21 to 32 trillion

That's a mighty deep hole you're digging there. I'll deal with it tomorrow.

For right let me be on the record: If I had 6 million stased away overseas it wouldn't be in a country with one of the highest tax rates.

AND I SURE AS FUCK WOULDN'T BE SPENDING HOURS A DAY ON AN INTERNET FORUM. Somethings fishy here and it ain't the fur between your toes.
 
That's a mighty deep hole you're digging there. I'll deal with it tomorrow.

For right let me be on the record: If I had 6 million stased away overseas it wouldn't be in a country with one of the highest tax rates.

AND I SURE AS FUCK WOULDN'T BE SPENDING HOURS A DAY ON AN INTERNET FORUM. Somethings fishy here and it ain't the fur between your toes.

Well you can deal tomorrow, but I probably won't answer. You lucked out today because I was bored and didn't mind playing with you. I still have you on ignore, and will continue to ignore you because you seldom have anything of merit to say.

The tax rates on income doesn't matter to rich people, they don't earn income. My wealth in Germany is not earning income, so the tax rates can be 100% for all I care, the only money I am earning is from dividends. I didn't PICK Germany to invest my money. I sold an asset to a German-based corporation, and that is how I came to have assets in Germany.

Yeah, something is fishy, and I don't have fur between my toes. Don't confuse me for one of your cats, Cat Boy.

I am the happiest person in the world when I am sitting on a mountain top with my guitar, a campfire, and a good bottle of bourbon whiskey. I don't need or want a yacht, a jet airplane, a limo, a big-fake-boob-trophy wife... I don't need to impress anybody or fulfill some sense of self-gratification in material things. It's just not who I am. Being this way, I tend to not really spend a lot of money, and it costs me very little to live. I pay extremely little in income tax because I don't really earn an income anymore. (hence all the free time to post) It tickles me for stupid liberals to run around thinking they are punishing the rich by raising the tax rates on high income earners... those are not the rich people! Those are the people becoming rich! The rich people already earned high incomes, years ago! You already taxed their incomes when they made them and became rich. Now they have all this wealth stashed away, and they just aren't motivated to use it trying to earn income that you want half of.

For my part, I had rather let it ride. Hell... even IF the US were to suspend cap gains and let me bring my wealth back home with NO tax penalty, I probably still wouldn't do it. There IS the matter of the Germans, who want me to keep my money in Germany, and will charge me a 25% penalty tax, if I take it out. So this whole thing really doesn't apply to MY wealth, because I plan to live just the same as I always have.
 
Really?

You warned us about how greedy capitalists, who already horde their wealth to the detriment of this country, would demonstrate levels of greed unprecedented in this country if we elected someone who might try and hold them accountable for their greed?

You warned us about how greedy RightWingers would put their own selfish greed ahead of whats best for the fellow citizens of the country that afforded them the chance to be come so wealthy?

and Barney Frank said NO, the greedy capitalists were in sound financial shape and should not be reigned in.......and the congressional black caucus said NO, it's all racism......
 
Good thing you and I are on the rube's 'ignore' list. Otherwise we'd be getting lotsa razor-blade comments.....LOL

and yet, the liberals still avoid talking about the issue as soon as they find something trivial to divert the discussion to........does any debate with this worthless crowd ever go in any other direction?.....
 
"No one can serve two masters. Either he will hate the one and love the other, or he will be devoted to the one and despise the other. You cannot serve both God and Money." Matthew 6:24

Conservative, republican and libertarians worship of the rich is such an odd phenomena. Today the right looks up to money as in the past people worshiped totems. And if you question how they got all this money you are labeled with some stock word that only has meaning in the world of money worship. No longer is America the 'can do' place, today it is the look to big money place and they will save us. Salvation now resides with the rich. Eighty years of propaganda has so modified the circuits in the minds of the right wingnuts say something negative about the power of money and the winguts all scream in unison.

"On moral grounds, then, we could argue for a flat income tax of 90 percent to return that wealth to its real owners. In the United States, even a flat tax of 70 percent would support all governmental programs (about half the total tax) and allow payment, with the remainder, of a patrimony of about $8,000 per annum per inhabitant, or $25,000 for a family of three. This would generously leave with the original recipients of the income about three times what, according to my rough guess, they had earned."UBI and the Flat Tax


As far as the super rich, they only make those enormous sums because of the state, so they are only morally entitled to an enormous sum, but not an absurd sum. The Conservative Nanny State


The Empathy Ceiling: The Rich Are Different — And Not In a Good Way, Studies Suggest
The 'Haves' show less empathy than 'Have-nots' by Brian Alexander The Empathy Ceiling: The Rich Are Different


"Many conservatives and libertarians defend the current levels of income inequality on the basis of merit. They claim the rich got rich because they worked harder, longer or smarter than the rest. However, researchers have conducted a vast number of empirical studies on what factors contribute to success, and in what proportion. A classic example of one of these studies is the 1972 book Inequality, by Christopher Jencks. (1) And these studies show that the meritocrat's position is not just arguably wrong, but clearly wrong." The rich get rich because of their merit.


"Here we begin to see the real consequence of all this getting and spending. It’s not that campaign money has direct power over the public mind—that one advertising dollar can be counted upon to yield one vote. Nor is it true that the public is invulnerable, that we judiciously weigh these messages and see through the lies. The problem is that by putting such a price tag on the White House, we have imported market logic directly into our politics. Yes, even the village socialist will still get to vote, not to mention the village idiot. But in order to be a candidate—to be the kind of person who can make those calls to billionaires and get them to “double down”— Americans will have to undergo a far more rigorous process of ideological winnowing and executive training. And anyone who isn’t an absolute zealot about maximizing shareholder value will fail to make the cut." Thomas Frank Harper's 04/2012


"Core morality tells us that people have a right to what they earn by their own efforts freely exercised. It is this part of core morality that Ayn Rand objectivists, libertarians, and other right wingers tap into when they insist that taxation is slavery... The trouble with such arguments is that nothing is earned, nothing is deserved. Even if there really were moral rights to the fruit of our freely exercised abilities and talents, these talents and abilities are never freely acquired or exercised. Just as your innate and acquired intelligence and abilities are unearned, so also are your ambitions, along with the discipline, the willingness to train, and other traits that have to be combined with your talents and abilities to produce anything worthwhile at all.... We don't earn our inborn (excuse the expression "God given") talents and abilities. We had nothing to do with whether these traits were conferred all of us are not. Similarly, we didn't earn the acquired character traits needed to convert these talents into achievements. They, too, were the result of deterministic processes (genetic and cultural) that were set in motion long before we were born. That is what excludes the possibility that we earned or deserve them. We were just lucky to have the combination of hardwired abilities and learned ambitions that resulted in the world beating a path to our door....No one ever earned or deserved the traits that resulted in the inequalities we enjoy -greater income and wealth, better health and longer life, admiration and social distinction, comfort, and leisure. Therefore, no one, including us, has a right to those inequality. Core morality may permit unearned inequalities, but it is certainly not going to require them without some further moral reason to do so." Alex Rosenberg 'The Atheist's Guide to Reality'
 
I wonder what our debt would be right now if proper taxes were paid on $21 trillion +?

Some time ago I took a look at the Forbes 100 richest people. I found that at about 99 or 100 the person had a personal fortune of $2.9 billion! I stopped looking at that point because I figured that 2.9 bn was probably enough for one very successful business man to see his family OK for a few generations. There were 99 richer people than that! And those figures were published! Now if we could connect those figures with the trillions of 'hidden' assets we could solve many of the worlds problems. Yes I know that the sociopath will always steal, cheat and defraud his way back to riches, but for a while at least there would be enough money to help Greece, Spain, Portugal and even, dare I say it, the US.
 
I wonder what our debt would be right now if proper taxes were paid on $21 trillion +?

I wonder how many financial institutions would collapse from people withdrawing their money from 'taxable' accounts?

OneCell, you DO realize we tax income and not holdings, right? ....You know the difference between earned income and holdings, right?

The $21 trillion spoken of in the article, is money that has already been taxed as income or capital gains.
 
In Germany? Roughly $6 million. Although, it's not all in "a bank," most is invested through several brokerages.
Yes, not sure of current rate. (You realize capital gains are not assessed on the entire amount each year, rather on the interest earned in that year?)

You say you've got 6 million floating around in Germany and you don't know what capital gains tax you're paying on the interest? Not a good businessman, are you?

According to German law, you're paying 25% plus another 5.5% solidarity surcharge. That's quite a healthy chunk added up over the years, huh? Why don't you get your "accountant" to explain this to you. Or, better yet, us; since you have no idea what you're talking about.


The tax rates on income doesn't matter to rich people, they don't earn income. My wealth in Germany is not earning income

WAIT, I thought you did earn income through dividends? Which is it??

Each year, I get a check in the mail. The amount is my annual dividend minus taxes from Germany.

Here's the thing, Dicksee. You have dug yourself in a hole...a huge hole...and no amount of blustering denial will fix it. The simple fact is you lied. You've made up this nice little persona here and you're living in a make believe world of riches and conservative splendor.

If you really were fabulously wealthy as you claim, you'd move that 6 million to Switzerland or the Caymans like your hero Mitt did, dontcha think?


Don't confuse me for one of your cats, Cat Boy.

So you're an internet stalker, huh?

I am the happiest person in the world when I am sitting on a mountain top with my guitar, a campfire, and a good bottle of bourbon whiskey. I don't need or want a yacht, a jet airplane, a limo, a big-fake-boob-trophy wife... I don't need to impress anybody or fulfill some sense of self-gratification in material things.

Yes...I'm sure you're happy up there in la-la-land...

I pay extremely little in income tax because I don't really earn an income anymore.

You pay a hell of a lot in Germany! Dividend interest is earned income.

even IF the US were to suspend cap gains and let me bring my wealth back home with NO tax penalty, I probably still wouldn't do it.

No, they won't; if what you're saying is true. I explained that to you yesterday.

Now they have all this wealth stashed away, and they just aren't motivated to use it trying to earn income that you want half of.

So they aren't interested in job creation at all, huh?



Some time ago I took a look at the Forbes 100 richest people.

From what I hear Dicksee's on there somewhere...

actually, if he brought it into the US, he would......weren't you aware of that?.......if you were, then you are the one lying, if not, you're simply dumb.......

You, sir, are equally as dense as Dicksee. Perhaps more...

The $21 trillion spoken of in the article, is money that has already been taxed as income or capital gains.

You're showing your ignorance, again.

The only reason people use these banks is either tax avoidance or tax evasion.
 
It's interesting to hear Dixie argue that crushing debt will cause the collapse of the economy in one breath, and then in the next, defend the idea that the super-rich be able to hide trillions in tax havens.

No one has really even talked about the fact that the $21 trillion+ that we're talking about is money that has effectively been removed from the economy, whether it's taxed or not. Most of it is not involved in any sale or purchase, or in any day-to-day transaction. It's why people argue that tax cuts targeted toward the middle class can be much more effective...they'll actually spend it and put it back into the economy.

The gap is only growing, as well. If you carry out the trends, it's not unreasonable to assume that the vast majority of wealth will be in a place that is basically separate from any economy, somewhere down the line. What effect might that have?
 
WAIT, I thought you did earn income through dividends? Which is it??

Income tax rates are not the same rate as taxes on dividends. Even most fucktards know this.

You have dug yourself in a hole...a huge hole...and no amount of blustering denial will fix it. The simple fact is you lied. You've made up this nice little persona here and you're living in a make believe world of riches and conservative splendor.

If you really were fabulously wealthy as you claim, you'd move that 6 million to Switzerland or the Caymans like your hero Mitt did, dontcha think?

Whatever you want to think, Howie. I haven't lied about anything.

Again.... If I move the money, I forfeit 25% of it then and there. I don't know what Mitt did, and I don't know what you'd do... for me, 25% of my wealth was too much to pay, and I chose to leave the funds where they are. As for taxes on the dividends, as I said, not sure what they are now... doesn't matter to me. If I start getting an annual BILL instead of a CHECK, I might care more, but as for now, the arrangement suits me fine.

No, they won't; if what you're saying is true. I explained that to you yesterday.

LMAO... that gives me so much reassurance... some idiot punk on a message board 'explained' it to me... now I am smart?

Read the comment again, moron... IF they suspended US cap gains tax, I would STILL have to pay the German penalty tax of 25%, if I take my money out. Therefore, I probably wouldn't. But then, I am not a shrewd businessman (as you have noted) and I am not interested in parlaying my fortune into more, I am content to live on it for the rest of my life, and then hand it off to my children.

You pay a hell of a lot in Germany! Dividend interest is earned income.

No, earned income is not dividend income, they are taxed at two different rates... even in Germany.

So they aren't interested in job creation at all, huh?

Most people are not interested in using their money solely for the purpose of creating jobs. Fact of life.

You're showing your ignorance, again. The only reason people use these banks is either tax avoidance or tax evasion.

Tax evasion is illegal, if you have any information, you should turn it over to the authorities. Many do use these accounts to avoid higher taxes, but whatever taxes are owed, have been paid already... You can't tax them AGAIN. You also can't go back and claim they were 'under-charged' and then, retroactively charge them more. You can pass a new law for new monies going into new foreign accounts... but then, that will also have consequences.

Howie... here's the deal... I don't give a shit whether you believe me. It doesn't bother me that you think I am lying. If you need to flatter yourself by thinking you have caught me in a lie, or "busted" me, then you go right ahead... you obviously find things like this important in your life, and I don't want to deprive you of that. I've answered your questions and explained enough. My wealth in Germany has nothing to do with anything here,really, so it doesn't matter.
 
It's interesting to hear Dixie argue that crushing debt will cause the collapse of the economy in one breath, and then in the next, defend the idea that the super-rich be able to hide trillions in tax havens.

No one has really even talked about the fact that the $21 trillion+ that we're talking about is money that has effectively been removed from the economy, whether it's taxed or not. Most of it is not involved in any sale or purchase, or in any day-to-day transaction. It's why people argue that tax cuts targeted toward the middle class can be much more effective...they'll actually spend it and put it back into the economy.

The gap is only growing, as well. If you carry out the trends, it's not unreasonable to assume that the vast majority of wealth will be in a place that is basically separate from any economy, somewhere down the line. What effect might that have?

Here's what you need to try and get your small mind around... We gave permission for the government to tax our income. We didn't give them permission to take our property. Money is property, we can do with it whatever we please. Once the taxes are paid on the income or dividend, the rest belongs to us, and whatever we choose to do with it, is our business, no one else.

Yes, it's a shame that all these trillions are not in the economy, but have you considered why that is? Seems to me, you'd be looking for ways to ENCOURAGE the "super rich" (guess rich isn't good enough anymore) to invest in business and capitalism? As opposed to trying to find some way to subvert the constitution and take their property against their will.
 
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