Are Romney and President Obama that much different?

Bork is best known for his theory that the only way to reconcile the role of the judiciary in the U.S. government against what he terms the "Madisonian" or "counter-majoritarian" dilemma of the judiciary making law without popular approval is for constitutional adjudication to be guided by the framers' original understanding of the United States Constitution. Reiterating that it is a court's task to adjudicate and not to "legislate from the bench," he has advocated that judges exercise restraint in deciding cases, emphasizing that the role of the courts is to frame "neutral principles" (a term borrowed from Herbert Wechsler) and not simply ad hoc pronouncements or subjective value judgments. Bork once said, "The truth is that the judge who looks outside the Constitution always looks inside himself and nowhere else.
 
Jarod said:
I guess it depends on which Romney we get, the one who governed Mass. or the one who is running for the Republican Nomination.

I suspect the one who governed Mass is the true Romney, and for that reason I am looking toward this comming election with a comfortable and relaxed perspective. If Romney wins he will not be so much different than President Obama. Romney is not a GWB/Gingrich/Santorum/Huckleberry type of Republican so I do not fear the danger our nation was in during the 8 years of GWB and I doubt Romney will drive us into the largest recession this side of the depression nor will he take us into an unnecessary, mismanaged war in a place like Iraq.

The man who intentionally distanced himself from Ronald Reagan, supported the Pro-Choice movement and pratically authored the Health Care Bill can't be all bad.
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This presumes that he's acting more conservative than he is in order to become President, and dismisses the possibility that he was acting more liberal than he is in order to become Governor of MA.

I don't think that's a bet I want to make.
 
Dungheap said:
I don't think they are the same at all. That's like saying that paying my mortgage, bills and providing for my family is the same as blowing my paycheck at the track. But, even still, you're claiming that any Republican would be the same as Obama on this one particular issue, not that Romney in particular is the same as Obama.
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Great analogy.
 
icedancer2theend said:
Bork is best known for his theory that the only way to reconcile the role of the judiciary in the U.S. government against what he terms the "Madisonian" or "counter-majoritarian" dilemma of the judiciary making law without popular approval is for constitutional adjudication to be guided by the framers' original understanding of the United States Constitution. Reiterating that it is a court's task to adjudicate and not to "legislate from the bench," he has advocated that judges exercise restraint in deciding cases, emphasizing that the role of the courts is to frame "neutral principles" (a term borrowed from Herbert Wechsler) and not simply ad hoc pronouncements or subjective value judgments. Bork once said, "The truth is that the judge who looks outside the Constitution always looks inside himself and nowhere else.
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Um, posting paragraphs without providing a link is known as plagiarism. It's something people who can't string two coherent words together, but are desperate to appear smarter than they are, do.

I'll cite your source for you: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Bork

I mean, I took one look at this, laughed, and knew you didn't write it. But others might be fooled. Which was the point, yes? Yes.
 
Darla said:
This presumes that he's acting more conservative than he is in order to become President, and dismisses the possibility that he was acting more liberal than he is in order to become Governor of MA.

I don't think that's a bet I want to make.
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The point was not how he acted while trying to get elected Governor of Mass, it was about how he governed as governor of Mass. I take what someone does much more seriously than what he says he is going to do.
 
Jarod said:
The point was not how he acted while trying to get elected Governor of Mass, it was about how he governed as governor of Mass. I take what someone does much more seriously than what he says he is going to do.
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I believe he is playing to the far left to get elected. I believe he will become more Moderate if he gets the Presidency, just like Obama. Obama played to the left of left and then when elected he went more to the middle. I see many elected doing this. They all do it.
 
Jarod said:
The point was not how he acted while trying to get elected Governor of Mass, it was about how he governed as governor of Mass. I take what someone does much more seriously than what he says he is going to do.
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Okay. But I thought that DH made a great point (as usual) about the fact that Romney was dealing with a Democratic and even liberal state legislature.

No, I think he's going to govern very conservatively. This guy doesn't believe in shit, he'll do whatever it takes. And he's got a base to keep happy. Unlike Democrats, Republicans take that seriously.
 
Rana said:
I believe he is playing to the far left to get elected. I believe he will become more Moderate if he gets the Presidency, just like Obama. Obama played to the left of left and then when elected he went more to the middle. I see many elected doing this. They all do it.
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I agree, but I dont think Gingrich or Santorum would have moved to the middle.
 
Darla said:
Um, posting paragraphs without providing a link is known as plagiarism. It's something people who can't string two coherent words together, but are desperate to appear smarter than they are, do.

I'll cite your source for you: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Bork

I mean, I took one look at this, laughed, and knew you didn't write it. But others might be fooled. Which was the point, yes? Yes.
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What, again, twice in less than a month!
 
Darla said:
Okay. But I thought that DH made a great point (as usual) about the fact that Romney was dealing with a Democratic and even liberal state legislature.

No, I think he's going to govern very conservatively. This guy doesn't believe in shit, he'll do whatever it takes. And he's got a base to keep happy. Unlike Democrats, Republicans take that seriously.
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Interesting, we will see where he lands, but I don't think it will be in the White House, with the economy rebounding, the success of GM these last days, well, it iis hard to beat an incumbent.
 
Damocles said:
One of the more important differences would be who they would appoint to the SCOTUS.
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That is an important difference, but im not sure it will be that different. Romney is not likely to appoint WACKO righties, he is more likely to appoint moderates. Remember that SOCTUS appointees very often become more liberal once appointed. Very often the Anti-Choice crowd is very disappointed in those they supported.

Almost every educated person understands that when removed from the abortion issue, the right to freedom (privacy) is clear in the constitution and so cases like Griswald v. Connectuct will be upheld. As long as that line of cases is upheld R v. W will be upheld.
 
Jarod said:
That is an important difference, but im not sure it will be that different. Romney is not likely to appoint WACKO righties, he is more likely to appoint moderates. Remember that SOCTUS appointees very often become more liberal once appointed. Very often the Anti-Choice crowd is very disappointed in those they supported.

Almost every educated person understands that when removed from the abortion issue, the right to freedom (privacy) is clear in the constitution and so cases like Griswald v. Connectuct will be upheld. As long as that line of cases is upheld R v. W will be upheld.
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The idea that Romney will nominate moderates is nothing but wishful thinking on your part. As I already pointed out, Romney picked Robert Bork to co-chair his Judicial Advisory Committee. Robert Bork does not believe that there is a right to privacy in the Constitution and thinks that whole line of cases, including Roe, were wrongly decided. And this is the guy that Romney selected to chair his Judicial Advisory Committee. Maybe I'm wrong, but I don't think there are any facts on which you can base an argument that Romney will nominate moderates.

And spare me the bullshit about Supreme Court justices becoming more liberal once appointed. The present court is the most right-wing since the Lochner era. Roberts and Alito sure as shit aren't more liberal. Nor are Thomas and Scalia. It may have been true at one time when the court was dominated by brilliant liberal jurists that they influenced their less liberal peers, but that isn't today's court.
 
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