minnesota trying to redefine when deadly force is ok

SmarterThanYou said:
are we that far gone that we can't determine for ourselves whats right and wrong? if that's the case, then we're pretty much screwed.
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That's kind of why we have laws, and why we have always had laws.

Do you trust every individual to adhere to some sort of unwritten code of decency, where you trust their judgment on what is right & wrong?
 
SmarterThanYou said:
are we that far gone that we can't determine for ourselves whats right and wrong? if that's the case, then we're pretty much screwed.
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That's not really an answer to my question regarding your statement STY. Right and wrong can be subjective without a definite law to define the difference. You said " I would not shoot someone over a lawn gnome". What if someone else loved and prized their lawn gnome and felt that deadly force was definitely fair?

Laws are not evil or bad they are merely guide posts that allow a society to move freely, because lawlessness has been bound to a set of consequences.
 
SmarterThanYou said:
are we that far gone that we can't determine for ourselves whats right and wrong? if that's the case, then we're pretty much screwed.
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of course we can. however, in order to live in a society there must be rules. for example, you don't like how the police get extra protection when attacked (your comment regarding punishment). yet, you seem to want to allow individuals to make up their own rules when it comes to defending themselves.

the reality is, that as a society, what is right and wrong is not the same for everyone. so, we all agree, if you will, to live under a set of definitions or laws that say what is right and wrong. if we didn't, would we likely have thousands of different versions of what reasonable force means.
 
Onceler said:
That's kind of why we have laws, and why we have always had laws.

Do you trust every individual to adhere to some sort of unwritten code of decency, where you trust their judgment on what is right & wrong?
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actually, yes. and that's why we have the laws we have now, in order for you people to 'feel' safer. laws were originally written to punish people for bad acts, now they are written to control a populace. the founders would roll.
 
SmarterThanYou said:
actually, yes. and that's why we have the laws we have now, in order for you people to 'feel' safer. laws were originally written to punish people for bad acts, now they are written to control a populace. the founders would roll.
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laws do make people safer. have you lived in a place where there were no laws?
 
Disillusioned said:
That opens the door to paranoia and ideas of race and ethnicity as a reason to kill people. Imagine a tourist in New York, takes a couple wrong turns and is in a Pakistany community, he starts hearing arabic and see's some women in full face veils and freaks out thinking they're all terrorists, takes out his .45 and kills three of them.
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That's why knee jerk reactionists like STY cause more problems, then they will ever resolve
I fully expect to read about STY's manifesto, one of these days.
220px-Theodore_Kaczynski.jpg
 
SmarterThanYou said:
that's because your bias and hatred of me exposing your loved cops would lead you to actually delude yourself in to believing I was lying, even if had 18 stab wounds, 4 bullet holes, and a fractured skull before I killed whoever was assaulting me. that would be what we reasonable people call a 'lack of integrity'.
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First off, I don't hate you.
I pity you.

And the only way anyone could fracture your skull, would be to kick you in the ass. :D
 
Yurt said:
imo....laws create a sense of responsibility among our fellow citizens. laws do not stop crimes, they can only try and detur crimes.
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then you agree that american society is debased and corrupt and we need to elect babysitters to write our code of conduct with penalties to survive in relative peace and harmony?
 
SmarterThanYou said:
then you agree that american society is debased and corrupt and we need to elect babysitters to write our code of conduct with penalties to survive in relative peace and harmony?
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American society?

How about society. People need laws - sorry to burst your bubble.
 
Onceler said:
American society?

How about society. People need laws - sorry to burst your bubble.
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are you going to resort to the usual blather about Libertarians being anarchists and wanting no laws?

i've never said that there should be NO laws, i've always been about LESS laws, especially those regulating harmless conduct that has victimless crimes at it's core.

care to try again now?
 
SmarterThanYou said:
are you going to resort to the usual blather about Libertarians being anarchists and wanting no laws?

i've never said that there should be NO laws, i've always been about LESS laws, especially those regulating harmless conduct that has victimless crimes at it's core.

care to try again now?
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some laws need to be repealed, but it will take time a outrage by a significant portion of the voting population do it, government loves to expand
 
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