At What Point?

Yakuda said:
No I choose works because it says works. It's all over scripture. It's a contradiction for you not me. The perversion here is the protestant approach of either or. Scripture is clear it's an and both proposition to get to heaven Matt 25:31-46
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some places say differently.

you're picking and choosing just like me.

you're not better just because you're willing to kill others over your interpretation, catholic style.
 
Blackwater Lunchbreak said:
some places say differently.

you're picking and choosing just like me.

you're not better just because you're willing to kill others over your interpretation, catholic style.
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But they both exist. They can't contradict one another. You are the one that says only faith is necessary for salvation which contradicts other parts of Scripture. Both faith AND works is necessary. Matt 24:31-46

When you attack you lose. Don't get angry with me
 
Yakuda said:
"Faith alone" only appears one place in scripture.
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I don't know if that's true, and more importantly you can't understand Luther by doing a word search on one single word.

Salvation through grace, faith, justification are all part and parcel of Luther's interpretation of the epistles.

I believe PMP gave you a slew of citations Luther was reading.

You don't have to agree with Luther. You can say he is wrong. But 600 years of religious history demonstrates that Protestantism in a fundamental sense is based on this Lutherian interpretation of scripture
 
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Yakuda said:
But they both exist. They can't contradict one another. You are the one that says only faith is necessary for salvation which contradicts other parts of Scripture. Both faith AND works is necessary. Matt 24:31-46

When you attack you lose. Don't get angry with me
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they do contradict one another.

who says God can't contradict himself?

you?
 
Cypress said:
I don't know if that's true, and more importantly you can't understand Luther by doing a word search on one single word.

Salvation through grace, faith, justification are all part and parcel of Luther's interpretation of the epistles.

I believe PMP gave you a slew of citations Luther was reading.

You don't have to agree with Luther. You can say he is wrong. But 600 years of religious history demonstrates that Protestantism is a fundamental sense is based on this Lutheran interpretation of scripture
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It is true. James 2:24. You don't know this?

None of the citations say faith alone

I agree protestantism is based on luters perverted interpretation of Scripture

BTW

"First of all, however, you must understand that no prophecy of Scripture is a matter of private interpretation."
Cypress said:
I don't know if that's true, and more importantly you can't understand Luther by doing a word search on one single word.

Salvation through grace, faith, justification are all part and parcel of Luther's interpretation of the epistles.

I believe PMP gave you a slew of citations Luther was reading.

You don't have to agree with Luther. You can say he is wrong. But 600 years of religious history demonstrates that Protestantism in a fundamental sense is based on this Lutheran interpretation of scripture
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It is true. James 2:24. How do you not know this?

I agree protestantism is based on luthers perverted interpretation of scripture

BTW 2 Peter 1:20

"First of all, however, you must understand that no prophecy of Scripture is a matter of private interpretation."
 
Blackwater Lunchbreak said:
they do contradict one another.

who says God can't contradict himself?

you?
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If he can then you should listen to him but Jesus is clear

Matt 7:21 flap your gums all you like but if you don't do the will of his heavenly father you're wasting your time

Matt 25: 31-46 reiterates that fact
 
Yakuda said:
It is true. James 2:24. You don't know this?

None of the citations say faith alone

I agree protestantism is based on luters perverted interpretation of Scripture

BTW

"First of all, however, you must understand that no prophecy of Scripture is a matter of private interpretation."

It is true. James 2:24. How do you not know this?

I agree protestantism is based on luthers perverted interpretation of scripture

BTW 2 Peter 1:20

"First of all, however, you must understand that no prophecy of Scripture is a matter of private interpretation."
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but you just insisting that your interpretation is correct amongst conflicted passages, is just being an asshole.

it's not holy.
 
Yakuda said:
If he can then you should listen to him but Jesus is clear

Matt 7:21 flap your gums all you like but if you don't do the will of his heavenly father you're wasting your time

Matt 25: 31-46 reiterates that fact
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other verses say differently.


you insisting yours is preferred is just dickish.
 
If only there was a way for God to communicate EXACTLY how salvation was achieved. Instead humans end up assaulting each other on behalf of God.

So much for a religion of peace and love, eh?
 
Obtenebrator said:
But to a Catholic in the 15th century it most assuredly would be a perversion. Luther didn't just displace all those mystical sacrements, he fundamentally changed how salvation is achieved. Justification by Faith vs Justification by Works. Suddenly piety and even basic good behavior meant nothing. Whether one believed became the most important.

For a group of people for whom belief + works + sacramental ritual = salvation it would AMAZINGLY perverse to upend soteriology.

Thankfully there's no way to tell whether one soteriology is superior to another (because, well, you know....) so all the variants can co-exist. Now that all the bloodshed is behind the faiths they can act nice.
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Well clearly in the 16th century Luther was considered dangerous by the Papacy. He was excommunicated and sometimes in mortal danger.

Since we are having this conversation in the 21st century, I can't understand why a Catholic would still feel hostility to the "perverted" tenets of Protestantism. Even the modern popes have come to terms with the Protestant Reformation.
 
Cypress said:
Well clearly in the 16th century Luther was considered dangerous by the Papacy. He was excommunicated and sometimes in mortal danger.

Since we are having this conversation in the 21st century, I can't understand why a Catholic would still feel hostility to the "perverted" tenets of Protestantism. Even the modern popes have come to terms with the Protestant Reformation.
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yakuda is an insane noahide israeli radical Zionist killbot, looking for authoritarianism where he can find it.
 
Yakuda said:
They dont conflict. They only conflict with your either or approach. Scripture is clear it's both and

I didn't call you an asshole. Check yourself
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the obviously do conflict.

according to what words mean.

you're trying to gaslight people right out of the gate.

this is why God put in the contradictions to see who is not a totalitarian gaslighter.

you failed the test.
 
Blackwater Lunchbreak said:
the obviously do conflict.

according to what words mean.

you're trying to gaslight people right out of the gate.

this is why God put in the contradictions to see who is not a totalitarian gaslighter.

you failed the test.
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Ok James says we are saved by works. Not faith alone. Jesus says those who do the will of my heavenly father will be saved. He says those who believe AND are baptized will be saved.

Look I know how difficult it is to face your error believe me but getting angry with me isn't the way to go
 
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