age of responsibility

after at least two years of military service (including at least one tour of duty in a combat zone)

yeah, robert heinlein got to me too - that and 62 years of life experience

military discipline and getting shot at changes a person's attitudes
 
Watermark said:
In case anyone was wondering, DonQuixote read a study somewhere that said that the region of the brain that inhibits some risk taking behavior may not be fully formed until age 25.

Then he ran off a logical ledge with it and now bases his entire philosophy on it, instead of rational setting delimiters and trying to figure out the best median solution to the issue without requiring an adult to wait until a third of their life is up to be able to live independently. This is typical of idiots. I am much more mature than DonQuixote.
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w

That was my wife and I (we are both 62 and she received her master's degree in sociology) and the current life expectancy just keeps getting longer

If you make it to 25, you are likely to make it to 85+

But desh is probably correct, this will not happen anytime soon or during my wife's and my lifetime
 
I refuse to grow up no matter how long I live...or color between the lines

My wife does not share my casual and immature view of life...this is why I consult here on a lot of subjects

However, one caveat, we both retired as computer programmers - her business - me aerospace, the arts and business
 
Crashk said:
I was gonna write this big thing about rights provided under the constitution (The 26th Amendment for example )and all that but I threw it away in favor of .... who the fuck are you to tell my 18 yr old with a drivers license that he cant drive to and from school and work and for his own personal enjoyment? Who the fuck are you to tell my 21 yr old he cant get married? Or get a credit card and take on debt (sign a contract)?
This is just typical of conservative thinking. Everybody doesnt want to march locksetp in your footprints. And you cant control peoples personal lives without stepping on their rights. But then you dont believe in democracy or society so it only makes sense that you would want to restrict peoples rights and so called privileges.

Privileges are there for everyone, they are only taken away when you abuse them.
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c

first, read the entire thing - there are ways around some of the restrictions

second, someone that would not want to deal with the consequences of someone elses immaturity may object to an immature person's actions

third, what should the penalty be for someone that maims or kills because they did something immature or ignored the consequences of their action(s)

on another tentacle, maybe we should reduce the age limits to 16 and reap the rewards of population reduction - or maybe 14 since a person may be tried as an adult at age 14 in some jurisdictions

in some historical cultures (with shorter life expectancies) a person was considered an adult at age 13

oh well
 
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Damocles said:
All are limited by current arbitrary delimiters. There is nothing against changing requirements, other than current social conservancy.

Personally I think once you can join the military then you should have all aspects due any adult. If the nation can ask for the ultimate sacrifice, and you are of age to voluntarily choose to take that risk, you have reached past any arbitrary limitations that should be applied.
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Not arbitrary. Historically used and conservative. If kids these days are not as mature as 100 years ago then I blame poor parenting. And I would agree on the military service comment. Once you can enlist, you should be allowed all the other rights and privaleges that go along with it.
 
There is a reason Kids are not as "mature" as kids 100 years ago. It is due to the differances in our society. Kids 100 years ago faced a very differnt world.
Think about what life was like for a 10 year old in 1907?

Get up.
Go get water from the well so mom can cook breakfast and so the family can wash.
Go feed the chickens.
get water for the horse
get water for the cow
get water more water so mom can now wash yesterdays clothes.
clean up
eat
get ready for school
go to school
come home and do your home work
feed the horse
feed the cow
get water horse
get water for the cow
get water for the chickens
get water so mom can cook dinner
play
eat dinner
clean up
go to bed
repete


Now contrast that with what kids have to do today
 
They are just as good as the kids 100 years ago it just takes a different style of parentig to get them where they need to deal with the world they will have to live in.

The world is vastly more complicated and they are just Not ready to do it until an older age.

Vast amounts of kids do not even drive until much later now.
 
Well yeah they start out the same desh, but as you say poor parenting ruins that. It does expalin the rise in republicans though....
 
Sometimes people see the ones who are not ready yet and think thier parents have ruined him/her and its not that they are ruined its that it just takes longer to get them ready.

I have seen the effects of just shoving them out the door and it works no better.

Remember that what thess kids of yore got called when they left the farm?

RUBES if they left the farm and headed into the city they were not very ready for what they met in the big city.

Every one of our kids now face a world far more complicated than the "big city" of the time.

It just takes so much to get them ready and keep them from becoming complete skeptics who hate everyone because they know that there are a million ways to get your ass handed to you in this current society.

Its a tuff time to be a 20 something.

Shitty job opportunity
Very expensive higher education
Huge rent costs
Car related costs like insurance are huge for their age bracket
Rising prices on everything
A government who could care less about them
An economy that is tanking
corruption flowing out of every orafice of government
 
uscitizen said:
You are fortunate....
this was one reason for the subp[rime loan industry and resultant crash.
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I really dont think so usc I think most of it came from lack of oversight of the banking industry and people who saw prices rising at a unbelieveable rate and thought they had to buy or get locked out of the property game.

Some tried to make their fortunes in it too but did not realise it was an unsustainable rate.

I agree it was stupid and uninformed of them to do so but if we require all people in America to be experts on everything we will have a very crippled economy.
 
Desh said:
I really dont think so usc I think most of it came from lack of oversight of the banking industry and people who saw prices rising at a unbelieveable rate and thought they had to buy or get locked out of the property game.

Some tried to make their fortunes in it too but did not realise it was an unsustainable rate.

I agree it was stupid and uninformed of them to do so but if we require all people in America to be experts on everything we will have a very crippled economy.
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Nobody expects Americans to be experts in everything. But one does expect them to be responsible enough to learn enough to protect themselves when spending hundreds of thousands of dollars that may bankrupt them and hurt their financial prospects for years to come.
 
Damocles said:
Nobody expects Americans to be experts in everything. But one does expect them to be responsible enough to learn enough to protect themselves when spending hundreds of thousands of dollars that may bankrupt them and hurt their financial prospects for years to come.
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Many first time buyers over the last few years saw an ever rising market and feared that by the time they could save a down payment they would be shut out by price.

There thinking was (and it worked for people who had gotten in earlier) they would buy a house with a variable rate and then sell it before the two years were up and use the profit (because house prices just kept going up) as a down on something else.

Then they got caught.

There are several other examples I can give you which would demonstrate other rather innocent ways people were caught up in this game.
 
Desh said:
They are just as good as the kids 100 years ago it just takes a different style of parenting to get them where they need to deal with the world they will have to live in.

The world is vastly more complicated and they are just Not ready to do it until an older age.

Vast amounts of kids do not even drive until much later now.
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Desh

It is not just a different style of parenting, but parenting in the face of massive 'must have advertising' and peer pressure
That and a far more complex world with changing technology and a need to keep up with that technology

A person could start training in a field during high school only to discover that the requirements for that field have changed radically by the time they complete their freshman year of college

Even the basic amount of training required to enter the job market changes as a person moves from middle school through high school
Desh said:
They are just as good as the kids 100 years ago it just takes a different style of parenting to get them where they need to deal with the world they will have to live in.

The world is vastly more complicated and they are just Not ready to do it until an older age.

Vast amounts of kids do not even drive until much later now.
Click to expand...

Desh

It is not just a different style of parenting, but parenting in the face of massive 'must have advertising' and peer pressure
That and a far more complex world with changing technology and a need to keep up with that technology

A person could start training in a field during high school only to discover that the requirements for that field have changed radically by the time they complete their freshman year of college

Even the basic amount of training required to enter the job market changes as a person moves from middle school through high school
 
uscitizen said:
You are fortunate....
this was one reason for the subp[rime loan industry and resultant crash.
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usc

too much of the sub-prime loan industry was focused on scaming people

people who were speculating were one problem, but people who were trying to buy a home to live in were lied to
 
Desh said:
Many first time buyers over the last few years saw an ever rising market and feared that by the time they could save a down payment they would be shut out by price.

There thinking was (and it worked for people who had gotten in earlier) they would buy a house with a variable rate and then sell it before the two years were up and use the profit (because house prices just kept going up) as a down on something else.

Then they got caught.

There are several other examples I can give you which would demonstrate other rather innocent ways people were caught up in this game.
Click to expand...
That is more than "innocent" it is plain stupid. The idea that the market will only go up is the same thing that happened to many 90s tech bubble freakos in the stock market.

One more time, we can expect that they will be responsible enough to realize that they are gambling with their futures. That there can be consequences for their actions. We should not save all these "innocent" people because they were "taken advantage" of by other idiots who should also face consequences for their own stupidity.

Where do you think the mentality comes from to assert such stupid parenting that leaves kids unprepared? Somebody is always going to come save you.
 
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