Illegals and the economy

cawacko said:
To me, amnesty is almost a separate topic. It does not address why people want to come in the first place or what we should do going forward.

There is demand to come here and demand for labor, and the system needs to be better aligned to match those needs imo but that is easier said than done of course.
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Welfare is not labor. Criminals are not a 'need'.
cawacko said:
I agree. Between the politics and the different factions within each party, it’s almost impossible to get something everyone can accept. It’s sad, really.
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No. We cannot get along. I do not support criminal activity.
 
domer76 said:
This morning, I did a little digging on the impact of undocumented immigrants and the economy. The consensus seems to be that they are not a drag on the economy. Quite the opposite. They are a net positive on their contribution to the economy. Or at least a push. Hard to find a solid number, so the estimates vary.

So, what’s the fucking problem? Why do we want to build huge detention centers to pull these people out of the workforce?

Oh, that’s right. To the fascist cultists, undocumenteds are the “them”. The enemy. The source of all our woes.
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the utter hubris to think you can take such a complex issue and "do a little digging" and now know

JFC. you shit stains are a dumb bunch
 
domer76 said:
This morning, I did a little digging on the impact of undocumented immigrants and the economy. The consensus seems to be that they are not a drag on the economy. Quite the opposite. They are a net positive on their contribution to the economy. Or at least a push. Hard to find a solid number, so the estimates vary.

So, what’s the fucking problem? Why do we want to build huge detention centers to pull these people out of the workforce?

Oh, that’s right. To the fascist cultists, undocumenteds are the “them”. The enemy. The source of all our woes.
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Leftists are the source of this countries woes
 
domer76 said:
I can’t disagree with your assessment. I disagree with anyone who claims they are taking away jobs or lower wages.

Regarding the “nation of laws” argument, I’d argue both ways. Yes, we are. IN THEORY. In practice, it’s not how much justice there is in this country, it’s how much justice can one afford.

First time offense for illegal entry is a misdemeanor and is usually treated as a civil matter. I think I’ll let those people slide if they are contributing and keep their nose clean. This country looks the other way on white collar and corporate crime.
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There are multiple reports of entire plants with almost all exploitable illegal labor, that get paid less than half what citizens would get, with federal programs that help with the upkeep of the illegals.

Sure illegals are good for the economy, but their purpose is likely also to deliberately harm the citizens, with the long term plan to get us to submit to our enslavement.

I have recently heard it argued that these sorts of programs amount to the intentional genocide of the native populations, that this is done all through the West, and that this is a comprehensive effort by the globalist cabal to weaken nations so that the stuff we hear for instance from the WEF can be implemented.
 
Two Democrats are walking in a forest when they come across a pile of shit.

The first Democrat says to the other “I’ll pay you $100 to eat that pile of shit.”

The second Democrat takes the $100 and eats the pile of shit.

They continue walking until they come across a second pile of shit.

The second Democrat turns to the first and says “I’ll pay you $100 to eat that pile of shit.”

The first Democrat takes the $100 back and eats the pile of shit.

The first Democrat looks at the second Democrat and says, "You know, I gave you $100 to eat shit, then you gave me back the same $100 to eat shit. I can't help but feel like we both just ate shit for nothing."

"That's not true", responded the second Democrat. "We increased the GDP by $200!"
 
Poor Legion. See his recent posts? It's a cry for help.

He has no side.

Why this little site? I have no clue. Perhaps he was kicked out of bigger sites?
 
Teflon Don said:
Leftists are the source of this countries woes
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LOL

You have control over all 3 branches of government and things are falling apart all around us.

Militarization of police. ICE abuses. Political prosecution. Food prices increasing. Tariffs on a temper tantrum. SNAP halted. Retribution on blue cities.

Ignorant fucking cultist
 
Hawkeye10 said:
There are multiple reports of entire plants with almost all exploitable illegal labor, that get paid less than half what citizens would get, with federal programs that help with the upkeep of the illegals.

Sure illegals are good for the economy, but their purpose is likely also to deliberately harm the citizens, with the long term plan to get us to submit to our enslavement.

I have recently heard it argued that these sorts of programs amount to the intentional genocide of the native populations, that this is done all through the West, and that this is a comprehensive effort by the globalist cabal to weaken nations so that the stuff we hear for instance from the WEF can be implemented.
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Everything I read said the opposite of long term vs short term effects. That illegals may create a short term local problem, but their presence is a long term boon to the economy.
 
domer76 said:
The consensus seems to be that they are not a drag on the economy.
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Nope. The consensus is that illegals will work for far less than the fair market rate, driving down wages for all citizens.

Ergo, the consensus is that illegals, especially in the large, inundating numbers that Biden allowed into the country with his open borders policy, is a HUGE drag on the economy, across all sectors, across all blue-collar and unskilled demographics.

domer76 said:
They are a net positive on their contribution to the economy.
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Nope; unsupported asinine assertion discarded with extreme prejudice.

domer76 said:
So, what’s the fucking problem?
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The fucking problem is your unsupported asinine assertion.

domer76 said:
Why do we want to build huge detention centers to pull these people out of the workforce?
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To fix the economy and to make America great again. Why do you want to make America shittier? Oh, that’s right. To the fascist Democrat cultists, undocumenteds are the “future Democrat voters" who will bring more power to the DNC at the expense of We the People. Fuck you.
 
domer76 said:
They don’t have to be, but the process is so time consuming, they go another route.

Streamlining the process to bring in people, legitimate people, is the way to go. Too much inertia to accomplish that, however.
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I agree completely but I don't believe the answer in the meantime is to just allow anyone and everyone over the border. We could grant temporary work passes to legit people as you say, who want to work and have veritable addresses and sponsors.
 
Yakuda said:
We could grant temporary work passes to legit people as you say, who want to work and have veritable addresses and sponsors.
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We already do.

The United States operates several temporary worker visa programs collectively referred to as "guest worker" programs.

These allow U.S. employers to hire foreign nationals for specific jobs when domestic workers are insufficient, with workers required to depart upon program completion.

The programs fall into two broad categories: agricultural (seasonal farm work) and non-agricultural (other seasonal or temporary needs). All are administered by the Department of Labor (DOL), U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services (USCIS), and the Department of State.

The flagship agricultural program is the H-2A visa. Employers—typically farms, orchards, or nurseries—must first obtain a labor certification from the DOL proving they tried and failed to recruit U.S. workers at the prevailing wage. They must provide housing (free or at low cost), transportation to and from the worker's home country, meals or cooking facilities, and pay at least the Adverse Effect Wage Rate (AEWR), a state-specific minimum set annually to avoid depressing local wages.

There is no numerical cap on H-2A visas; issuance has grown from about 50,000 certifications in fiscal year 2010 to over 370,000 in fiscal year 2024.

Workers are tied to the petitioning employer and typically stay 3–10 months.

The main non-agricultural program is the H-2B visa, covering jobs in landscaping, hospitality, seafood processing, forestry, carnivals, and resort staffing. Like H-2A, employers need DOL labor certification showing unsuccessful U.S. recruitment, but they are not required to provide housing or meals (though they must pay for inbound/outbound travel after certain conditions). The cap is 66,000 visas per fiscal year, split into 33,000 for the winter season (October–March) and 33,000 for summer (April–September).

Congress occasionally authorizes temporary cap relief; for example, the FY 2024 cap was effectively raised to about 130,000 through supplemental visas. Stays are usually up to 10 months, extendable in one-year increments to a maximum of three years, after which workers must leave for three months before reapplying.

Smaller related programs include the H-1B for specialty occupations requiring a bachelor's degree (capped at 85,000 annually, not typically considered "guest worker"), and niche categories like the H-3 for trainees or the seasonal D-1 for crewmen. Pacific Island nations (Palau, Micronesia, Marshall Islands) have a separate compact allowing unrestricted work under different rules.

To participate, an employer files a Temporary Labor Certification application with DOL, then an I-129 petition with USCIS once approved. Workers apply for visas at U.S. consulates abroad. Violations—such as wage theft, unsafe housing, or blacklisting whistleblowers—can lead to debarment from future hiring.

Predictably, "advocacy groups" on the left argue these programs create "exploitable tied labor"; businesses say they fill genuine shortages without displacing Americans.
 
domer76 said:
LOL

You have control over all 3 branches of government and things are falling apart all around us.

Militarization of police. ICE abuses. Political prosecution. Food prices increasing. Tariffs on a temper tantrum. SNAP halted. Retribution on blue cities.

Ignorant fucking cultist
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you live in a bubble as if your party has never been in charge for the last 60 years and implemented policy that we still live with. Are you that ignorant?
 
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