Cory Booker's Apostasy

Bijou said:
Go look up 'Ampad'. Let me know what you think of the terms of that arrangement with Bain. :)
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As I stated, VC firms are not going to be perfect. But for every Ampad, you are going to have a Staples, Sports Authority, Warner music etc...

When you take over struggling firms, some are not going to make it.

An analogy for you... twenty gun shot victims end up on the same surgeons table. Are you going to call the surgeon a butcher/killer if he isn't able to save every patient? Should the surgeon not try?
 
Are venture capitalists destroying more high-wage jobs and creating more low-wage service jobs? Chris Hayes did a fascinating show on private equity.

I don't really think when the facts are out this plays well for Romney, but what do I know, I am only a poor moron trying to mind her own business on the eastern end of Long Island...you know, farm country.
 
Darla said:
Are venture capitalists destroying more high-wage jobs and creating more low-wage service jobs? Chris Hayes did a fascinating show on private equity.

I don't really think when the facts are out this plays well for Romney, but what do I know, I am only a poor moron trying to mind her own business on the eastern end of Long Island...you know, farm country.
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No... VC firms don't have any stake in creating low vs. high paying jobs. They have a stake in making a company successful. They profit the most when the company succeeds. You will have some that try and do what the Obama admin claims Bain does. But those firms don't last long. They get a rep for doing so and no one will fund them anymore.

Most of the high paying jobs in Silicon valley are a result of Venture Capital firms. We have several VC funds here in CO designed solely to fund ideas/products in the clean tech arena. Others that are involved in biotech. That is how these high risk/high reward start ups are funded. It is not done with bank money (they are restricted from such).

When a company is struggling to survive, no matter how long they have been in existence, VC firms will come in and if they think they can be turned around, will try to do so. They are not always successful. If the success rate was north of 75%, then funding wouldn't be so hard to find for those firms. Sometimes the market just works against you... as is the case with GST. Obama won't tell you that over a dozen of the top US steel companies went under at the same time... not because of bad management, but because of cheap steel coming from Asia etc...

VC firms are essential to the economy. They are essential to R&D.

I say this as a private equity investor. The biotech firm I invested in could return me 5-10 fold on my investment. Or it could go to zero. That is the risk/reward of many private equity/VC deals.
 
Superfreak said:
No... VC firms don't have any stake in creating low vs. high paying jobs. They have a stake in making a company successful. They profit the most when the company succeeds. You will have some that try and do what the Obama admin claims Bain does. But those firms don't last long. They get a rep for doing so and no one will fund them anymore.

Most of the high paying jobs in Silicon valley are a result of Venture Capital firms. We have several VC funds here in CO designed solely to fund ideas/products in the clean tech arena. Others that are involved in biotech. That is how these high risk/high reward start ups are funded. It is not done with bank money (they are restricted from such).

When a company is struggling to survive, no matter how long they have been in existence, VC firms will come in and if they think they can be turned around, will try to do so. They are not always successful. If the success rate was north of 75%, then funding wouldn't be so hard to find for those firms. Sometimes the market just works against you... as is the case with GST. Obama won't tell you that over a dozen of the top US steel companies went under at the same time... not because of bad management, but because of cheap steel coming from Asia etc...

VC firms are essential to the economy. They are essential to R&D.

I say this as a private equity investor. The biotech firm I invested in could return me 5-10 fold on my investment. Or it could go to zero. That is the risk/reward of many private equity/VC deals.
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I mean overall. And you might want to drop Staples and Sports Authority from you posts.

Those define low-wage service jobs. What's next you tell us McDonald's was saved and 100 thousand jobs were created? Woo-hoo.
 
Darla said:
I mean overall. And you might want to drop Staples and Sports Authority from you posts.

Those define low-wage service jobs. What's next you tell us McDonald's was saved and 100 thousand jobs were created? Woo-hoo.
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Bain Capital had a stake whether the companies they assisted succeeded or failed. Investors were the ones who took the baths when they went belly-up, never Bain.
 
Darla said:
I mean overall. And you might want to drop Staples and Sports Authority from you posts.

Those define low-wage service jobs. What's next you tell us McDonald's was saved and 100 thousand jobs were created? Woo-hoo.
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It saved all the jobs, both high and low. Several of my clients work for Sports Authority and they make well into the six figures. There are jobs in this economy that are lower paying than others. It is based on skill set. It doesn't take much skill to say 'welcome to Wal Mart'. Yet WalMart pays someone to do this in every store. Ask the employees of Staples and Sports Authority if they would prefer to not have a job and instead be on welfare.

I meant overall. The VC firms are not out to create high or low paying jobs. They are out to make businesses successful. Some companies will require that the employees be highly compensated and that is the structure they will have. Others will be a mix, with the weighting towards lower paying positions. That is the structure those companies will have.

Not all jobs are designed to be held by primary income earners for families. Some are secondary or designed for the high school kid or those working in college. Some are there for seniors who want extra disposable income beyond SS and savings.
 
Bijou said:
Bain Capital had a stake whether the companies they assisted succeeded or failed. Investors were the ones who took the baths when they went belly-up, never Bain.
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That is utter bullshit. VC firms lose on deals all the time. You are simply spouting off nonsense. You have no clue how a VC firm is run or what transpires. Again, if a VC firm consistently stuck its clients with losses that itself never shared in... why would people invest with them??? The VC firms typically have the larger positions with their own money. They are side by side with their investors. But you don't care to actually learn the truth do you? You just want to spout off hate filled nonsense in an attempt to paint a candidate you don't like as 'evil'.
 
Superfreak said:
That is utter bullshit. VC firms lose on deals all the time. You are simply spouting off nonsense. You have no clue how a VC firm is run or what transpires. Again, if a VC firm consistently stuck its clients with losses that itself never shared in... why would people invest with them??? The VC firms typically have the larger positions with their own money. They are side by side with their investors. But you don't care to actually learn the truth do you? You just want to spout off hate filled nonsense in an attempt to paint a candidate you don't like as 'evil'.
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Quit frothing at the mouth. Go read the terms of the arrangement Bain had with Ampad.
 
Don Quixote said:
seems like the company mentioned had poor management
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Interestingly, Capital Investment like this has a short term control period. During the time Bain controlled the company their revenue grew and had it continued in that way they would have not only survived but thrived. However, that ended four years before the bankruptcy was filed. The bankruptcy was more the cause of big box stores undercutting them.

Now, here is where it gets interesting. Bain no longer controlled the company but was a large stake holder in the company (much of their payback was in stock, which devalued and lost in the end). Because of this they had some seats on the board, but not control of the decisions of the company. At the same time they were revamping and helping out Staples (you may know them, they are a current concern, how many jobs is that?). Romney was on the board of directors on Staples and not in control of Bain when they (Ampad) filed bankruptcy, which (also interesting) was one of the big box companies that started buying from Chinese sources to save money.

Of course they'll try to blame this on Romney, however one seat on a board does not the decisions make.

80% of the companies they invest in survive, this is an incredibly high success rate for a Venture Capital company. They do a good job and because of that many people have jobs that otherwise would not.
 
SF you talk on this thread as if the American economy moving from a higher-skilled manufacturing economy to a low-skilled service economy hasn't decimated the middle class.

I mean your rarified cluelessness really astounds me.
 
Superfreak said:
So you have no desire to actually discuss this? Duly noted.

If you wish someone to read something, by all means, post a link to it.
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I don't care whether you read it or not. It's easily accessed if you need to verify the info I already cited on this thread. 100 million on a 5 million dollar investment. Investors ROI was 0.002 percent. Looks like win/win for Bain. Ampad went bankrupt. Research it if you want, or don't. Doesn't matter to me what you do. The facts remain.
 
Darla said:
SF you talk on this thread as if the American economy moving from a higher-skilled manufacturing economy to a low-skilled service economy hasn't decimated the middle class.

I mean your rarified cluelessness really astounds me.
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He's not clueless. He's biased. We're skewering what is, for him, a sacred cow because this stuff is SF's bread and butter. That's why I won't do his homework for him. He knows damn well the stuff I'm citing about Ampad and Bain is factual.
 
Darla said:
SF you talk on this thread as if the American economy moving from a higher-skilled manufacturing economy to a low-skilled service economy hasn't decimated the middle class.

I mean your rarified cluelessness really astounds me.
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What are you rambling about? I was talking specifically about VC firms and correcting the false statements of Bijou. The above is not evenly remotely close to what we were discussing.
 
Bijou said:
He's not clueless. He's biased. We're skewering what is, for him, a sacred cow because this stuff is SF's bread and butter. That's why I won't do his homework for him. He knows damn well the stuff I'm citing about Ampad and Bain is factual.
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I have never heard of the situation with Ampad. There are thousands of VC deals every year. If you wish to discuss ONE, then post a link to what you want to discuss. It is not 'my homework'. You made a statement, either back it up or shut the fuck up about it.

I am not the one biased, you are. You have bought into the bullshit Obama is feeding you. You have no clue what VC firms do. You just want to parrot one talking point after another. I linked up to the Soros speculating and you ignore it. I try to explain to you how VC firms work and you stick your hands over your ears and shout 'la la la I can't hear you'.
 
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