Marry girls when they're '15 or 16,' said 'Duck Dynasty' star Phil Robertson???

Here, read this link, get back to me dude. The reality is, that marriage was not okay according to the custom at the time, nor is there even close to an argument that today it would be okay.

Today, people often get married at 16, that is still a normal, if IMO despicable, custom.

There was never a time that I know of that marrying 6 year old girls was ever okay, especially with silence as "consent".

"Dude" answeringislam.com is an anti-Islam website created by those who wish to make Islam to be heretical. It even states that Allah is a "moon god" which in Islam there is definite denial. Islam, like Judaism is a Semitic faith with a Semitic deity Allah One God, lord of all that exists. It's a hack website bro. Why would I give credence to such a site?
 
"Dude" answeringislam.com is an anti-Islam website created by those who wish to make Islam to be heretical. It even states that Allah is a "moon god" which in Islam there is definite denial. Islam, like Judaism is a Semitic faith with a Semitic deity Allah One God, lord of all that exists. It's a hack website bro. Why would I give credence to such a site?
Provide a site with a different interpretation. The reality is he proposed to a six year old. Even the more positive sites on Islam do not dispute this.
 
It is a better source than "No he didn't".

The reality is even the more positive sites say he married her before menses, some of them claim the first sex was at 13 after menses. None of them claim that he didn't ask a six year old to marry him, nor do they say she answered. Her silence was "consent".

Child marriages may have been "common" then (not really, they were pretty rare), but sexual activity before menses was not.

I cannot believe we are arguing this.

The point I'm making is the hypocrisy. I know that Muslims disagree with each other on authentic and authentic hadith which many anti-Muslims try to interpret. The point is encouraging people to marry young at least in today's age is against social norms which is why many people both liberal and non-liberal alike do not agree with unlike Robertson. Marrying a teenager regardless whether she started her menstrual cycle is not the point. The point is, what man allows his teenage daughter who has not even experienced life to marry someone older even a man at 18 years of age? This is called division of cultural norms. I'm sure at least 70% of Americans do not share the same cultural norms as Robertson.
 
I cannot believe we are arguing this.

The point I'm making is the hypocrisy. I know that Muslims disagree with each other on authentic and authentic hadith which many anti-Muslims try to interpret. The point is encouraging people to marry young at least in today's age is against social norms which is why many people both liberal and non-liberal alike do not agree with unlike Robertson. Marrying a teenager regardless whether she started her menstrual cycle is not the point. The point is, what man allows his teenage daughter who has not even experienced life to marry someone older even a man at 18 years of age? This is called division of cultural norms. I'm sure at least 70% of Americans do not share the same cultural norms as Robertson.

As I said, neither do I. However, because I disagree with Robertson and find it divergent does not mean I'll be contacting A&E to require them to suspend him. You are willing to bet 70% agree with me? Then why does the law allow for marriage at 16, even in liberal strongholds like CA?

You were the one that brought up Muhammad as some sort of thing I shouldn't speak against. I wouldn't have brought him into this conversation.

You also brought up Mary as if I would care. Do you assume I have some form of religious attachment to Mary? And 14 was certainly a normal age for marriage back then. The lifespan was frickin' 40 or so.
 
It is a better source than "No he didn't".

The reality is even the more positive sites say he married her before menses, some of them claim the first sex was at 13 after menses. None of them claim that he didn't ask a six year old to marry him, nor do they say she answered.

Child marriages may have been common then, but sexual activity before menses was not.

I wouldn't go to an anti-Islam site and expect facts. Their purpose is to convert Muslims to Christianity.

“A great misconception prevails as to the age at which Aisha was taken in marriage by the Prophet. Ibn Sa‘d has stated in the Tabaqat that when Abu Bakr [father of Aisha] was approached on behalf of the Holy Prophet, he replied that the girl had already been betrothed to Jubair, and that he would have to settle the matter first with him. This shows that Aisha must have been approaching majority at the time. Again, the Isaba, speaking of the Prophet’s daughter Fatima, says that she was born five years before the Call and was about five years older than Aisha. This shows that Aisha must have been about ten years at the time of her betrothal to the Prophet, and not six years as she is generally supposed to be. This is further borne out by the fact that Aisha herself is reported to have stated that when the chapter [of the Holy Quran] entitled The Moon, the fifty-fourth chapter, was revealed, she was a girl playing about and remembered certain verses then revealed. Now the fifty-fourth chapter was undoubtedly revealed before the sixth year of the Call. All these considerations point to but one conclusion, viz., that Aisha could not have been less than ten years of age at the time of her nikah, which was virtually only a betrothal. And there is one report in the Tabaqat that Aisha was nine years of age at the time of nikah. Again it is a fact admitted on all hands that the nikah of Aisha took place in the tenth year of the Call in the month of Shawwal, while there is also preponderance of evidence as to the consummation of her marriage taking place in the second year of Hijra in the same month, which shows that full five years had elapsed between the nikah and the consummation. Hence there is not the least doubt that Aisha was at least nine or ten years of age at the time of betrothal, and fourteen or fifteen years at the time of marriage.” [4] (Bolding is mine.)

http://www.muslim.org/islam/aisha-age.htm
 
Provide a site with a different interpretation. The reality is he proposed to a six year old. Even the more positive sites on Islam do not dispute this.

I just did see:

Women reach puberty at different ages ranging from 8-12 years old depending on genetics, race and environment. We read that
There is little difference in the size of boys and girls until the age of ten, the growth spurt at puberty starts earlier in girls but lasts longer in boys."

Source:http://www.nbcnews.com/id/38600414/n.../#.UsX5_9K-rIc

If you're looking for Islamic sources see the following:

Sahih Bukhari Volume 5, Book 58, Number 236:

Narrated Hisham's father:

"Khadija died three years before the Prophet departed to Medina. He stayed there for two years or so and then he married 'Aisha when she was a girl of six years of age, and he consumed that marriage when she was nine years old."


Sahih Muslim Book 008, Number 3310:

"'A'isha (Allah be pleased with her) reported: Allah's Apostle (may peace be upon him) married me when I was six years old, and I was admitted to his house when I was nine years old."



"Now some may object to this by saying how could the Prophet marry Aisha at such a young age. One must first understand that 1400 years ago was very different than now, times have changed and so have humans. 1400 years ago it was something very common to marry young girls, in fact they were not considered young girls, rather they were considered young women back then. It is a historic fact that girls from the ages of 9 to 14 were being married in Europe, Asia, and Africa, in fact even in the United States girls at the age of 10 were also being married just more than a century ago."


See:http://muslim-responses.com/Marriage_with_Aisha/Marriage_with_Aisha_

If Muhammad was a pervert he wouldn't have been with a would way older than him until she died.......
 
It's statutory rape plain and simple here in California. The state defines "adulthood" at 18. Grant it, I may disagree with the idea of adulthood especially since 18 year-old people can't buy alcohol but here the law is the law. This is not the middle ages where people die young. People are living well in their 70's and 80's so marrying young is not necessary.

I wasn't aware that he was married per California law!!
 
I wouldn't go to an anti-Islam site and expect facts. Their purpose is to convert Muslims to Christianity.

“A great misconception prevails as to the age at which Aisha was taken in marriage by the Prophet. Ibn Sa‘d has stated in the Tabaqat that when Abu Bakr [father of Aisha] was approached on behalf of the Holy Prophet, he replied that the girl had already been betrothed to Jubair, and that he would have to settle the matter first with him. This shows that Aisha must have been approaching majority at the time. Again, the Isaba, speaking of the Prophet’s daughter Fatima, says that she was born five years before the Call and was about five years older than Aisha. This shows that Aisha must have been about ten years at the time of her betrothal to the Prophet, and not six years as she is generally supposed to be. This is further borne out by the fact that Aisha herself is reported to have stated that when the chapter [of the Holy Quran] entitled The Moon, the fifty-fourth chapter, was revealed, she was a girl playing about and remembered certain verses then revealed. Now the fifty-fourth chapter was undoubtedly revealed before the sixth year of the Call. All these considerations point to but one conclusion, viz., that Aisha could not have been less than ten years of age at the time of her nikah, which was virtually only a betrothal. And there is one report in the Tabaqat that Aisha was nine years of age at the time of nikah. Again it is a fact admitted on all hands that the nikah of Aisha took place in the tenth year of the Call in the month of Shawwal, while there is also preponderance of evidence as to the consummation of her marriage taking place in the second year of Hijra in the same month, which shows that full five years had elapsed between the nikah and the consummation. Hence there is not the least doubt that Aisha was at least nine or ten years of age at the time of betrothal, and fourteen or fifteen years at the time of marriage.” [4] (Bolding is mine.)

http://www.muslim.org/islam/aisha-age.htm

There is actually quite divergent ideation between the Muslims who believe this and those who believe younger, Sun Devil recognized that and I give him kudos for it.

I don't bring up wholly pro-Islam sites because their purpose is to try to make Muhammad look better and convert people. If I am speaking against Christianity I'll bring up an anti-Christian site because Christian sites will always seek to make their religion look better than it is...

Anyway, he brought up Muhammad and the "virgin" Mary. He was striking at the wrong anvil there too. Neither of these religions hold much for me. I respect their followers, but I am not of these people.
 
LOL, I noticed you only provided your evidence after I pointed out your fallacious behavior.


Was that a frantic we search, or what?

I was concerned with accuracy, not one-upmanship.

images
 
I just did see:

Women reach puberty at different ages ranging from 8-12 years old depending on genetics, race and environment. We read that
There is little difference in the size of boys and girls until the age of ten, the growth spurt at puberty starts earlier in girls but lasts longer in boys."

Source:http://www.nbcnews.com/id/38600414/n.../#.UsX5_9K-rIc

If you're looking for Islamic sources see the following:

Sahih Bukhari Volume 5, Book 58, Number 236:

Narrated Hisham's father:

"Khadija died three years before the Prophet departed to Medina. He stayed there for two years or so and then he married 'Aisha when she was a girl of six years of age, and he consumed that marriage when she was nine years old."


Sahih Muslim Book 008, Number 3310:

"'A'isha (Allah be pleased with her) reported: Allah's Apostle (may peace be upon him) married me when I was six years old, and I was admitted to his house when I was nine years old."



"Now some may object to this by saying how could the Prophet marry Aisha at such a young age. One must first understand that 1400 years ago was very different than now, times have changed and so have humans. 1400 years ago it was something very common to marry young girls, in fact they were not considered young girls, rather they were considered young women back then. It is a historic fact that girls from the ages of 9 to 14 were being married in Europe, Asia, and Africa, in fact even in the United States girls at the age of 10 were also being married just more than a century ago."


See:http://muslim-responses.com/Marriage_with_Aisha/Marriage_with_Aisha_

If Muhammad was a pervert he wouldn't have been with a would way older than him until she died.......

Right. And Christiefan's site tried to make him look better than this. As I said, respectable pro-muslim sites don't change the age. And this matches what was reported at the site I gave. The only difference is they try to make it okay by saying she was past menses....
 
There is actually quite divergent ideation between the Muslims who believe this and those who believe younger, Sun Devil recognized that and I give him kudos for it.

I don't bring up wholly pro-Islam sites because their purpose is to try to make Muhammad look better and convert people. If I am speaking against Christianity I'll bring up an anti-Christian site because Christian sites will always seek to make their religion look better than it is...

Anyway, he brought up Muhammad and the "virgin" Mary. He was striking at the wrong anvil there too. Neither of these religions hold much for me. I respect their followers, but I am not of these people.

I don't disagree with Sun Devil's post as far as it went, but also read this regarding interpretation of ahadith.

"As to the authenticity of these reports, it may be noted that the compilers of the books of Hadith did not apply the same stringent tests when accepting reports relating to historical matters as they did before accepting reports relating to the practical teachings and laws of Islam. The reason is that the former type of report was regarded as merely of academic interest while the latter type of report had a direct bearing on the practical duties of a Muslim and on what was allowed to them and what was prohibited. Thus the occurrence of reports such as the above about the marriage of Aisha in books of Hadith, even in Bukhari, is not necessarily a proof of their credibility."
 
I don't disagree with Sun Devil's post as far as it went, but also read this regarding interpretation of ahadith.

"As to the authenticity of these reports, it may be noted that the compilers of the books of Hadith did not apply the same stringent tests when accepting reports relating to historical matters as they did before accepting reports relating to the practical teachings and laws of Islam. The reason is that the former type of report was regarded as merely of academic interest while the latter type of report had a direct bearing on the practical duties of a Muslim and on what was allowed to them and what was prohibited. Thus the occurrence of reports such as the above about the marriage of Aisha in books of Hadith, even in Bukhari, is not necessarily a proof of their credibility."

Again... Yes. As I said, there is divergent beliefs even among Muslims in regards to the ages. However, what Aisha wrote is what I go by. It seems that many dismiss what she wrote because she was a woman. Or because they have a reason to "believe" differently. I take what she said in the Hadith at face value.
 
After all the rants are done, why don't you ask your parents or grand parents how old they were when they married...or better still, maybe how old they were when
they first had a child....it might surprise you.....it was pretty common a few decades back.....and so were the laws.

Times have changed and ideas are different, thats all...

My folks were in their 20's, Mom was 24 and dad 23. They were married in 1943, before dad was shipped off to France during the war.
 
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