Do liberals reallly care about the poor? ( Non trolling version)

[Jade Dragon]

Unlike Legions dicking around, this one is real. As far as I can say, they definitely care more than conservatives. You need food or other needs, come on by I say. I have more then enough. Probably too much. We've already had a few boarders in the past, that needed a place to stay. Republicans votes don't count in the public poll, because you can't answer for us.

 

[Jade Dragon]

Already a Repub vote to discount? Come on people.

 

[Jack]

If we support a Meritocracy, then some are going to have more than others.

 

[Jade Dragon]

Fellow liberals, use this discussion to tell how you help the poor.

 

[Jack]

If most 'Liberals' are 'poor' (or think they are 'poor') they aren't helping anybody, they are expecting others to help them.
Well off Conservative types think money given to the 'poor' is just wasted on cigarettes, whiskey, and lottery tickets.

"Well off people Plan for 3 Generations, ... Poor people Plan for Saturday Night". That's the typical view.

 

[Jade Dragon]

If most 'Liberals' are 'poor' (or think they are 'poor') they aren't helping anybody, they are expecting others to help them.
Well off Conservative types think money given to the 'poor' is just wasted on cigarettes, whiskey, and lottery tickets.

"Well off people Plan for 3 Generations, ... Poor people Plan for Saturday Night". That's the typical view.

We want the government to do stuff, because there isn't enough that people can do on their own without joining the poorhouse ourselves. Some people can't provide for themselves because they don't have the capability. Since most people aren't beasts with us, or them mentalities, we take care of those disabled, poor, or injured. The way some conservatives act, it seems they'd rather disabled, and poor people unable to care for themselves, either miraculously start working by a miracle, or let natural selection take over. You often hear conservative Christians saying the poor aren't our problem.

 

[Jack]

We want the government to do stuff, because there isn't enough that people can do on their own without joining the poorhouse ourselves. Some people can't provide for themselves because they are don't have the capability. Since most people aren't beasts with us, or them mentalities, we take care of those disabled, poor, or injured. The way some conservatives act, it seems they'd rather disabled, and poor people unable to care for themselves, either miraculously start working by a miracle, or let natural selection take over. You often hear conservative Christians saying the poor aren't our problem.

My View: You are a product of the DNA 'roll-of-the-dice'. Some get good genes, some get not-so-good genes. The 'cream' rises to the top and feel they deserve MORE because they're on Top. The people on the bottom want what 'the Jones have'. I think Plato divided people into the 'Gold Class', the 'Silver Class', and the 'Bronze Class'. The Gold Class being the Rulers, and the Bronze Class being the Worker Drones (that are expendable because there are so many of them). Fast Forward to Modern times. What is the 'floor'? What is the Minimum Level of Subsistence that a Country decides to create to maintain the Survival of it's Most Dependent Citizens? So, you can go around the World and see what other countries have done. Probably the most stark and revealing is 'Health Care'. All First World countries feel health care is right up there with Food and Housing. Well, not ALL First World countries.

The US has Food Stamps so people don't starve. In Third World countries, people actually starve to death. They die. The US has Public Housing, so most have a place to stay under a roof. Third World countries have intergenerational housing. 3 generations all under one roof. The US has Medicaid. Third World countries have nothing. People die from simple infections. You may not know it, but you're living like a King.

It's all 'comparative'. Everybody wants the same crap and toys the 'Joneses have'. I have the perfect Example. I have a friend, a Worker Drone, that joined the Revolutionary Communist Party. A True Believer. Handed out the RCP flyers. Attended meetings. Went to Demonstrations. Then ... he inherited a million dollars. His folks died with a sizable Estate. Now, he spends his time traveling, buying Property, enjoying the Leisure Life. I ask him about the RCP, he tells me he is 'burnt out'. disillusioned.

So. It's all about your station in Life. The Wealthy tell their children "You MAKE money in Stocks ... and you KEEP money in Bonds". While the Poor tell their children "Get a Job".

 

[Irish Exit]

If most 'Liberals' are 'poor' (or think they are 'poor') they aren't helping anybody, they are expecting others to help them.
Well off Conservative types think money given to the 'poor' is just wasted on cigarettes, whiskey, and lottery tickets.

"Well off people Plan for 3 Generations, ... Poor people Plan for Saturday Night". That's the typical view.

I can't think of a single way that I help the poor where there is not a conservative doing the exact same thing, and sometimes moreso. I am all for the left-right troll-a-thon at times, but the reality is the war on poverty dropped poverty about 10% of the total population more or less and we have been stuck in the mid-teens more or less ever since. I don't buy the "It's not the government's job" or "Let private charity handle it" nonsense, but spending more on the same programs that are not moving us closer to the goal line after 40 years doesn't offer much hope that we will go anywhere better. So, if a new idea like Trump's Blue Apron boxes comes a long, sure I am willing to support at least giving it a try. Not trying isn't getting us anywhere new.

 

[Jack]

I can't think of a single way that I help the poor where there is not a conservative doing the exact same thing, and sometimes moreso. I am all for the left-right troll-a-thon at times, but the reality is the war on poverty dropped poverty about 10% of the total population more or less and we have been stuck in the mid-teens more or less ever since. I don't buy the "It's not the government's job" or "Let private charity handle it" nonsense, but spending more on the same programs that are not moving us closer to the goal line after 40 years doesn't offer much hope that we will go anywhere better. So, if a new idea like Trump's Blue Apron boxes comes a long, sure I am willing to support at least giving it a try. Not trying isn't getting us anywhere new.

My Perspective; More and more people are going to be replaced by automation. The people that have a job today and call the unemployed 'lazy and shiftless' will be singing a different tune when they lose their job to automation. We're a Consumer Nation, we buy crap. What happens when more and more people are unable to 'consume' because they have No Money?

I have no idea what Trump's Blue Apron boxes is/are?

 

[Irish Exit]

My Perspective; More and more people are going to be replaced by automation. The people that have a job today and call the unemployed 'lazy and shiftless' will be singing a different tune when they lose their job to automation. We're a Consumer Nation, we buy crap. What happens when more and more people are unable to 'consume' because they have No Money?

I have no idea what Trump's Blue Apron boxes is/are?

They will consume less (and Mother Earth will thank them for it).

He proposed a pilot program in which people would receive fewer food stamps and instead get home delivered boxes of food to save money by bulk buying staples. It would depend on the details as to what I would support, but if it cuts down on the exploitation of the poor by convenience stores converting food stamps to cash at a healthy chunk to themselves, I am all for it.

 

[Jack]

They will consume less (and Mother Earth will thank them for it).

He proposed a pilot program in which people would receive fewer food stamps and instead get home delivered boxes of food to save money by bulk buying staples. It would depend on the details as to what I would support, but if it cuts down on the exploitation of the poor by convenience stores converting food stamps to cash at a healthy chunk to themselves, I am all for it.

"They will consume less".
When Corporate America realizes that, they will be the First to demand that Americans receive a UBI (Universal Basic Income). Can you imagine a Christmas with no toys? How about empty McDonalds? No more 16 Plex Theaters? Yeah, Shareholders will demand they get their Quarterly Dividends.

 

[ThatOwlWoman]

Unlike Legions dicking around, this one is real. As far as I can say, they definitely care more than conservatives. You need food or other needs, come on by I say. I have more then enough. Probably too much. We've already had a few boarders in the past, that needed a place to stay. Republicans votes don't count in the public poll, because you can't answer for us.

I've been a liberal since I could think about politics. So over 50 years. I grew up as a privileged white person in an upper middle class lifestyle... but our parents told us of their own humble (and in mom's case extreme poverty) childhoods, and taught us to be grateful for our current existence, and to care for those who weren't so lucky. As an adult I have led an interesting economic life ranging from the poverty of having utilities shut off for inability to pay, going to a food pantry to get stuff to feed my kids because domestic shit you don't want to hear about... to retiring to a lifestyle that is like that of my parents in their retirement years. I have "lived poor" and done shit like run extension cords from our house with electric to the neighbor who got hers shut off for nonpayment, sharing a crappy dinner with a neighbor family ... macaroni n cheese and fish sticks and a can of green beans, etc. So yeah, my caring about the poor comes from having been there, done that. This liberal continues to feed needy families and works to better our mutual existence.

 

[Irish Exit]

"They will consume less".
When Corporate America realizes that, they will be the First to demand that Americans receive a UBI (Universal Basic Income). Can you imagine a Christmas with no toys? How about empty McDonalds? No more 16 Plex Theaters? Yeah, Shareholders will demand they get their Quarterly Dividends.

I oppose UBI because it is nothing but a corporate subsidy that allows corporation to deploy more machines with fewer consequences. If people have to go back to dirt farming to survive, Wall Street will collapse and we can get the government we need, not one constrained by 250 year old rich white dudes, one of whom himself thought the government should be restructured every few generations.

 

[Jack]

I oppose UBI because it is nothing but a corporate subsidy that allows corporation to deploy more machines with fewer consequences. If people have to go back to dirt farming to survive, Wall Street will collapse and we can get the government we need, not one constrained by 250 year old rich white dudes, one of whom himself thought the government should be restructured every few generations.

hahaha ... yeah, you oppose UBI ... because you have a job. I don't know where your slot is in the Big Picture, but if you lose your job you'll be first in line at the unemployment office.

Others think going back to some Agrarian Culture is going to be a Better Idea. Most (China, Russia, Saudi Arabia, etc.) WON'T be doing that. By the time they get done with you, YOU'LL be the Oxen, along with your kids and your wife. Our direction is getting off the Planet, not going back to the Stone Age.

 

[Jade Dragon]

3 votes that don't count. Poor Legion. Is dicking around on forums all he has?

 

[Irish Exit]

hahaha ... yeah, you oppose UBI ... because you have a job. I don't know where your slot is in the Big Picture, but if you lose your job you'll be first in line at the unemployment office.

Others think going back to some Agrarian Culture is going to be a Better Idea. Most (China, Russia, Saudi Arabia, etc.) WON'T be doing that. By the time they get done with you, YOU'LL be the Oxen, along with your kids and your wife. Our direction is getting off the Planet, not going back to the Stone Age.

I am not eligible for unemployment except in very rare circumstances and I have never not had a job when I wanted to have a job, even if the job sucked donkey balls. That is what happens when one takes responsibility for their own lives instead of waiting for someone to hand them something they find mildly attractive. Instead of UBI, repeal zoning laws and let people raise chickens in their backyard to survive. I do not and under no circumstances will I ever support UBI. "Food Stamps for everybody!!!" is not a solution to any problem society faces. Continue being a Wall Street pawn--it shows their investment in the DNC is paying dividends.

 

[Jack]

I am not eligible for unemployment except in very rare circumstances and I have never not had a job when I wanted to have a job, even if the job sucked donkey balls. That is what happens when one takes responsibility for their own lives instead of waiting for someone to hand them something they find mildly attractive. Instead of UBI, repeal zoning laws and let people raise chickens in their backyard to survive. I do not and under no circumstances will I ever support UBI. "Food Stamps for everybody!!!" is not a solution to any problem society faces. Continue being a Wall Street pawn--it shows their investment in the DNC is paying dividends.

Did you go to Public School? Was it free? That's a Program that costs the same whether you are a single child or you're from a Family of 12. That's a communal program, education of the Nation's children, free for every kid. We all chip in and pay for it, even if we don't have kids ourselves. So your "I do not and under no circumstances will I ever support UBI." may be an opinion by you, but you may be paying for it whether you like it or not, similar to your tax dollars for Public Education.

Kacper: "Continue being a Wall Street pawn".
Who do you think Congress works for? You/me, or 'Wall Street" ... the Elite, the Gold Class. I have no illusions.

 

[Irish Exit]

Did you go to Public School? Was it free? That's a Program that costs the same whether you are a single child or you're from a Family of 12. That's a communal program, education of the Nation's children, free for every kid. We all chip in and pay for it, even if we don't have kids ourselves. So your "I do not and under no circumstances will I ever support UBI." may be an opinion by you, but you may be paying for it whether you like it or not, similar to your tax dollars for Public Education.

Kacper: "Continue being a Wall Street pawn".
Who do you think Congress works for? You/me, or 'Wall Street" ... the Elite, the Gold Class. I have no illusions.

In my school we learned math. The math says to give every adult in the US even $1,000 per month would cost $3T dollars/year.

Finland is ending their failed experiment with UBI because it doesn't work and costs too damn much https://www.bloomberg.com/view/arti...rce=twitter&cmpid=socialflow-twitter-business

If you don't believe me, listen to The Economist https://www.economist.com/open-futu...ut-will-create-new-ones?fsrc=scn/tw/te/bl/ed/

 

[Jack]

In my school we learned math. The math says to give every adult in the US even $1,000 per month would cost $3T dollars/year.

Finland is ending their failed experiment with UBI because it doesn't work and costs too damn much https://www.bloomberg.com/view/arti...rce=twitter&cmpid=socialflow-twitter-business

If you don't believe me, listen to The Economist https://www.economist.com/open-futu...ut-will-create-new-ones?fsrc=scn/tw/te/bl/ed/

Hey, I'm not pulling the strings here.

500 years ago in England, the Landlords were converting their Land to raise sheep rather than grow crops. They paid the Tenant Farmers to raze their homes that had been there for generations. More profitable to raise sheep and less manpower was needed. The Farmers and their wives and children migrated to the Cities. The Farmers couldn't find work so they stole to feed their Families. The women became Prostitutes, the Children became pickpockets. The thieves were hung sometimes 20 in a day.
So, when there are too many people here and not enough jobs to go around, what do you think should be done with the excess people?

 

[Irish Exit]

Hey, I'm not pulling the strings here.

500 years ago in England, the Landlords were converting their Land to raise sheep rather than grow crops. They paid the Tenant Farmers to raze their homes that had been there for generations. More profitable to raise sheep and less manpower was needed. The Farmers and their wives and children migrated to the Cities. The Farmers couldn't find work so they stole to feed their Families. The women became Prostitutes, the Children became pickpockets. The thieves were hung sometimes 20 in a day.
So, when there are too many people here and not enough jobs to go around, what do you think should be done with the excess people?

They should become sheep farmers and whores based on your analysis, correct?

You really don't see it do you? Assuming automation steals all the jobs (which it won't), you still see capitalism as an inevitable, set in stone system that must be maintained and therefore you only see a UBI as the answer because you are being pawned into believing that is what is best. It is the best system for the current oligarchy and maintaining it under such circumstances would only perpetuate their control as the only end result of a UBI would be absolute communism.