Doge Clock...

If they stop his subsidies how will he afford eggs? 🤣​


if-they-stop-his-subsidies-how-will-he-afford-eggs-v0-vrqm0ox0kdje1.jpeg
 
FAGATs don't do research.



  • In the past, Tesla benefited significantly from federal tax credits for electric vehicle (EV) buyers, offering up to $7,500 per vehicle under the federal EV tax credit program. This credit began phasing out for Tesla buyers after the company sold 200,000 eligible vehicles, with the credit fully expiring for Tesla buyers by the end of 2019. However, the Biden administration's Inflation Reduction Act of 2022 restored some EV tax credits, though with new eligibility criteria (e.g., price caps, North American assembly requirements). Tesla vehicles may qualify again, but the benefit goes to consumers, not directly to Tesla.
  • ATVM Loan Program: In 2010, Tesla received a $465 million loan from the U.S. Department of Energy's Advanced Technology Vehicles Manufacturing (ATVM) program to support EV production. Tesla repaid this loan in full, with interest, by 2013, nine years early.
  • State and Local Incentives: Tesla has received significant state-level incentives, such as $1.3 billion in tax breaks from Nevada for its Gigafactory, which are not federal subsidies but are worth noting for context.
  • Regulatory Credits: Tesla earns revenue by selling environmental credits (e.g., zero-emission vehicle credits) to other automakers who need them to comply with state regulations, such as in California. While not a direct federal subsidy, this system is enabled by government environmental policies.
  • Current Federal Subsidies (2025):
    • Tesla does not currently receive large, direct federal subsidies like grants or loans, as it did in its early years. However, its customers may still benefit from EV tax credits under the Inflation Reduction Act, which indirectly supports Tesla's sales.
    • Tesla has received minor federal contracts (e.g., $41.9 million since 2008 for services like solar panels for government agencies), but these are payments for goods/services, not subsidies.
    • Elon Musk has publicly stated that EV incentives represent a minor part of Tesla's revenue and has even argued for removing all subsidies, claiming it would benefit Tesla by hurting competitors more (e.g., in posts on X in July and September 2024).

SpaceX and Federal Subsidies
  • Historical and Current Government Contracts:
    • SpaceX is primarily a government contractor, not a recipient of traditional subsidies. Since 2003, it has received nearly $20 billion in federal contracts, primarily from NASA and the Department of Defense, for services like launching satellites, resupplying the International Space Station (ISS), and developing lunar landers for the Artemis program.
      • Notable contracts include a $1.6 billion deal in 2008 for ISS resupply missions, a $2.89 billion contract in 2021 for lunar lander development, and $3.8 billion in contracts in fiscal year 2024 alone.
    • These contracts are payments for services rendered, not subsidies, as SpaceX delivers specific capabilities (e.g., Falcon 9 launches, Dragon spacecraft) at competitive prices compared to traditional contractors like Boeing.
  • Subsidies and Incentives:
    • SpaceX has sought and received some direct subsidies, such as $15 million in economic development incentives from Texas for building a commercial launchpad and a $885 million rural broadband subsidy for Starlink (denied by the FCC in 2022, with the decision reaffirmed in 2023).
    • While not subsidies, SpaceX's early survival depended on NASA contracts (e.g., the 2008 ISS contract), which were crucial for developing the Falcon 9 and Dragon spacecraft. These public-private partnerships have saved NASA money compared to traditional contracting methods.
  • Current Status (2025):
    • SpaceX continues to receive significant federal contracts, with over $17 billion awarded since 2015, including $13 billion from NASA alone. These are not subsidies but payments for services, making SpaceX one of NASA's largest contractors.

@Grok
 
Diogenes said:
FAGATs don't do research.



  • In the past, Tesla benefited significantly from federal tax credits for electric vehicle (EV) buyers, offering up to $7,500 per vehicle under the federal EV tax credit program. This credit began phasing out for Tesla buyers after the company sold 200,000 eligible vehicles, with the credit fully expiring for Tesla buyers by the end of 2019. However, the Biden administration's Inflation Reduction Act of 2022 restored some EV tax credits, though with new eligibility criteria (e.g., price caps, North American assembly requirements). Tesla vehicles may qualify again, but the benefit goes to consumers, not directly to Tesla.
  • ATVM Loan Program: In 2010, Tesla received a $465 million loan from the U.S. Department of Energy's Advanced Technology Vehicles Manufacturing (ATVM) program to support EV production. Tesla repaid this loan in full, with interest, by 2013, nine years early.
  • State and Local Incentives: Tesla has received significant state-level incentives, such as $1.3 billion in tax breaks from Nevada for its Gigafactory, which are not federal subsidies but are worth noting for context.
  • Regulatory Credits: Tesla earns revenue by selling environmental credits (e.g., zero-emission vehicle credits) to other automakers who need them to comply with state regulations, such as in California. While not a direct federal subsidy, this system is enabled by government environmental policies.
  • Current Federal Subsidies (2025):
    • Tesla does not currently receive large, direct federal subsidies like grants or loans, as it did in its early years. However, its customers may still benefit from EV tax credits under the Inflation Reduction Act, which indirectly supports Tesla's sales.
    • Tesla has received minor federal contracts (e.g., $41.9 million since 2008 for services like solar panels for government agencies), but these are payments for goods/services, not subsidies.
    • Elon Musk has publicly stated that EV incentives represent a minor part of Tesla's revenue and has even argued for removing all subsidies, claiming it would benefit Tesla by hurting competitors more (e.g., in posts on X in July and September 2024).

SpaceX and Federal Subsidies
  • Historical and Current Government Contracts:
    • SpaceX is primarily a government contractor, not a recipient of traditional subsidies. Since 2003, it has received nearly $20 billion in federal contracts, primarily from NASA and the Department of Defense, for services like launching satellites, resupplying the International Space Station (ISS), and developing lunar landers for the Artemis program.
      • Notable contracts include a $1.6 billion deal in 2008 for ISS resupply missions, a $2.89 billion contract in 2021 for lunar lander development, and $3.8 billion in contracts in fiscal year 2024 alone.
    • These contracts are payments for services rendered, not subsidies, as SpaceX delivers specific capabilities (e.g., Falcon 9 launches, Dragon spacecraft) at competitive prices compared to traditional contractors like Boeing.
  • Subsidies and Incentives:
    • SpaceX has sought and received some direct subsidies, such as $15 million in economic development incentives from Texas for building a commercial launchpad and a $885 million rural broadband subsidy for Starlink (denied by the FCC in 2022, with the decision reaffirmed in 2023).
    • While not subsidies, SpaceX's early survival depended on NASA contracts (e.g., the 2008 ISS contract), which were crucial for developing the Falcon 9 and Dragon spacecraft. These public-private partnerships have saved NASA money compared to traditional contracting methods.
  • Current Status (2025):
    • SpaceX continues to receive significant federal contracts, with over $17 billion awarded since 2015, including $13 billion from NASA alone. These are not subsidies but payments for services, making SpaceX one of NASA's largest contractors.

@Grok
Click to expand...
:cheers:
 
FastLane said:
SpaceX hasn't killed anyone yet. NASA has killed several.
Click to expand...
SpaceX has a terrible safety record. And they kept this death secret for almost 10 years.

"One windy night at Elon Musk’s SpaceX facility in McGregor, Texas, Lonnie LeBlanc and his co-workers realized they had a problem.

They needed to transport foam insulation to the rocket company’s main hangar but had no straps to secure the cargo. LeBlanc, a relatively new employee, offered a solution to hold down the load: He sat on it.

After the truck drove away, a gust blew LeBlanc and the insulation off the trailer, slamming him headfirst into the pavement. LeBlanc, 38, had retired nine months earlier from the U.S. Marine Corps. He was pronounced dead from head trauma at the scene.

Federal inspectors with the U.S. Occupational Safety and Health Administration (OSHA) later determined that SpaceX had failed to protect LeBlanc from a clear hazard, noting the gravity and severity of the violation. LeBlanc’s co-workers told OSHA that SpaceX had no convenient access to tie-downs and no process or oversight for handling such loads. SpaceX acknowledged the problems, and the agency instructed the company to make seven specific safety improvements, including more training and equipment, according to the inspection report.

It was hardly the last serious accident at SpaceX. Since LeBlanc’s death in June 2014, which hasn’t been previously reported, Musk’s rocket company has disregarded worker-safety regulations and standard practices at its inherently dangerous rocket and satellite facilities nationwide, with workers paying a heavy price, a Reuters investigation found. Through interviews and government records, the news organization documented at least 600 injuries of SpaceX workers since 2014.

Many were serious or disabling. The records included reports of more than 100 workers suffering cuts or lacerations, 29 with broken bones or dislocations, 17 whose hands or fingers were “crushed,” and nine with head injuries, including one skull fracture, four concussions and one traumatic brain injury. The cases also included five burns, five electrocutions, eight accidents that led to amputations, 12 injuries involving multiple unspecified body parts, and seven workers with eye injuries. Others were relatively minor, including more than 170 reports of strains or sprains."

Continued
 
Phantasmal said:
Ridiculous, they haven’t saved anything, all their actions are facing court challenges.

Republicans are starting to notice how DOGE actions are negatively affecting their states.
Click to expand...
I tend to agree. First, many of their claims are specious. Second, I think time will prove they are simply moving money from one pocket to another...their own.

Elon really, really wants to go to Mars and it will cost a lot more money than even he has so the US treasury is a good place to find a sponsor.
 
Damocles said:
Yeah, but they want to tell you that it is a "scramble" and that there is "chaos"....

I'll tell you what, I prefer chaos to spending as usual.
Click to expand...
Cuts in the FBI, CIA and our nuclear security personnel is not a worry to the MAGA morons....until there's a terrorist hit on the US again.

I fully support cutting waste, fraud and abuse, but that's the responsibility of Congress; they hold the purse strings and they have the oversight committees. If there's waste, fraud and abuse, it's on them, not the agencies they fund and oversee.
 
christiefan915 said:
SpaceX has a terrible safety record. And they kept this death secret for almost 10 years.

"One windy night at Elon Musk’s SpaceX facility in McGregor, Texas, Lonnie LeBlanc and his co-workers realized they had a problem.

They needed to transport foam insulation to the rocket company’s main hangar but had no straps to secure the cargo. LeBlanc, a relatively new employee, offered a solution to hold down the load: He sat on it.

After the truck drove away, a gust blew LeBlanc and the insulation off the trailer, slamming him headfirst into the pavement. LeBlanc, 38, had retired nine months earlier from the U.S. Marine Corps. He was pronounced dead from head trauma at the scene.

Federal inspectors with the U.S. Occupational Safety and Health Administration (OSHA) later determined that SpaceX had failed to protect LeBlanc from a clear hazard, noting the gravity and severity of the violation. LeBlanc’s co-workers told OSHA that SpaceX had no convenient access to tie-downs and no process or oversight for handling such loads. SpaceX acknowledged the problems, and the agency instructed the company to make seven specific safety improvements, including more training and equipment, according to the inspection report.

It was hardly the last serious accident at SpaceX. Since LeBlanc’s death in June 2014, which hasn’t been previously reported, Musk’s rocket company has disregarded worker-safety regulations and standard practices at its inherently dangerous rocket and satellite facilities nationwide, with workers paying a heavy price, a Reuters investigation found. Through interviews and government records, the news organization documented at least 600 injuries of SpaceX workers since 2014.

Many were serious or disabling. The records included reports of more than 100 workers suffering cuts or lacerations, 29 with broken bones or dislocations, 17 whose hands or fingers were “crushed,” and nine with head injuries, including one skull fracture, four concussions and one traumatic brain injury. The cases also included five burns, five electrocutions, eight accidents that led to amputations, 12 injuries involving multiple unspecified body parts, and seven workers with eye injuries. Others were relatively minor, including more than 170 reports of strains or sprains."

Continued
Click to expand...
Nice try, Leblanc wasn't an astronaut. When you have over 13,000 employees like Space X you are going to have work place injuries. NASA has lost 14 astronauts.
 
Phantasmal said:
It’s very cruel, a lot of people with anxiety about their futures, like my niece whose program benefits disabled veterans, and others find employment, food, clothing to fit them for success. She has 10 employees and they wonder if their jobs are being cut, meanwhile, people are seeing bird flu increase, farmers fretting over possible bankruptcy, and the price of eggs is still going up.


But, you like the chaos that causes that others misery. That’s sad, even for a libertarian.
Click to expand...
He's not a Libertarian. Damo clearly support the Party of Trump agenda, not the LP agenda.
 
FastLane said:
Nice try, Leblanc wasn't an astronaut. When you have over 13,000 employees like Space X you are going to have work place injuries. NASA has lost 14 astronauts.
Click to expand...
Reuters got USAID money. $8 million was it?
You shouldn't believe them, they've been paid by our government to lie to you. Specifically to lie to you.
Gj4mU-bXIAEByf2
 
FastLane said:
Nice try, Leblanc wasn't an astronaut. When you have over 13,000 employees like Space X you are going to have work place injuries. NASA has lost 14 astronauts.
Click to expand...
Nice attempt at a comeback. Your post named two companies, not people. "SpaceX hasn't killed anyone yet. NASA has killed several." Words matter.

Nothing to say about SpaceX's safety violations and the 10-year coverup?
 
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