Hugo Chavez: Glaring example of Socialist FAIL!

It is widely reported, Hugo Chavez' net worth at the time of his death, was in the neighborhood of $1 billion. This is a considerably large chunk of wealth for a man who never had a regular job, other than life-long president of Venezuela. He spent his early years in the military, and as far as I am aware, not many billionaires have made their fortunes serving in the military, so where did Chavez acquire all of this money?

The principles espoused by Socialists, (and by basically every pinhead liberal on this board), argues for a system where everyone has equality of wealth. "Value extraction" and fair compensation for labor, wealth redistribution, so that everyone shares more equally, a piece of the pie. But Chavez, it seems, had a billion dollar piece of that pie in Venezuela. Now, since I doubt the average person in Venezuela is a billionaire, my question becomes; How could one man end up controlling so much wealth, under a system which promises wealth equality?

The answer here is simple, Chavez is a prime example of how Socialist systems FAIL! Chavez was the ruler and the ruler makes the rules, therefore, the ruler can obtain however much wealth they please. Graft and corruption are prevalent, as the people around Chavez are able to manipulate resources and pilfer money which should have gone to the people. The result, as we see with virtually every Socialist regime, is a Ruling Class, who control all the wealth and power... the 1%.

In America, the hated and reviled 1% are people who own corporations or businessmen who have made wise investments, and we are free to penalize them with more taxation, more regulation, and we can even proactively boycott their businesses and not buy their products in protest. We can stage sit-ins and demand government do something about the 1%, and our elected representatives can listen to our concerns and pass legislation, etc. When the 1% is the Ruling Class, you can't do any of this. What product can you boycott? Who can you turn to? The 1% now control not only the wealth, but also the political power, and not in some removed sense, but directly. Would we allow the 1% in America to determine all our laws and handle government? What would likely happen? Of course, their best interests would be served, and it wouldn't be good for the 'average' person. But the same principle applies if the 1% are the Ruling Class. The difference being, there is no recourse against the Ruling Class, except Revolution.
 
I can't understand why I haven't had a response from you Socialists here? I figured you would all come out of the woodwork to defend your hero, Chavez, but apparently you are all too busy purchasing your lithograph shirts with his image or something, and haven't had the chance. Fuck it, your Che shirt, Mao shirt, and Castro shirt are still clean, you can afford a few minutes to answer my questions, right?

How can the life-long leader of a political ideology which promises wealth equity, end up with over a billion dollars? Are some people more "equal" than others under Socialism?
 
I can't understand why I haven't had a response from you Socialists here? I figured you would all come out of the woodwork to defend your hero, Chavez, but apparently you are all too busy purchasing your lithograph shirts with his image or something, and haven't had the chance. Fuck it, your Che shirt, Mao shirt, and Castro shirt are still clean, you can afford a few minutes to answer my questions, right?

How can the life-long leader of a political ideology which promises wealth equity, end up with over a billion dollars? Are some people more "equal" than others under Socialism?

http://www.justplainpolitics.com/sh...enezuela-Dies-at-Age-58&p=1178655#post1178655
 

Ahhh.... So the argument is going to be that Chavez and his policies are not really Socialism? This seems to be a continual thing with Liberal Socialists... whenever these clowns are in power, you are running around with your noses up their ass as far as you can get them, praising what they are doing and how great and wonderful their socialist policies are, until they die or it's revealed they stole all the wealth or committed mass genocide, then suddenly, they weren't really Socialists!
 
I can't understand why I haven't had a response from you Socialists here? I figured you would all come out of the woodwork to defend your hero, Chavez, but apparently you are all too busy purchasing your lithograph shirts with his image or something, and haven't had the chance. Fuck it, your Che shirt, Mao shirt, and Castro shirt are still clean, you can afford a few minutes to answer my questions, right?

How can the life-long leader of a political ideology which promises wealth equity, end up with over a billion dollars? Are some people more "equal" than others under Socialism?

He was a greedy politician, but why worry about Chavez, we have enough of our own.
 
I can't understand why I haven't had a response from you Socialists here? I figured you would all come out of the woodwork to defend your hero, Chavez, but apparently you are all too busy purchasing your lithograph shirts with his image or something, and haven't had the chance. Fuck it, your Che shirt, Mao shirt, and Castro shirt are still clean, you can afford a few minutes to answer my questions, right?

How can the life-long leader of a political ideology which promises wealth equity, end up with over a billion dollars? Are some people more "equal" than others under Socialism?

Personally speaking as a socialist .. I don't get twisted about ignorance. Your thread is the arrogance of ignorance .. and you don't have the slightest clue what you're talking about .. but your ignorance is not my problem to solve.

Chavez has been EXPONENTIALLY beneficial to the Venezuelan people. Not knowing the difference in the quality of life of venezuelans now compared to before Chavez is a glaring demonstration of the ignorance that I spoke of.

Before Chavez was elected in 1998 70% of Venezuelans lived in poverty, 50% were illiterate, and 50% were employed in the informal sector. Chavez started his presidency with an all out literacy campaign and Venezuela now has a 93% literacy rate.

Before Chavez the unemployment rate in Venezuela was 14.5% .. today it's 7.8%. Infant mortality was 20/1000 .. today its 13.

Extreme poverty was 24% .. today it's 8.5%

Oil exports have boomed from 14.4% to 60%.

GDP per capita has risen from $4,105 to $10,810.

And all Venezuelans have free healthcare and education.

Next time you ask why nobody is paying your thread any attention .. perhaps you should check and make sure it's not because its stupid.
 
Personally speaking as a socialist .. I don't get twisted about ignorance. Your thread is the arrogance of ignorance .. and you don't have the slightest clue what you're talking about .. but your ignorance is not my problem to solve.

Chavez has been EXPONENTIALLY beneficial to the Venezuelan people. Not knowing the difference in the quality of life of venezuelans now compared to before Chavez is a glaring demonstration of the ignorance that I spoke of.

Before Chavez was elected in 1998 70% of Venezuelans lived in poverty, 50% were illiterate, and 50% were employed in the informal sector. Chavez started his presidency with an all out literacy campaign and Venezuela now has a 93% literacy rate.

Before Chavez the unemployment rate in Venezuela was 14.5% .. today it's 7.8%. Infant mortality was 20/1000 .. today its 13.

Extreme poverty was 24% .. today it's 8.5%

Oil exports have boomed from 14.4% to 60%.

GDP per capita has risen from $4,105 to $10,810.

And all Venezuelans have free healthcare and education.

Next time you ask why nobody is paying your thread any attention .. perhaps you should check and make sure it's not because its stupid.

I notice how you gloss over the part about Chavez amassing a fortune for himself. How convenient.

Given the oil boom,his so called accomplishments are pretty pedestrian
 
Gradates from higher education under Chavez

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Venezuelans Receiving Pensions

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Child Malnutrition- Age 5 and Under

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Education: Net Enrollment

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After the hagiography supplied by BAC, here is something nearer the truth from the Guardian.


Hugo Chávez revolution mired by claims of corruption


Ex-socialist star Wilmer Azuaje joins tide of protest against alleged corruption of inner-circleRory Carroll
Hugo-Ch-vez-waves-to-supp-001.jpg


Hugo Chávez waves to supporters in Barinas with his state governor brother Adán (left), whose appointment was marred by fraud allegations. Photograph: Thomas Coex/AFP/Getty Images

Wilmer Azuaje was a young firebrand when he joined Hugo Chávez's revolution a decade ago to topple Venezuela's corrupt ruling class. He was elected to the national assembly and worked with the president's family to turn their home state of Barinas, a rural backwater of cattle ranches, into a laboratory of change. Azuaje was inspired by Chávez's promise to sweep away a history of graft and patronage which had stunted an oil-driven economy. "I believed in the process of reform," said Azuaje. Not anymore. The baby-faced protege, once a rising star in the ruling party, has now become the Chávez family's most outspoken foe. "They turned out to be the most corrupt ever. They betrayed us."

Azuaje has blown the whistle on what he claims is a kleptocratic dynasty in Barinas where farms, businesses, banks and government contracts have been pocketed by the president's parents and five brothers. The allegations come amid wider complaints that the revolutionary socialist movement known as "chavismo" has been hijacked by money-driven opportunists inside, or close to, the government. Nationalisations, the creation of new state enterprises and a maze of price and currency controls have spawned well-connected millionaires nicknamed Boligarchs, after the independence hero revered by Chávez, Simón Bolívar. Murky state finances meanwhile have put Venezuela 162nd, alongside Angola and Congo, out of 180 countries in Transparency International's corruption perceptions index.

Chávez appears to have recognised the wheel has turned: that the cry against corruption which helped bring him to power in 1998 will be used against his candidates in September's legislative elections. "This party has to tighten the moral belt," he said in December last year. The charismatic leader remains popular with many of the poor for spending oil revenues on social programmes but with the economy shrinking and widespread electricity and water shortages the perception of sleaze could tip the balance against his PSUV party. Some 64% think corruption has worsened and regard things to be generally going badly, according to a recent poll.

For Chávez it is especially galling that Barinas, the family fiefdom and revolution showcase, is now cited for corruption, nepotism and misrule. Critics have a list of grievances and accusations which make the state's administration sound like a soap opera. Chávez's father ruled as governor for a decade until handing over to the president's brother, Adán, in an election marred by fraud allegations. Other brothers are also thriving: Aníbal is mayor of nearby Sabaneta; Adelis is a top banker at Banco Sofitasa, which enjoys government contracts; Argenis wields enormous clout as a political fixer; Narciso is reportedly planning his own election run.

Members of what is dubbed the "royal family" travel in convoys of 4x4s. The president's once-matronly mother, Elena, has had a makeover with plastic surgery, designer clothes, bling jewellery and a poodle named Coqui. It is alleged the family bought thousands of hectares of farmland through proxies, including a former labourer, Nestor Izarra, who is named as the owner of one estate, La Malagueña. The family has denied any wrongdoing.

The cost of a football stadium built under Adelis Chávez's supervision ballooned to $93m (£60m) and remains unfinished three years after hosting its first game. A Venezuelan-Cuban sugarcane project has been mired in a $1.5m embezzlement scam. The state government uses emergency decrees for public works which bypass open tender requirement and allegedly reward cronies. Crime, notably kidnapping, has exploded, with even the middle class and poor falling prey to gangs which brazenly abduct victims from roads, shopping malls and universities. You are four times likelier to be kidnapped in Barinas than Colombia or Mexico.
"The courts have collapsed, there are backlogs for everything," said Pedro Pablo González, a lawyer and political activist. "There are not enough investigators, prosecutors or police, it's a mess." He recently led a 19-day 500km protest walk to the capital, Caracas.

Many local "chavistas" have defected to the opposition. "Really, it became too much," said Lorenzo Saturno, a legislator who quit the ruling party. "Corruption is out of control and the Chávez family has total impunity." Loyalists say that is a smear which overlooks new roads, houses, schools and employment projects dotting Barinas's plains and dusty towns. Why else would voters keep the Chávez family in power, said Miguel Angel León, president of the regional legislative council. "This is a happy, dynamic state. The football stadium, for instance, is about to be finished. But a few protesters are able to manipulate the media to make Barinas look bad," he told the Guardian.

Other loyalists say the president proved his anti-corruption credentials during a banking scandal last December when he purged a senior minister, Jesse Chacón, and businessmen with ties to the government. "We are demonstrating that there are no untouchables here," Chávez said at the time. Sceptics said the shakeup owed more to a feud between rival ruling factions than a crackdown on sleaze. And that the fate of whistleblowers showed there were indeed untouchables.
Luis Tascón, an ultra-chavista legislator, was expelled from the ruling party and called a traitor after accusing senior officials of corruption.

Azuaje (left), the Barinas firebrand, has had a torrid time since delivering to the national assembly a package of pictures, deeds and documents which he said proved the Chávez family amassed an illicit $20m fortune. The government-controlled assembly dismissed the claims after a brief inquiry. The 33-year-old legislator said he then reaped a whirlwind: shots fired at his home; a brother killed; his mother and wife fired from state jobs. The latest alleged reprisal: a criminal charge that he abused and struck a policewoman. The national assembly recently lifted Azuaje's immunity as a lawmaker, an unusual step, after which he was handcuffed and briefly detained. The supreme court also barred him from publicly discussing the charges. It is unclear if he will be able to run in September's election. "This is about revenge, clear as day. Chávez has not forgiven me for accusing his family," he said.

Amnesty International said the government was using the judiciary to persecute Azuaje and other opponents. "Charges brought for political reasons against critics are being used to silence dissent and prevent others from speaking out," the watchdog claimed last week.

Chávez supporters claimed that was unfair. People suspected of crime were being brought to book, as simple as that, wrote Eva Golinger, editor of the state-backed newspaper Correo del Orinoco International. "Ideology is not an exemption from criminality. After a lengthy period of impunity in Venezuela, the judicial system is finally beginning to risk imposing the law, at whatever cost."

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010/apr/18/hugo-chavez-revolution-corruption-claims
 
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After the thoughts of the colonialist UK rag provided by Aoxomoxa .. that followed the truth posted by me .. here's something else to digest ..

UK politicians pay tribute to Venezuela's Hugo Chavez
The UK foreign secretary has paid tribute to Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez, who he said left a "lasting impression" on his country.

Chavez was a man "ready to battle any and all in order to redistribute wealth and to stand with the oppressed and against the oppressors," he told BBC Radio 5 live.

Sinn Fein's Gerry Adams also remembered Mr Chavez, who he said had worked tirelessly to improve the lives of Venezuelan citizens.

"He dedicated himself to building a new and radical society in Venezuela," he said.

"His progressive social and economic changes took millions out of poverty. He extended free health care and education for all citizens and his re-election last year with a huge majority was testimony to his vision."

---

Mr Livingstone told the BBC that Mr Chavez "saw himself as part of an international movement to change the way things are" and had rebuffed US attempts to interfere in his country and the wider region.

"The simple fact is the reason the US hated Chavez was that for the first time you had a Latin American leader who puts the interests of the people of Venezuela ahead of America, particularly when he increased the tax on the oil companies," he told BBC Radio 4's Today programme.

---

"President Chavez was passionate about his country and his passing will be widely felt in Venezuela. We will continue to work with the Venezuelan government to build our co-operation in areas of mutual interest."
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-21679683

It only takes half a brain to rexognize that Chavez was loved by his people because he loved them, and it was evident in his policies .. which is why he ws constantly re-elected in spite of US interference.
 
Personally speaking as a socialist .. I don't get twisted about ignorance. Your thread is the arrogance of ignorance .. and you don't have the slightest clue what you're talking about .. but your ignorance is not my problem to solve.

Chavez has been EXPONENTIALLY beneficial to the Venezuelan people. Not knowing the difference in the quality of life of venezuelans now compared to before Chavez is a glaring demonstration of the ignorance that I spoke of.

Before Chavez was elected in 1998 70% of Venezuelans lived in poverty, 50% were illiterate, and 50% were employed in the informal sector. Chavez started his presidency with an all out literacy campaign and Venezuela now has a 93% literacy rate.

Before Chavez the unemployment rate in Venezuela was 14.5% .. today it's 7.8%. Infant mortality was 20/1000 .. today its 13.

Extreme poverty was 24% .. today it's 8.5%

Oil exports have boomed from 14.4% to 60%.

GDP per capita has risen from $4,105 to $10,810.

And all Venezuelans have free healthcare and education.

Next time you ask why nobody is paying your thread any attention .. perhaps you should check and make sure it's not because its stupid.

So; because he was a "helpful" socialist, he deserved to have that much money?
 
Dixies right folks! Goes to show ya. If'n you grows up to be a socialist, ya'll get cancer and die!


The United States gave him the cancer, don't ya pay attention to what your pals are claiming ?
And you'll only die if you go to Cuba for treatment.
 
The United States gave him the cancer, don't ya pay attention to what your pals are claiming ?
And you'll only die if you go to Cuba for treatment.

Yeah cause in America people don't die from cancer.

Bravo I sure hope they have got a home health aide helping you out.
 
After the thoughts of the colonialist UK rag provided by Aoxomoxa .. that followed the truth posted by me .. here's something else to digest ..

UK politicians pay tribute to Venezuela's Hugo Chavez
The UK foreign secretary has paid tribute to Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez, who he said left a "lasting impression" on his country.

Chavez was a man "ready to battle any and all in order to redistribute wealth and to stand with the oppressed and against the oppressors," he told BBC Radio 5 live.

Sinn Fein's Gerry Adams also remembered Mr Chavez, who he said had worked tirelessly to improve the lives of Venezuelan citizens.

"He dedicated himself to building a new and radical society in Venezuela," he said.

"His progressive social and economic changes took millions out of poverty. He extended free health care and education for all citizens and his re-election last year with a huge majority was testimony to his vision."

---

Mr Livingstone told the BBC that Mr Chavez "saw himself as part of an international movement to change the way things are" and had rebuffed US attempts to interfere in his country and the wider region.

"The simple fact is the reason the US hated Chavez was that for the first time you had a Latin American leader who puts the interests of the people of Venezuela ahead of America, particularly when he increased the tax on the oil companies," he told BBC Radio 4's Today programme.

---

"President Chavez was passionate about his country and his passing will be widely felt in Venezuela. We will continue to work with the Venezuelan government to build our co-operation in areas of mutual interest."
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-21679683

It only takes half a brain to rexognize that Chavez was loved by his people because he loved them, and it was evident in his policies .. which is why he ws constantly re-elected in spite of US interference.

You certainly wouldn't expect western politicians to publicly piss on his grave now that hes dead would you ?.....but deep down, you know we're all glad
to see the bastard is finally where he belongs...
 
After the thoughts of the colonialist UK rag provided by Aoxomoxa .. that followed the truth posted by me .. here's something else to digest ..

UK politicians pay tribute to Venezuela's Hugo Chavez
The UK foreign secretary has paid tribute to Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez, who he said left a "lasting impression" on his country.

Chavez was a man "ready to battle any and all in order to redistribute wealth and to stand with the oppressed and against the oppressors," he told BBC Radio 5 live.

Sinn Fein's Gerry Adams also remembered Mr Chavez, who he said had worked tirelessly to improve the lives of Venezuelan citizens.

"He dedicated himself to building a new and radical society in Venezuela," he said.

"His progressive social and economic changes took millions out of poverty. He extended free health care and education for all citizens and his re-election last year with a huge majority was testimony to his vision."

---

Mr Livingstone told the BBC that Mr Chavez "saw himself as part of an international movement to change the way things are" and had rebuffed US attempts to interfere in his country and the wider region.

"The simple fact is the reason the US hated Chavez was that for the first time you had a Latin American leader who puts the interests of the people of Venezuela ahead of America, particularly when he increased the tax on the oil companies," he told BBC Radio 4's Today programme.

---

"President Chavez was passionate about his country and his passing will be widely felt in Venezuela. We will continue to work with the Venezuelan government to build our co-operation in areas of mutual interest."
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-21679683

It only takes half a brain to rexognize that Chavez was loved by his people because he loved them, and it was evident in his policies .. which is why he ws constantly re-elected in spite of US interference.

The Guardian is a UK colonialist rag!! Are you serious?? It has impeccable left wing credentials known to most apart from BAC.

As for Ken Livingstone, the best thing Londoners have done in recent times is to vote that odious turd out of the Mayor's office.

Lastly Gerry Adams, you have to be really desperate to use his endorsement for anything.
 
You certainly wouldn't expect western politicians to publicly piss on his grave now that hes dead would you ?.....but deep down, you know we're all glad
to see the bastard is finally where he belongs...

Yes, I would expect western politicians to piss on his grave. Should I post a few?

NEWSFLASH: We will all end up dead .. where we finally belong.

The good news is that it doesn't matter what people who don't know what they're talking about think of Chavez. Not one twit.
 
The Guardian is a UK colonialist rag!! Are you serious?? It has impeccable left wing credentials known to most apart from BAC.

As for Ken Livingstone, the best thing Londoners have done in recent times is to vote that odious turd out of the Mayor's office.

Lastly Gerry Adams, you have to be really desperate to use his endorsement for anything.

How utterly, utterly ignorant.

The GUARDIAN - Iraq: the case for decisive action
Military intervention in the Middle East holds many dangers. But if we want a lasting peace it may be the only option

War with Iraq may yet not come, but, conscious of the potentially terrifying responsibility resting with the British Government, we find ourselves supporting the current commitment to a possible use of force.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/news/2003/jan/19/leaders.politics

"impeccable left wing credentials" my ass.
 
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