Before NeoCons take their victory lap

C

Cypress

Well-known member
The New York Times figures it out:

The reduced violence in Iraq in recent months stems from three significant developments, but the clock is running on all of them, Iraqi officials and analysts warn....

Officials attribute the relative calm to a huge increase in the number of Sunni Arab rebels who have turned their guns on jihadists instead of American troops; a six-month halt to military action by the militia of a top Shiite leader, Moktada al-Sadr; and the increased number of American troops on the streets here.

They stress that all of these changes can be reversed, and on relatively short notice. The Americans have already started to reduce troop levels and Mr. Sadr, who has only three months to go on his pledge, has issued increasingly bellicose pronouncements recently.

The Sunni insurgents who turned against the jihadists are now expecting to be rewarded with government jobs. Yet, so far, barely 5 percent of the 77,000 Sunni volunteers have been given jobs in the Iraqi security forces, and the bureaucratic wheels have moved excruciatingly slowly despite government pledges to bring more Sunnis in.
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And the Guardian adds:

Iraq's main Sunni-led resistance groups have scaled back their attacks on US forces in Baghdad and parts of Anbar province in a deliberate strategy aimed at regrouping, retraining, and waiting out George Bush's "surge", a key insurgent leader has told the Guardian.

US officials recently reported a 55% drop in attacks across Iraq. One explanation they give is the presence of 30,000 extra US troops deployed this summer. The other is the decision by dozens of Sunni tribal leaders to accept money and weapons from the Americans in return for confronting al-Qaida militants who attack civilians. They call their movement al-Sahwa (the Awakening).
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Here's the director of the political department of the 1920 Revolution Brigades, and uses the nom de guerre Dr Abdallah Suleiman Omary.

Besides Ramadi, the Awakening movement was also operating in Sunni-majority districts of Baghdad, such as Ameriya, Adhamiya, and parts of Ghazaliya and Jihad, Omary said. He predicted it was unlikely to last for more than a few months. It was a "temporary deal" with the US and would split apart as people realised the Americans' true intentions.

He cited last week's announcement that the Bush administration plans to work with the Shia-led government of Nuri al-Maliki on arrangements for long-term US military bases and an open-ended occupation in Iraq.
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http://www.nytimes.com/2007/12/05/world/middleeast/05surge.html?_r=1&hp&oref=slogin
 
cawacko said:
I haven't heard anyone state that this slow down in violence means victory and our mission is over but its good to see papers like the Times continue to root for our defeat.
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Actually its almost like you don't want us to win Cypress because that would mean a victory for the hated "Neo-Cons".
 
cawacko said:
I haven't heard anyone state that this slow down in violence means victory and our mission is over but its good to see papers like the Times continue to root for our defeat.
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I've seen people predict victory.

Rooting for our defeat? How about reporting facts? Something they failed to do in the run up to your war, Cawacko.
 
Cypress said:
I've seen people predict victory.

Rooting for our defeat? How about reporting facts? Something they failed to do in the run up to your war, Cawacko.
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Well peolpe have predicted victory from Day 1. I've haven't seen anyone in the administration come out and say (over the past few months and the surge's success on the ground) that this is victory or that the battle is now over.
 
cawacko said:
Actually its almost like you don't want us to win Cypress because that would mean a victory for the hated "Neo-Cons".
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there's no "victory" possible in Iraq. I've said that for four years. Victory is an illusion. Remember "Mission Accomplished? There isn't going to be any jeffersonian democracy on the banks of the Tigris. There's isn't going to be any democratic beacon to the rest of the middle east, resulting in a domino effect of "freedom". We aren't going to find the WMD.

All that's possible, are bad outcomes. Its our choice as to picking the least bad outcome. To guide the airplane to a safe crash landing, as it were.
 
I think people forget that it took us three decades before the Constitution was even written...why do we expect the Iraqis to be democratic in 4 years?
 
***sigh***

cawacko said:
Actually its almost like you don't want us to win Cypress because that would mean a victory for the hated "Neo-Cons".
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Thats because Cippie is a Liberal hack...aka...neolibo If the war was won they would have nothing to bitch about! and would have to eat super crow...!:D


albeit they would still have the homosexual issues,transgender issues,and of course cheap legal drugs for all issues!
 
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gonzojournals said:
I think people forget that it took us three decades before the Constitution was even written...why do we expect the Iraqis to be democratic in 4 years?
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We weren't being occupied by the French army after 1783. We won, they left.

We wouldn't have taken to kindly to the French Army occupying for years on end, after the british army was defeated. Our occupation is going to be a continuing source of insurgents
 
Dont report all the facts.

These cons today are so used to only hearing one side of the story that they consider it treason to report everything that is happening.

Taking in all the information about ANY situation especially war with our kids Blood on the line is what the SANE people do. Its what the people who really want the best out come by making the best decisions. You and your ilk what to destroy us by going out half cocked on half the information and making half assed asessments which get people killed.

Your loyalty is very misplaced caWACKO.
 
Cypress said:
We weren't being occupied by the French army after 1783. We won, they left.

We wouldn't have taken to kindly to the French Army occupying for years on end, after the british army was defeated. Our occupation is going to be a continuing source of insurgents
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No, but there were still a large amount of Loyalists in the country and we did have to deal with several revolts in the coming years....hell, we operated under the completely powerless Articles of Confederation for 10 years before becoming the United States.
 
Desh said:
Dont report all the facts.

These cons today are so used to only hearing one side of the story that they consider it treason to report everything that is happening.

Taking in all the information about ANY situation especially war with our kids Blood on the line is what the SANE people do. Its what the people who really want the best out come by making the best decisions. You and your ilk what to destroy us by going out half cocked on half the information and making half assed asessments which get people killed.

Your loyalty is very misplaced caWACKO.
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I want all the facts reported. The facts on the ground in Iraq right now are positive as violence has dropped. However that doesn't mean we've won or that our work is complete. The attacks and violence could start up again at any time.

IMO, it seems Cypress is more concerned with "Neo-Cons" declaring "victory" than what is taking place and needs to be done.

My loyalty? I admit I have loyalty to my family, good friends, USC football and the U.S.A. Feel free to believe that loyalty is misplaced.
 
cawacko said:
My loyalty? I admit I have loyalty to my family, good friends, USC football and the U.S.A. Feel free to believe that loyalty is misplaced.
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Unless your loyalty is to Karl Marx and ridiculous 1960s notions of peace, they will never accept you.
 
cawacko said:
I want all the facts reported. The facts on the ground in Iraq right now are positive as violence has dropped. However that doesn't mean we've won or that our work is complete. The attacks and violence could start up again at any time.

IMO, it seems Cypress is more concerned with "Neo-Cons" declaring "victory" than what is taking place and needs to be done.

My loyalty? I admit I have loyalty to my family, good friends, USC football and the U.S.A. Feel free to believe that loyalty is misplaced.
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USC sucked this year, cawacko. Didn't they? All I remember is hearing that Stanford blew them off the face of the earth. Face facts. :)
 
Cypress said:
USC sucked this year, cawacko. Didn't they? All I remember is hearing that Stanford blew them off the face of the earth. Face facts. :)
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Tactic #3, changing the subject.

Tactics #1 and #2 are calling opponents fascists then racists, respectively.
 
Cypress said:
USC sucked this year, cawacko. Didn't they? All I remember is hearing that Stanford blew them off the face of the earth. Face facts. :)
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They didn't suck per se but after being pre-season #1 being #7 right now pretty much sucks!

Yeah, losing to Stanford was one of college football's biggest upsets. That truly SUCKED!!!
 
cawacko said:
They didn't suck per se but after being pre-season #1 being #7 right now pretty much sucks!

Yeah, losing to Stanford was one of college football's biggest upsets. That truly SUCKED!!!
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Yeah, I seem to remember you got drunk for like three days, and dissapeared from the board. LOL

I wonder if the timing coinicided with that light night weird drunk post you had?



just teasing. :)
 
Cypress said:
Yeah, I seem to remember you got drunk for like three days, and dissapeared from the board. LOL

I wonder if the timing coinicided with that light night weird drunk post you had?



just teasing. :)
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I don't think I came out of my room for three days either.
 
no one's taking any victory laps, not at least until the Republicans win the 2008 elections, then victory will be achievable. Yes their is a delicate balance being juggled by General Petraeus, but cutting the funds and troops from underneath him as the dims have pledged will surely result in America's defeat.
 
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