anyone remember the Crimean war of the 1800s?

DJ McSwagalicious said:
"Ukraine" isn't much of a country anyways. It's been two, or more, for hundreds of years. Likely the Eastern half is all Putin will concern himself with. And even if he doesn't, so what? We don't go hounding the British over Northern Ireland. We don't pester the French about Corsica or Brittany, the Canadians over Quebec. America isn't the arbiter of who isn't and isn't a country.
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Why don't we just disban the UN? After all, who cares if member nations get invaded.

We should not have cared when Iraq invaded Kuwait, a member State, because everyone knows it isn't anyone's business and the Kuwaii people were just asking for it right?

Why do we sanction Iran to stop them from getting a nuke? It isn't anyone's business regardless of the treaties and agreements signed right? Everyone should be able manufacture a nuke. Everyone should be able to do drugs as well; and who needs police? They just prevent people from having fun!!!
 
Truth Detector said:
Yep; oh well. Nothing the world can do about the Soviet era tactics of Putin. We know everyone laughs at Kerry and Obama and their "red lines".
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NOT QUITE. the rest of the western nations are not on board with putin and economic barriers, like banning russia from western banking, can have a long term effect on the russian economy. unfortunately, the key term is 'long term'. and russia is not without economic power of its own, i.e., oil and natural gas. of course it also depends on just how much the other nations care.
 
Don Quixote said:
NOT QUITE. the rest of the western nations are not on board with putin and economic barriers, like banning russia from western banking, can have a long term effect on the russian economy. unfortunately, the key term is 'long term'. and russia is not without economic power of its own, i.e., oil and natural gas. of course it also depends on just how much the other nations care.
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I wouldn't count on anything tough coming from the neutered West or neutered AmeriKa; were falling back to the old cold war dictate of "spheres of influence" and this is the Soviets playground for the last 9 decades or so.
 
Truth Detector said:
I wouldn't count on anything tough coming from the neutered West or neutered AmeriKa; were falling back to the old cold war dictate of "spheres of influence" and this is the Soviets playground for the last 9 decades or so.
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you mean like when the ussr dissolved...
 
Don Quixote said:
it was/is and look what a mess we have left it in
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Key words; we have LEFT it in. Of course, this also resumes a nation carved out by the ambitions of European Imperialist ambitions hasnt been a mess throughout its history. That, of course, would require the willing suspension of disbelief.
 
Truth Detector said:
Key words; we have LEFT it in. Of course, this also resumes a nation carved out by the ambitions of European Imperialist ambitions hasnt been a mess throughout its history. That, of course, would require the willing suspension of disbelief.
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it almost makes me long for the sadahm regime, at least he kept a modicum of order, however, his children would have made a bigger mess of things so maybe we should have partitioned the nation back into its three major power blocks.
 
Don Quixote said:
it almost makes me long for the sadahm regime, at least he kept a modicum of order, however, his children would have made a bigger mess of things so maybe we should have partitioned the nation back into its three major power blocks.
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So you were okay with his invasions of neighboring countries, gassing of innocent Kurds and wanton murder of anyone he felt like killing? Fascinating; I can see why giving Iraqi's a representative Democracy is so much worse.
 
The trouble is that people with no history of democracy want total victory over whatever enemies they have or imagine, and in reality it can't be did, so they grovel to the US, hoping angels will come. The Ukraine will need to be friends with Russia, as an independent Scotland - or us/we, actually - will need to keep in with the English strutters. That's life, is all.
 
Truth Detector said:
So you were okay with his invasions of neighboring countries, gassing of innocent Kurds and wanton murder of anyone he felt like killing? Fascinating; I can see why giving Iraqi's a representative Democracy is so much worse.
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somehow i do not think that the iraqi's want a representative democracy...unless they are in control of it.

just out of curiosity, how many iraqi's are being killed by bombs on a regular basis since the representative democracy has been implemented? fanatics on all sides will not accept anything that does not put them in charge.

do you see a solution to the mess that is iraq these days?
 
Don Quixote said:
somehow i do not think that the iraqi's want a representative democracy...unless they are in control of it.
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That’s a fascinating claim made in a vacuum of the facts. How does someone become so uninformed?

Turnout for Iraq election solid at 62 percent
BY RANIA EL GAMAL AND AHMED RASHEED

http://www.reuters.com/article/2010/03/08/us-iraq-election-idUSLDE62505A20100308

Don Quixote said:
just out of curiosity, how many iraqi's are being killed by bombs on a regular basis since the representative democracy has been implemented?
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You don’t know how to do a google search?

112,667–123,284 civilian deaths from violence; March 2003 to March 2013
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Casualties_of_the_Iraq_War

Don Quixote said:
fanatics on all sides will not accept anything that does not put them in charge.
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So therefore we should try nothing?

Don Quixote said:
do you see a solution to the mess that is iraq these days?
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No; not after we pulled out all of our troops. Thanks to Obummer, I expect things to continue to deteriorate in Iraq until we see another dictatorial regime installed after a brutal devastating civil war like we are seeing in Syria.

Nice to know Democrats don’t care about the sacrifice made by our troops to secure Iraq and provide them with a representative Government. Obama’s foreign policy is the exact disaster we expected it to be and predicted it would be.
 
Truth Detector said:
That’s a fascinating claim made in a vacuum of the facts. How does someone become so uninformed?

Turnout for Iraq election solid at 62 percent
BY RANIA EL GAMAL AND AHMED RASHEED

http://www.reuters.com/article/2010/03/08/us-iraq-election-idUSLDE62505A20100308



You don’t know how to do a google search?

112,667–123,284 civilian deaths from violence; March 2003 to March 2013
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Casualties_of_the_Iraq_War



So therefore we should try nothing?



No; not after we pulled out all of our troops. Thanks to Obummer, I expect things to continue to deteriorate in Iraq until we see another dictatorial regime installed after a brutal devastating civil war like we are seeing in Syria.

Nice to know Democrats don’t care about the sacrifice made by our troops to secure Iraq and provide them with a representative Government. Obama’s foreign policy is the exact disaster we expected it to be and predicted it would be.
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are we talking about the same war? the one that bush/cheney lied our way into and we never should have fought with all of the lives destroyed so bushco could get the man that tried to kill his father?
 
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