A sad day for the US if the Espionage Act is used against WikiLeaks???

signalmankenneth

Verified User
Resurrecting the 1917 law would be a mistake: it has a history of being used to suppress dissent???

Numerous US officials are calling for a resurrection of the US Espionage Act as a tool for prosecuting WikiLeaks. The dusting-off of the old law is all but certain. But the outcome of the constitutional dust-up that is sure to follow will result in triumph or tragedy for the US bill of rights.

In 1917, in the midst of a war hysteria, the United States passed the Espionage Act. The law has nothing to do with prosecuting spies. From its inception, it had everything to do with suppressing dissent. The Great War was unpopular with many Americans, very like today's engagements in Iraq and Afghanistan.

Make no mistake about it. The Espionage Act targeted political dissidents. Senator Kenneth McKellar of Tennessee offered a simple defence of the law when it was introduced to Congress: "If we cannot reason with men to be loyal, it is high time we forced them to be loyal." Others, such as Congressman William Green of Iowa, were more blunt. His statement resembled modern calls supporting the execution of the suspected WikiLeaks "whistleblower" Bradley Manning: "For the extermination of these pernicious vermin no measures can be too severe."

The Espionage Act wreaked havoc on the American political left, destroying the young American Socialist party and one of its most progressive unions, the Industrial Workers of the World. Many others, including intellectuals, journalists, film producers and pacifist religious figures were also prosecuted. Prison terms were long, and some political prisoners died in federal jails. The abuses under the law were legendary, and mark a sad day in US history.

Why is the threat to prosecute WikiLeaks under the Espionage Act so potentially destructive? The law is not restricted to properly prohibiting the release of classified information. The law is not restricted to protecting legitimate government secrets. The law broadly prohibits any publication by anyone (newspapers included) of information related to national security, which may cause an "injury to the United States".

Who determines whether national security is actually at stake? Who determines what constitutes an "injury to the United States"? In 1917 the courts bent over backwards to permit the justice department to indict and prosecute thousands of dissidents. Loyalty to America meant nothing. The first amendment's protections for freedom of speech were mocked.

Opposition to US war policies dictated who was jailed.

There are responsible mechanisms policing truly abusive leaks. The Espionage Act is not such a tool.

The attorney general should stop trying to resurrect the Espionage Act, and instead dust off his copy of the US constitution. If he has any question as to the meaning of the first amendment, he should read James Madison's 1789 speech, in which he introduced the bill of rights in the first Congress of the United States: "Freedom of the press, as one of the great bulwarks of liberty, shall be inviolable."

By Stephen M Kohn 15 Dec 2010
 
Primary Documents - U.S. Espionage Act, 15 June 1917

Resurrecting the 1917 law would be a mistake: it has a history of being used to suppress dissent???

Numerous US officials are calling for a resurrection of the US Espionage Act as a tool for prosecuting WikiLeaks. The dusting-off of the old law is all but certain. But the outcome of the constitutional dust-up that is sure to follow will result in triumph or tragedy for the US bill of rights.

In 1917, in the midst of a war hysteria, the United States passed the Espionage Act. The law has nothing to do with prosecuting spies. From its inception, it had everything to do with suppressing dissent. The Great War was unpopular with many Americans, very like today's engagements in Iraq and Afghanistan.

Make no mistake about it. The Espionage Act targeted political dissidents. Senator Kenneth McKellar of Tennessee offered a simple defence of the law when it was introduced to Congress: "If we cannot reason with men to be loyal, it is high time we forced them to be loyal." Others, such as Congressman William Green of Iowa, were more blunt. His statement resembled modern calls supporting the execution of the suspected WikiLeaks "whistleblower" Bradley Manning: "For the extermination of these pernicious vermin no measures can be too severe."

The Espionage Act wreaked havoc on the American political left, destroying the young American Socialist party and one of its most progressive unions, the Industrial Workers of the World. Many others, including intellectuals, journalists, film producers and pacifist religious figures were also prosecuted. Prison terms were long, and some political prisoners died in federal jails. The abuses under the law were legendary, and mark a sad day in US history.

Why is the threat to prosecute WikiLeaks under the Espionage Act so potentially destructive? The law is not restricted to properly prohibiting the release of classified information. The law is not restricted to protecting legitimate government secrets. The law broadly prohibits any publication by anyone (newspapers included) of information related to national security, which may cause an "injury to the United States".

Who determines whether national security is actually at stake? Who determines what constitutes an "injury to the United States"? In 1917 the courts bent over backwards to permit the justice department to indict and prosecute thousands of dissidents. Loyalty to America meant nothing. The first amendment's protections for freedom of speech were mocked.

Opposition to US war policies dictated who was jailed.

There are responsible mechanisms policing truly abusive leaks. The Espionage Act is not such a tool.

The attorney general should stop trying to resurrect the Espionage Act, and instead dust off his copy of the US constitution. If he has any question as to the meaning of the first amendment, he should read James Madison's 1789 speech, in which he introduced the bill of rights in the first Congress of the United States: "Freedom of the press, as one of the great bulwarks of liberty, shall be inviolable."

By Stephen M Kohn 15 Dec 2010

Primary Documents - U.S. Espionage Act, 15 June 1917

http://www.firstworldwar.com/source/espionageact.htm
 
You poor pinheads seem so disappointed in The Jackass Party and your leader BH Obama.

I almost feel sorry for you......almost.....but then, even your Party is not quite as freakin' full of lunatics as you would like....only a Party filled with assholes like Tony Weiner would make you happy..........
 
Well, at least they don't follow blindly, the Republican Party is the Party of Yes Masters! The Sheeple's Republic!
 
Well, at least they don't follow blindly, the Republican Party is the Party of Yes Masters! The Sheeple's Republic!

Looks like they are following blindly to me. You got a pinhead here, lamenting how it's great and wonderful some geek from Australia is publishing classified documents, compromising our national security. He bases this on some mindless rant of a Socialist, who is hellbent on destroying America. You've got a president who has basically told the left to go fuck yourself, and he still enjoys a pretty large approval rating from his liberal base, who will inevitably vote for his reelection in 2012. You have the stark reality of Keynesian economics failing dismally, all across Europe and here, but we continue to see the left-wing ants marching for even more Keynesian policy. The voice of the people was heard in November, but due to your devotion to ideology, the left has simply continued to try and push an agenda and pass massive spending legislation, even in a lame duck session.

No, Republicans aren't the ones marching in lockstep here, that is Democrats. Unfortunately, you are marching to your demise.
 
The Republicans aren't doing me any favors! The Dems can't get their shit together, how can they march in lockstep? The Republicans are the ones who give the same lines! The Dems are like herding cats.
 
The Republicans aren't doing me any favors! The Dems can't get their shit together, how can they march in lockstep? The Republicans are the ones who give the same lines! The Dems are like herding cats.

Yep! Remember how Zoom always says when Dems need a firing squad, they form a circle!
 
The Republicans aren't doing me any favors! The Dems can't get their shit together, how can they march in lockstep? The Republicans are the ones who give the same lines! The Dems are like herding cats.

Well, that's because Democrats lack principled convictions. To a Lib Dem, all that matters is advancement of the liberal cultural ideology...to a Mod Dem, all that matters is Daddy voted Democrat. So you have Democrats jumping all over the board when it comes to principles, because the principles which applied yesterday, may not apply today. Republicans give the same lines because what was true to their principled convictions yesterday, is still true today.
 
YEs, we know, screw the poor!

Actually, Conservatives want poor people to become rich people. This is a great misconception liberals have of the right in general. We just realize there is a way for poor people to become rich people, and there is a way for them to remain poor. The Liberal Democrat way shackles them to poverty for life, dependent on the Democrat party to continue throwing them morsels in the form of welfare. Whereas, with Conservative philosophy of lower taxation and less government intrusion into our personal lives, these same people are able to realize the American Dream and become prosperous and wealthy.
 
And everybody was cheering like mad, except one little boy. You see, he hadn't heard about the magic suit and didn't know what he was supposed to see. Well, as the King came by the little boy looked and, horrified, said:


"Look at the King! Look at the the King! Look at the King, the King, the King!
The King is in the altogether
But altogether the altogether
He's altogether as naked as the day that he was born.
The King is in the altogether
But altogether the altogether
It's altogether the very least the King has ever worn."

Summon the court physician! Call an intermission! His majesty is wide open to ridicule and scorn.

The King is in the altogether
But all together the altogether
He's altogether as naked as the day that he was born.
And it's altogether too chilly a morn!
 
I am not a "liberal", but I am disappointed that our president has apparently forgotten the principles of a free society.

Can anyone cite an instance of how national security has been compromised by Mr. Assange?

Embarrasing Ms. Clinton doesn't qualify.
 
I agree with you Mojo. I have read that he has removed all sensitive material. Being embarrassed doesn't count, otherwise Nixon would not have resigned.

Look at how many crimes have been uncovered due to leaks, whistle blowers.

It also points out that their was some major flaws in their security.

If there are major security risks they need to prove it.
 
"The Guardian has published detailed statements by prosecutors, who are trying to extradite Assange to Sweden for questioning, and accounts by some of the main players involved in the unfolding saga.


According to the police reports viewed by the Guardian, Assange's accusers allege the following:


That Assange "unlawfully coerced" Miss A by using his body weight to hold her down in a sexual manner.

That he "sexually molested" Miss A by having sex with her without a condom when it was her "express wish" one should be used.

That he "deliberately molested" Miss A "in a way designed to violate her sexual integrity."

That he had sex with a second woman, Miss W, without a condom while she was asleep."

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-503543_162-20026102-503543.html

This really looks like persecution.

Now Bank of America has refused to process payments to Wikileaks.
 
The sex while sleeping is not right, but how can one stay asleep, unless highly intoxicated and then how does one have recall?

Do people actually sleep that deeply or did she awaken and ask him to quit and he refused?

I would need more facts.

The sleep sex creeps me out!
 
The allegations seem suspect to me.

I'm no expert, but I don't understand how a man could have sex (defined as intercourse with penetration) with a sleeping woman without awakening her.

Then there's the question that arises if you accept the first premise.

If the woman was asleep during the sex, how did she know who it had occurred with?
 
I am not a "liberal", but I am disappointed that our president has apparently forgotten the principles of a free society.

Can anyone cite an instance of how national security has been compromised by Mr. Assange?

Embarrasing Ms. Clinton doesn't qualify.
Is it really the point that security has to be compromised ?

Stealing Secret/Confidential intelligence from any Government is unlawful....and receiving that stolen intelligence is illegal.....and in turn, making government secrets public should be illegal....no matter who that government is....
At least within reason and on a case by case basis as decided by said government.
?????????????????....Yes...No..?
 
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