the agency would have to actually infringe on a right in an affirmative manner.

the second, i have no opinion, i haven't seen the facts.
 
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