If Foley Were A Democrat....

[Care4all]

Why do you put the caviat at 2-3 years? If a Democrat OR Republican, knew that Foley had engaged in this behavior, it is their responsibility to inform the authorities immediately, there is not a 2-3 year window on this, or a 2-3 month window. If someone knew what was going on, and deliberately held the information so as to effect a national election, that is a serious matter as well. You wouldn't accept me telling you, I would support Hastert's removal, only if he knew about it for more than 6 months, but not less. We have quite a bit to investigate here, and I fully support prosecution for those involved in this, whether they are Republicans or Democrats, and whether they withheld information about a crime for 2 months or 2 years.

Pelosi and Emmanuel have declined a polygraph, so that tells me, they knew about this. The whole thing is beginning to stink like 3 day old tuna, and what's ironic, is if it comes out that democrats played dirty tricks here, they stand to lose more votes than the scandal gained them.

REPUBLICANS in leadership positions have known about Foley's inappropriate behavior for 2-5 years, is what is being said....nothing at all about any democratic leadership knowing this....nothing.

so far, it looks like self destruction by the republicans pointing fingers at eachother....

care

 

[Jarod]

Prissy, I think you need to quit trying to govern by polls. Any poll results posted today, were taken before the details of this affair were widely known, and are subject to change dramatically over the course of the next few weeks.

Cypress governs? What are you not telling us Cypress, are you an elected official?

 

[Jarod]

If the Republicans loose 20 - 50 seats it will be HUGE!

 

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

REPUBLICANS in leadership positions have known about Foley's inappropriate behavior for 2-5 years, is what is being said....nothing at all about any democratic leadership knowing this....nothing.

so far, it looks like self destruction by the republicans pointing fingers at eachother....

care

The Republicans knew he had sent emails to pages, asking for pictures, and how their summer was going, nothing they could have unseated an elected representative on. What's being said, is political spin by the masters of smear, and you are gulping it down as fast as it comes out. The IM revelations just came out recently, and as soon as they did, he resigned and an investigation was called for. How long did Democrat operatives know of these salacious IM's, and not tell anyone? That's the question I want an answer to.

As Prissy points out, the prime time to have released this, would have been before the 2004 Elections, so apparently, no Democrat knew of this 2-3 years ago, which is why you are willing to hang anyone who did... you understand it would be ignorant for them to have known this during the 2004 Elections and not revealed it. I don't care if they knew about it for 2 weeks! If someone had this information, and intentionally withheld it for political gain, that is unethical as it gets, and that action allowed the predator to remain at large, threatening the children you so dramatically defend.

To me, the biggest issue is the election ethics. Because some Democrat strategist wanted to score a cheap political victory here, the people of Mark Foley's district will not have a fair opportunity to elect a legitimate representative. You've essentially disenfranchised these people through no fault of their own, by intentionally waiting until after their primary, and the deadline to put another name on the ballot.

So, Democrats have not only put our children at risk of a predator, and not only withheld information regarding a felony, but they also managed to disenfranchise an entire house district in Congress. And you have the nerve to dare mention "ethics" here?

 

[Care4all]

The Republicans knew he had sent emails to pages, asking for pictures, and how their summer was going, nothing they could have unseated an elected representative on. What's being said, is political spin by the masters of smear, and you are gulping it down as fast as it comes out. The IM revelations just came out recently, and as soon as they did, he resigned and an investigation was called for. How long did Democrat operatives know of these salacious IM's, and not tell anyone? That's the question I want an answer to.

As Prissy points out, the prime time to have released this, would have been before the 2004 Elections, so apparently, no Democrat knew of this 2-3 years ago, which is why you are willing to hang anyone who did... you understand it would be ignorant for them to have known this during the 2004 Elections and not revealed it. I don't care if they knew about it for 2 weeks! If someone had this information, and intentionally withheld it for political gain, that is unethical as it gets, and that action allowed the predator to remain at large, threatening the children you so dramatically defend.

To me, the biggest issue is the election ethics. Because some Democrat strategist wanted to score a cheap political victory here, the people of Mark Foley's district will not have a fair opportunity to elect a legitimate representative. You've essentially disenfranchised these people through no fault of their own, by intentionally waiting until after their primary, and the deadline to put another name on the ballot.

So, Democrats have not only put our children at risk of a predator, and not only withheld information regarding a felony, but they also managed to disenfranchise an entire house district in Congress. And you have the nerve to dare mention "ethics" here?

here is what you are missing...the non political CITIZENS watch group that got copies of the emails of TWO SEPARATE 16 year old pages that Foley was communicating with was in LAST JULY...They immediately turned them over to the FBI...this was in July, which is hardly an october surprise planned by democrats using this group. They got these emails from a republican white house aid, that was tired of it being covered up...imo....on the tired part...but the republican aid is fact and who they are saying is the original source of the emails, not just one email and not just one kid involved...is what is being said, and I even heard this from Kate O;brian, hardly a liberal...

we need to sit back to see what falls...

as someone on tv said earlier, who needs reality tv, when you've got this?

 

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

here is what you are missing...the non political CITIZENS watch group that got copies of the emails of TWO SEPARATE 16 year old pages that Foley was communicating with was in LAST JULY...They immediately turned them over to the FBI...

Here is what YOU are missing... the so-called "non political" group you are talking about, is funded by George Soros. They are essentially a liberal witch hunt group, designed to dig up dirt on Republicans. The emails they claimed they turned over, (if there were any), did not contain sexually explicit language, like the IM's, which were revealed last Friday for the first time.

I will also point out, for the second time in two posts, you have indicated things like "someone said..." and "what is being said..." as your basis for belief. You are simply going on hearsay, rumor, speculation, and not the tangible facts in the matter. Democrats are always lecturing Republicans about the "rush to judgement" in these matters, and I think it's important to remember that, so that you don't appear to be hypocritical here.

I've already forgone my usual rants about "innocent until proven guilty in a court of law" arguments, which could be applied to Foley, since he hasn't been formally charged with anything, that I am aware of. I've already presumed the man guilty through his resignation and confession/appology. I certainly don't want to go beyond that, to condemn Republican leadership for something I can't prove they knew about, and honestly, I can't see them knowing about and not dealing with.

I think what Foley was doing, is unacceptable behavior, and I am consistent on this, whether it's a Republican or Democrat. I want him to pay a heavy price, and again, I am consistent. And I want those who withheld this information from authorities to be held responsible as well. If Hastert knew that Foley was doing this sort of thing, and did nothing, I want him gone. If Nancy Pelosi knew he was doing this stuff, and agreed to keep her mouth shut for the fireworks show, I want her gone too! Anyone who knew Mark Foley was a pedophile, and was engaging in illegal acts with minors, I want them to pay a price for not bringing the information forward in time to insure fairness to the people of Foley's district.

Beyond that, I would a support the full email and IM investigation of every member of Congress. Let's just shut the place down for a little while, and have look at what everyone is doing! This way, we can reveal any potential Mark Foley's out there, who haven't been outed. The way I see it, where there is one, there are more. Let's you and I demand that they reveal this data immediately, so that we can be assured we have proper representation, and this sort of thing can't happen again in the future.

Deal?

 

[Care4all]

Do you think the FBI is only going to be investigating the Republican's coverup?

I don't think so and that is not what they are commissioned to do... they are commissioned to find out who knew what, and when and to see if there were any other instances where pages are being used... if the democrats are involved they will be exposed....so, yes...I agree that everyone should be included in on this investigation and have every confidence that all will be exposed...that is...unless the republicans have an "in" with the fbi and justice dept and gonzalez , which prevents the truth coming out and a coverup occurs on the original coverup..?

I find it hard to believe that Dennis Hastert did not know anything about this and the EMAILS ALONE should have set off red flags with him and with his staffers handling this, ESPECIALLY since complaints about Foley had come in on him a few times over the past few years regarding his inappropriate behavior with pages...

Maybe it is possible that his staff kept it from him.... I will give him the benefit of the doubt until it is a fact, one way or the other...

I don't know why all those other republicans are turning on Hastert and outing him the way they did....that is pretty rotten, if it was not true...
----------------------------------------------------------
Have you ever seen the movie Liar, Liar with Jim Carry?

When he kept splurting out the truth and he could not understand what was happening to himself?

So he asks himself, why is this happening to me?

And he blurts out the truth as an answer... with no control over his response to himself and said with shock the truth...which was this:

"I'm reaping what I sow.........

I'm getting what I deserve..."

a real funny movie... I brought it up because I was thinking about why this was happening all of a sudden to all of these unorganized, off message, Republicans and I thought about reaping what you sow, which made me think of this movie...

care

 

[uscitizen]

I agree Care if demoncrats are doing anything illegal or unethical they should hang as well. I am non partisan when it comes to getting slime out of our government.
And as far as Hastert goes, he could be innocent, but I sure am enjoying the show

 

[TRGLDTE]

Can you say "Speaker Pelosi" four times really fast?

No, but I can say it three times really fast - Beetlejuice! Beetlejuice! Beetlejuice!

 

[TRGLDTE]

His small district kept him in office becasue he did not break the law, I guess??? but the DEMOCRATS Nationwide DID NOT KEEP him in office.

That's wrong, Dix. Studds retained his committee chairmanship even afterward. In fact, he was there for ten more years and Pelosi voted fives in the affirmative to re-elect Studds to his committee chair.

 

[TRGLDTE]

or better yet, just kill 'em....
fuck it...torture 'em first

that seems to be the American way these days

I agree - I hate pedophiles with a deep, dark level of hatred and desire to commit true violence that I feel for no other creatures on earth. Pedophiles should have their skin sanded with a belt sander and 80 grit paper until they are good and raw. Then a dunking in kerosene. Light them on fire for about ten seconds and put them out. Let the bastard suffer with 50% 3rd degree burns, not too much or they'll die, and we don't want that yet - I understand it is excruciatingly painful to suffer major burns.

That's just Step One - I haven't even delved into what I could do with a Valentine's irrigator.

 

[TRGLDTE]

Why do you put the caveat at 2-3 years?

The FIRST allegations against Studds were made in 1973.

 

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

His small district kept him in office becasue he did not break the law, I guess??? but the DEMOCRATS Nationwide DID NOT KEEP him in office.

That's wrong, Dix. Studds retained his committee chairmanship even afterward. In fact, he was there for ten more years and Pelosi voted fives in the affirmative to re-elect Studds to his committee chair.

This statement was posted by Care, I was quoting her. I am well-aware Studs remained in the party and was re-elected for years after this incident. That was kinda my whole point.

 

[Care4all]

The FIRST allegations against Studds were made in 1973.

When you were a child and got caught by your parents doing something wrong, did you always shout, that your sibbling had done it tooooooo?

The Republicans are acting as though they are first graders....amazing how low you will go to try to EXCUSE this predatory behavior of Foley's ...

by trying to equate it with Representative's Studd's indescretion and inappropriate and shameful actions with a 17 year old boy that turned out to be his lover, and who was standing by Rep. Studds side in 1983 at the podeum of his press conference after the Censure, 10 years later, at 28 years old....(He has said he never felt what he did with the congressman as wrong, but consentual adults in a relationship)

Studs was stripped of his committee leadership by Tip O'neal, and Censured.

He never had another incident...he did not repeatedly prey upon young minor boys.... And became one of the nost effective congressman that Massachusetts had ever had....loved by his district and reelected over and over again, from what the articles say...and that he retired in 1996.

He got married to his long time Lover in 2005 in Massachusetts.

The reason that the affair Studds had with this 17 year old page in 1983, 10 years after his actual inappropriate behavior, is because A Republican Congressman had been caught with his "one eyed trouser worm" in a 17 year old page girls panties" and republicans needed to make it look better for the Republican just caught, so they brought up the studds issue from 10 years previous.

Republican Representative Crane who had the Affair with the 17 year old Page girl, (who...btw, later said that she was the seducer of him in her opinion), was supposedly happily married with 6 children....he refused to resign from his position also, and he also ran for reelection after the affair, but was not reelected because unlike Studds who was single, Crane committed Adultery and broke the law by doing such and trust of his constituants by Cheating on his wife.

here's the kicker...from one article that i had read...

The prospects are less clear for Crane, the brother of Illinois Representative Philip Crane, who sought the 1980 G.O.P. presidential nomination. "This does not fit the image Dan Crane has tried to portray," says Danville Lawyer Tom Lindley. "This makes it less likely he'll run for re-election." On Saturday, Crane said he would not resign. His press secretary, William Mencarow, suggested the entire matter was no big deal. "If we required the resignation of all Congressmen who slept with young ladies," he said, "we wouldn't have a Congress." He later apologized for the observation.


Go ahead and bring up things from the past like Rep. Studds, but don't leave out the Republican Censured right by his side or the facts that followed for the years afterwards that lead people to support Studds for chairmanship again of a Marine life committee etc....

care

 

[Damocles]

Pointing out hypocrisy while supporting the punishment of another is not saying, "But so-and-so did it tooooooo!"

This is a common strawman presented by those whose hypocrisy is being exposed. "The you do it too defense!"

Well, it isn't being used... Everybody agrees, Foley did a bad thing and he has resigned and will be punished for any further wrongdoing. Now let's see what the other side does... attempts to pretend that it never happened on thier side? Yes. Get upset when those that it did happen to are shown to have been applauded, re-elected, and given LEADERSHIP positions among them? Yes.

 

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

When you were a child and got caught by your parents doing something wrong, did you always shout, that your sibbling had done it tooooooo?

The Republicans are acting as though they are first graders....amazing how low you will go to try to EXCUSE this predatory behavior of Foley's ..

Excuse me, but isn't that precisely what you were doing when you posted the extensive list of republicans to counter Danos list? I believe it is!

No one has tried to point to Democrats to excuse Foley, I know that's what you want to think, because that is how Democrats will react, but honestly, that's not why we have pointed out Studs and Reynolds at all. It has more to do with the handling of these individuals after the fact, by the party leaders. Democrats can have pedophiles actually engaging in sex with kids, and they get standing ovations and re-elected numerous times... Republicans have a pedophile sending emails, and not only is he forced to resign, but you try to take out the Speaker as well! It's a double standard, that was the purpose in pointing it out, not to excuse anyone!

 

[Care4all]

When you were a child and got caught by your parents doing something wrong, did you always shout, that your sibbling had done it tooooooo?

The Republicans are acting as though they are first graders....amazing how low you will go to try to EXCUSE this predatory behavior of Foley's ..

Excuse me, but isn't that precisely what you were doing when you posted the extensive list of republicans to counter Danos list? I believe it is!

No one has tried to point to Democrats to excuse Foley, I know that's what you want to think, because that is how Democrats will react, but honestly, that's not why we have pointed out Studs and Reynolds at all. It has more to do with the handling of these individuals after the fact, by the party leaders. Democrats can have pedophiles actually engaging in sex with kids, and they get standing ovations and re-elected numerous times... Republicans have a pedophile sending emails, and not only is he forced to resign, but you try to take out the Speaker as well! It's a double standard, that was the purpose in pointing it out, not to excuse anyone!

I posted the REST of the List that Dano's site's cut and pasted from...

I posted the full article's list....

Not a manipulated short cut list leaving out the facts ON BOTH SIDES of the aisle.... so that people on this board don't get this INTENTIONALLY DECEIVING list of 10 that was cut out of the ORIGINAL ARTICLE that covered ALL indescretions on Congress....

Just to CLARIFY it for YOU...

care

 

[Care4all]

Democrats can have pedophiles actually engaging in sex with kids, and they get standing ovations and re-elected numerous times

Really? Who? Name him.... If you say Studds, you are being a hypocrite....Studds did not have sex with someone under the age of 12, he was 17, of legal age but most certainly a Minor!

The same with Foley...he is not a pedofile....he preys on young men, minors and has used his power over and over and over again to befriend these boys for sexual "talk" or sexual satisfaction in the physical so we are finding out, with his offer of his apartment for a blow job....so the latest page to come out says...

 

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

Democrats can have pedophiles actually engaging in sex with kids, and they get standing ovations and re-elected numerous times

Really? Who? Name him.... If you say Studds, you are being a hypocrite....Studds did not have sex with someone under the age of 12, he was 17, of legal age but most certainly a Minor!

The same with Foley...he is not a pedofile....he preys on young men, minors and has used his power over and over and over again to befriend these boys for sexual "talk" or sexual satisfaction in the physical so we are finding out, with his offer of his apartment for a blow job....so the latest page to come out says...

Mel Reynolds. He was caught on tape, soliciting a threesome with 14-year-old Catholic school girls. But it's interesting to note, you now feel that a Congressman having sex with young men who served as pages, is not all that wrong, if they happen to be a certain age, especially if they also happen to be a Democrat. I'm glad you clarified this, because I was starting to think you actually thought Foley's actions were unacceptable, now I know it's just because he is a Republican.

 

[IHateGovernment]

All I know is that transposing the letter after the guys name from R to D would result in the same effect just different people saying it.