If You Force Opening, And Get Deaths, That's On You.

Some "extra" people need to die now so that we dont have many multiples of that dying later.....we need some intestinal fortitude combined with smarts.

Both are hard to come by now sadly.
 
Hawkeye10 said:
Some "extra" people need to die now so that we dont have many multiples of that dying later.....we need some intestinal fortitude combined with smarts. Both are hard to come by now sadly.
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We need an intelligent balance, when we have a president who hates both intelligence and balance.
 
PoliTalker said:
Hello cawacko,



I said no such thing.

This is a crisis not of our making, but our poor response made it far worse than it had to be. We were very late to take effective measures, so it hit us hard. The blame goes to the president for denials, lies, and mismanagement of the crisis. Wasting valuable life-saving time. It didn't have to be this bad. America is number one in deaths because of the selfishness of the 'stable genius.'

The only way it relates to the November 3rd election is because that is our chance to pass judgement on the president, our chance to replace him with more sane leadership from someone who will serve the nation instead of himself.

The election is boiling down to a referendum on Trump. The more deaths he causes, the less support he will have. Few actually like him, even if they have supported him in the past. Needlessly high death tolls will make it hard for those who don't like him to say they like what he is doing.

A truly political anti-DT position would be pushing to open up instantly, fully expecting to increase deaths and thus dissent for DT. But that would be irresponsible, so that is not my position.

It is ironic that the armed protestors are pushing for the one thing which will hurt his reelection chances. Early reopening and a deadly second wave will turn voters away from him.

They think the economy will bounce right back but that is just not in the cards.

Unemployment will stay high even after reopening. 32% of those out of work say they do not expect to be rehired by their old employer.
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That's because those "32%" are getting an extra $600 a week unemployment ON TOP OF their regular unemployment check and don't want to go back to work.

Face the facts, you were desperately hoping for the stock markets and economy to come crashing down only because you hate Trump so badly, you don't give
a damn how many people die as long as Trump won't get reelected. Pathetic America hating communist degenerate you are...
 
Hello cawacko,

cawacko said:
Why are we allowing anyone to leave their homes period? Clearly you are ok with people dying if that's acceptable to you.
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I do not know why you would say such a thing. I am not OK with people dying and it is not acceptable to me. I have been very adamant about that. Stable genius fans appear to be the ones who are OK with that, and it's very troubling to me.

cawacko said:
Yes people need food but that puts them and the workers at risk. So what is more important?

Vote accordingly.
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Safety is more important than profits.
 
Walt said:
There is a balancing act. There are some things that are essential, that if we do not do, there will be more deaths. And there are other things that are just spreading disease for no good reason. Even the best leaders would get the mix wrong, but hopefully we could all work on it.

When I come on here, I lose hope. I see Alt Righters screaming that it is "essential" that they go out for cocktails, and that they will kill someone if they do not get what they want. They feel they will never get sick, and really don't care if they kill others.

You may think the cocktails part is just me exaggerating, no that is what the Alt Right is really demanding as essential:
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You spend a lot more time worrying about the alt-right than I do. So I'm not familiar with the alt-right saying they need to go get a cocktail.

What I am familiar with are many people getting upset at the continued lock down. As with everything there is nuance. These folks aren't saying open up the country as if everything is back to pre-covid. That isn't happening. But certain restrictions can definitely be lifted and if people practice social distancing they should have the right to make their own choices about certain activities.
 
cawacko said:
I'd have far more respect if you were honest like PoliTalker and just acknowledge this is all political and about the next election. Otherwise you are full of sh*t if you think we need a national stay at home lock down for everything until there is a vaccine.
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It absolutely is, but probably not in the way that you think. The Covidiot Crusaders are agitating to open up everything because they want them some beer n cheeseburgers n manicures, too. But foremost they are desperate to get #COVID45 re-selected in November. So that's what this is *really* all about -- trying to magically repair the economy so your tangerine tyrant magically looks good again. The death toll doesn't matter. Only keeping the failed TV game show host in power counts.
 
Hello cawacko,

cawacko said:
Congrats on getting your wish. You wished for a recession and stock market crash and you got it. It's why you frame everything here in terms of Trump. Just spare us the faux concern about deaths.
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My wish is that we are rid of the stable genius who is a terrible leader. Since his extremist supporters will not listen to reason, it appears the only thing which will cause enough of them to lose faith in him is the economy tanking. If that is the only way we can be rid of him then I am willing to accept that, even though I would prefer there be another way to correct the terrible wrong which has been done to the nation.
 
Hello Egg Shell,

Egg Shell said:
Those insane fools crowding into bars!
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Hey, it MIGHT be OK if nobody crowding into a bar has COVID-19.

Lives could depend on that gamble, so it is a foolish one to make.

And even if the odds are with you most of the time, sooner or later they will flip the other way.

And you wouldn't even know it at the time.

Thus, allowing bars to open at this time is incredibly foolish.

The problem is you don't find out if it is OK or not until 2 weeks later at least.

Or you may never find out.

But that doesn't mean it didn't happen.

What you don't know about can very definitely hurt you or others.
 
Hello cawacko,

cawacko said:
You spend a lot more time worrying about the alt-right than I do. So I'm not familiar with the alt-right saying they need to go get a cocktail.

What I am familiar with are many people getting upset at the continued lock down. As with everything there is nuance. These folks aren't saying open up the country as if everything is back to pre-covid.
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Yes, they are. The most flagrant extremists are saying the whole thing is a hoax, sticking to the "no worse than the flu" meme. They want everything opened up with no restrictions at all.

cawacko said:
That isn't happening. But certain restrictions can definitely be lifted and if people practice social distancing they should have the right to make their own choices about certain activities.
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It all has to be assessed on a risk/benefits basis. But in any case there can be no compromise on accepting near-certain deaths.
 
ThatOwlWoman said:
It absolutely is, but probably not in the way that you think. The Covidiot Crusaders are agitating to open up everything because they want them some beer n cheeseburgers n manicures, too. But foremost they are desperate to get #COVID45 re-selected in November. So that's what this is *really* all about -- trying to magically repair the economy so your tangerine tyrant magically looks good again. The death toll doesn't matter. Only keeping the failed TV game show host in power counts.
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Two thoughts.

I have not, nor would I ever, state or suggest its not a two way street. There are definitely people who want the economy opened up because they see it as necessary for Trump's re-election and that is the only lens they view this through. That's not even a question.

I would argue its disrespectful to argue it doesn't work both ways. People like PoliTalker admit it but many others think it. It defies logic for people who have spent every day of Trump's Presidency wishing him gone to now suggest their position here has zero to do with the 2020 election.

I find solace when I speak to others who say they are so turned off by the continued and never ending politicization of all this based on the upcoming election. There's no way to take politics out of it, but so many people have an agenda when they speak about Covid that you just tune it all out.
 
RB 60 said:
That's because those "32%" are getting an extra $600 a week unemployment ON TOP OF their regular unemployment check and don't want to go back to work.

Face the facts, you were desperately hoping for the stock markets and economy to come crashing down only because you hate Trump so badly, you don't give
a damn how many people die as long as Trump won't get reelected. Pathetic America hating communist degenerate you are...
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Rightys really believe that. People really want to work. Of course few are getting that unemployment boost. The system is nearly shut down from too many Trump damaged workers applying.
 
cawacko said:
No one, to my knowledge, is suggesting we open up bars and movie theaters. There are plenty of people, regardless of political persuasion, that believe restrictions need to be eased. But at least be honest, since you fancy yourself not rash nor stupid. PoliTalker is honest in that he's rooting for a recession and the stock market to drop based on the 2020 election. So he wants to continue whatever policies best pursue that goal. The fact that you think the entire country needs to be on total lock down says all we need to know.
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So admit you are wrong. That is exactly what Wisconsin did. the bars are open. The rightys want it all opened up. At least do some homework. The Michigan militia wants the same thing.
 
Opening up the economy is unavoidable, the best that can be done is to inform the people, and if they done heed the warning, then these people will have to except the consequences of their actions.
 
Hello cawacko,

cawacko said:
Two thoughts.

I have not, nor would I ever, state or suggest its not a two way street. There are definitely people who want the economy opened up because they see it as necessary for Trump's re-election and that is the only lens they view this through. That's not even a question.

I would argue its disrespectful to argue it doesn't work both ways. People like PoliTalker admit it but many others think it. It defies logic for people who have spent every day of Trump's Presidency wishing him gone to now suggest their position here has zero to do with the 2020 election.

I find solace when I speak to others who say they are so turned off by the continued and never ending politicization of all this based on the upcoming election. There's no way to take politics out of it, but so many people have an agenda when they speak about Covid that you just tune it all out.
Click to expand...

To ignore politics is to ignore the reality of how our nation works, and how decisions are made which affect us all.

I get the 'not wanting to dwell on it 24-7-365' view, but extrapolating that preference into never wanting to talk about politics at any time or any place represents a disservice to society, and threatens to hand ultimate power to leaders.

I view it as the responsibility of every American to become and remain as well informed as possible and to be willing to discuss the matters of our nation freely. Only through knowledge and informed conversation can our democracy function.

It would be the kiss of death to America if nobody ever talked about politics and it was a completely forbidden subject.

Everything is fair game in politics and everything can and will be politicized. We must accept this and deal with it accordingly. I love politics and have come to a place where I can discuss any topic without getting angry. I wish everyone could achieve that. When people get too emotional about it, then they cease to discuss things rationally. That seems to be the big problem with extremists. They refuse to compromise, refuse to even try to place themselves in the minds of those who hold opposing views.

I am certainly liberal, but I always try to see each subject from the conservative point of view so as to better understand the issues. Routinely, what I see in conservative views is selfishness and anti-social motivations, and what I see in liberal views is a vision of how a society can function for the good of all, while still allowing as much personal freedom as possible.
 
cawacko said:
Two thoughts.

I have not, nor would I ever, state or suggest its not a two way street. There are definitely people who want the economy opened up because they see it as necessary for Trump's re-election and that is the only lens they view this through. That's not even a question.

I would argue its disrespectful to argue it doesn't work both ways. People like PoliTalker admit it but many others think it. It defies logic for people who have spent every day of Trump's Presidency wishing him gone to now suggest their position here has zero to do with the 2020 election.

I find solace when I speak to others who say they are so turned off by the continued and never ending politicization of all this based on the upcoming election. There's no way to take politics out of it, but so many people have an agenda when they speak about Covid that you just tune it all out.
Click to expand...

Everyday people you know in real life are mostly concerned with their own health and that of their circle. They are worried about their own and others' financial situations. They worry about their communities and how they will survive. You're right -- they aren't much concerned with blame and politics.
 
Hello ThatOwlWoman,

ThatOwlWoman said:
Everyday people you know in real life are mostly concerned with their own health and that of their circle. They are worried about their own and others' financial situations. They worry about their communities and how they will survive. You're right -- they aren't much concerned with blame and politics.
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I consider the world my circle. All humans are my fellow beings. We live in societies. All of us, all societies are interconnected. We can and should think in both the immediate circle of friends / people we normally associate with AND the macroscopic scale of all humanity. It is logical that we devote some of our time to each. Most people do not think on the macroscopic scale enough. I think that hurts humanity. If we did, overpopulation and climate change would not be such big problems.

These people who want to open up simply for selfish reasons are being very unpatriotic. They are driven totally be what they want for themselves, not thinking of others.
 
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