Neocon myth buster #2

Taichiliberal

Shaken, not stirred!
I was listening to 77WABC Talk Radio yesterday (it's new conservative punditry 24/7), and the oft repeated talking point on every show was that the Obama administration outright REFUSED any assistance from friendly foreign nations in dealing with the BP Gulf oil spill debacle. The gist was that Obama is a liar who drives his administration to take over all private industry, and therefore rejects anything from the private sector that would endanger his agenda.

:palm: Oh brother!

But as it was since the 2008 campaign, the neocon cabal and peanut gallery are not telling the exact truth on the matter, as one can see when reading the following:



Fox & Friends misleadingly suggests we are not "us[ing] the rest of the world's offers to help us skim up the sludge"

http://mediamatters.org/research/201006110023


In fact, (Coast Guard Admiral Thad) Allen stated that "we are using" equipment from other nations for oil clean-up. In a June 10 press briefing, Allen confirmed that "we are using" foreign technology:

Q: There are many people who say that the best dredgers and skimmers in the world come from countries like the Netherlands and France and that they can't -- they're not being asked to come in because of the Jones Act. Is that the case? And why not get around that, suspend that, so you can bring that other you know technology in?

ADMIRAL ALLEN: Well, first of all, those are source countries. That's correct, they're available. But we are using them. We are dealing with folks like Norway, the Netherlands, Canada and other places. Anyplace that's got skimming capability that's available, we're willing to talk to them, and we actually have, in some cases, actually transferred the equipment down and will continue to do that.

If it gets -- if it gets to the point where there's a Jones Act required, we're willing to do that, too. Nobody's come to me with a request for a Jones Act waiver, but any skimming capability we can bring in, we're looking for.

Q: So are the actual boats being brought in or just the equipment?

ADMIRAL ALLEN: Well, in some cases it's the skimmer itself. In some cases, the skimming equipment is organic to the vessel itself. It depends on what you're talking about. To my knowledge, what we brought in is actually skimming equipment rather than the vessels themselves, but we can give you a detailed listing.
 
uh, just a hint, touchie, but if your going to have a myth buster thread it makes more sense if you actual bust the myth.....your quote verifies that they didn't bring the foreign ships in.....
 
uh, just a hint, touchie, but if your going to have a myth buster thread it makes more sense if you actual bust the myth.....your quote verifies that they didn't bring the foreign ships in.....

lol...no kidding, the link is clear that some offers have not been accepted and that there are no ships...
 
Nothing misleading about reports...Obama DID turn down help from several nations in the past....widely reported....

The only thing misleading is your ridiculous post....

the Jones Act requires that any ships transporting goods from state to state be built in the US, crewed by Americans, and owned by Americans. On Monday, Sen. George LeMieux and Rep. Jeff Miller, both Florida Republicans, sent a letter to Obama requesting that he waive the act.

In response to such calls for more foreign help, the oil spill unified command on Tuesday streamlined the waiver process, adding that 15 foreign-flagged ships are already operating in the Gulf. More are on their way, according to Department of Homeland Security Secretary Janet Napolitano.

Nevertheless, some political scientists say that waiving the Jones Act could be a big symbolic step for Obama as he struggles to come to grips – not just with the spill, but with the other demands on his presidency.

"It's been an improvised response so far.... Any kind of dramatic step they can take is probably going to be beneficial," says Alan Abramowitz, a political scientist at Emory University in Atlanta.

In his Oval Office speech Tuesday, Obama laid out a relief scenario where thousands of ships and tens of thousands of relief workers are deployed and more National Guard troops are on the way. If the spill gets into the Gulf's loop current, it could round Florida's cape, join the Gulf Stream, and potentially head up parts of the Atlantic coast. Obama tried to prepare Americans for further setbacks Tuesday night, stating that oil will continue to hit beaches and marshes.
 
Such dishonesty on the right. It has been widely stated and suggested, both here and elsewhere, that the admin is "refusing" foreign help.

When pressed, the goal posts shift, and the defense becomes, "oh, I wasn't trying to say they were refusing ALL foreign help."

So, now - the admin has to accept everything, or it's painted as a blanket refusal.

Is there one intellectually honest rightie left on this board?
 
Nothing misleading about reports...Obama DID turn down help from several nations in the past....widely reported....

The only thing misleading is your ridiculous post....

the Jones Act requires that any ships transporting goods from state to state be built in the US, crewed by Americans, and owned by Americans. On Monday, Sen. George LeMieux and Rep. Jeff Miller, both Florida Republicans, sent a letter to Obama requesting that he waive the act.

In response to such calls for more foreign help, the oil spill unified command on Tuesday streamlined the waiver process, adding that 15 foreign-flagged ships are already operating in the Gulf. More are on their way, according to Department of Homeland Security Secretary Janet Napolitano.

Nevertheless, some political scientists say that waiving the Jones Act could be a big symbolic step for Obama as he struggles to come to grips – not just with the spill, but with the other demands on his presidency.

"It's been an improvised response so far.... Any kind of dramatic step they can take is probably going to be beneficial," says Alan Abramowitz, a political scientist at Emory University in Atlanta.

In his Oval Office speech Tuesday, Obama laid out a relief scenario where thousands of ships and tens of thousands of relief workers are deployed and more National Guard troops are on the way. If the spill gets into the Gulf's loop current, it could round Florida's cape, join the Gulf Stream, and potentially head up parts of the Atlantic coast. Obama tried to prepare Americans for further setbacks Tuesday night, stating that oil will continue to hit beaches and marshes.

and cue onceler to lie about people claiming a blanket refusal exists...fact is, obama has in fact not accepted all offers, those on the right don't see this as a problem though, must, must defend obama until their dying breath....

pathetic blind party loyalty
 
Such dishonesty on the right. It has been widely stated and suggested, both here and elsewhere, that the admin is "refusing" foreign help.

When pressed, the goal posts shift, and the defense becomes, "oh, I wasn't trying to say they were refusing ALL foreign help."

So, now - the admin has to accept everything, or it's painted as a blanket refusal.

Is there one intellectually honest rightie left on this board?

You have an annoying habit of reading more into a post than is printed ....
Its not only annoying, its downright fuckin' dishonest....and whats posted in the past is whats claimed then(when its posted), and may certainly differ from events or facts, 1 or 2 or whatever days or weeks later....

Obama did refuse foreign help. Thats doesn't mean ALL or say ALL foreign help...so stick with the fuckin' facts and whats posted and not what YOU THINK OR IMAGINE some poster means.....if you need some clarification of what a poster means, ask for it...
 
You have an annoying habit of reading more into a post than is printed ....
Its not only annoying, its downright fuckin' dishonest....and whats posted in the past is whats claimed then(when its posted), and may certainly differ from events or facts, 1 or 2 or whatever days or weeks later....

Obama did refuse foreign help. Thats doesn't mean ALL or say ALL foreign help...so stick with the fuckin' facts and whats posted and not what YOU THINK OR IMAGINE some poster means.....if you need some clarification of what a poster means, ask for it...

Do you even have any idea whose posts I'm talking about?

There were 3 posters today who pretty clearly stated that he refused all foreign help.

Oops.
 
Do you even have any idea whose posts I'm talking about?

There were 3 posters today who pretty clearly stated that he refused all foreign help.

Oops.

You've done it me many times, and I'm not addressing any particular posts in this thread....my example is just that, an example......I'd ask the poster for more information on exactly what he means ... Obama DID refuse "some" foreign help...thats clearer...Obama DID refuse foreign help, is true, but misleading, nothing to get bent about.
 
You've done it me many times, and I'm not addressing any particular posts in this thread....my example is just that, an example......I'd ask the poster for more information on exactly what he means ... Obama DID refuse "some" foreign help...thats clearer...Obama DID refuse foreign help, is true, but misleading, nothing to get bent about.

You've gotta be kidding me; I'd love to see the post where you ask another poster for more clarification on 'exactly what he means.' That would be a treat.
 
You have an annoying habit of reading more into a post than is printed ....
Its not only annoying, its downright fuckin' dishonest....and whats posted in the past is whats claimed then(when its posted), and may certainly differ from events or facts, 1 or 2 or whatever days or weeks later....

Obama did refuse foreign help. Thats doesn't mean ALL or say ALL foreign help...so stick with the fuckin' facts and whats posted and not what YOU THINK OR IMAGINE some poster means.....if you need some clarification of what a poster means, ask for it...

its dunceler MO....if you state a fact and onceler doesn't like the fact, he dishonestly says you're being negative or some other misleading nonsense

good call out bravo
 
Yurtsie, the liar, Yurtsie the liar!

Show me where I distorted anyone's words, or misrepresented anything. I dared ya to on another thread, and you ran for the hills. I don't expect you to take up the challenge here.

Yurtsie!
 
http://thecable.foreignpolicy.com/posts/2010/05/06/us_not_accepting_foreign_help_on_oil_spill

According to Foreign Policy, thirteen entities that had offered the U.S. oil spill assistance within about two weeks of the Horizon rig explosion. They were the governments of Canada, Croatia, France, Germany, Ireland, Mexico, the Netherlands, Norway, Romania, Republic of Korea, Spain, Sweden, the United Kingdom, and the United Nations.

The U.S. response - Thank you, but no thank you, we’ve got it.

“..While there is no need right now that the U.S. cannot meet, the U.S. Coast Guard is assessing these offers of assistance to see if there will be something which we will need in the near future.”

Blame It On The Jones Act?

Separately, a Dutch news site De Standaard also reported Belgian and Dutch dredgers have technology in-house to fight the oil spill in the Gulf of Mexico, but the Act Jones forbids them to work in the U.S.

A Belgian group–DEME– contends it can clean up the oil in three to four months with specialty vessel and equipment, rather than an estimated nine months if done only by the U.S. The article noted there are no more than 5 or 6 of those ships in the world and the top specialist players are the two Belgian companies- DEME and De Nul - and their Dutch competitors.

The U.S. does not have the similar technology and vessel to accomplish the cleanup task because those ships would cost twice as much to build in the U.S. than in the Far East. The article further criticizes this “great technological delay” is a direct consequence of the Jones Act.
============================================

This was certainly true not that long ago and the oil was gushing while Obama fucked around...I don't know how many FOREIGN ships of FOREIGN equipment is in the Gulf now or whats being used....

No doubt...its TOO LITTLE, TOO LATE
 
Yurtsie, the liar, Yurtsie the liar!

Show me where I distorted anyone's words, or misrepresented anything. I dared ya to on another thread, and you ran for the hills. I don't expect you to take up the challenge here.

Yurtsie!

:palm:

i've already shown you where you've distorted people's words...you've already been called to the floor on it and to now claim you haven't been shown this is the height of dishonesty...

i can't believe you have the audacity to outright lie like this...

does your boyfriend know you have a crush on me? i bet he woudl be raging with jealousy if he knew how obsessively you call me yurtsie
 
:palm:

i've already shown you where you've distorted people's words...you've already been called to the floor on it and to now claim you haven't been shown this is the height of dishonesty...

i can't believe you have the audacity to outright lie like this...

does your boyfriend know you have a crush on me? i bet he woudl be raging with jealousy if he knew how obsessively you call me yurtsie

You always say stuff like that...weird, Yurtsie! Where, on the other thread, where you said "numerous" others had commented on the same? Posters like uber-hacks ID & Damo, and SF, whose words I showed you (you remember, when you quickly went silent, because you realized I wasn't misrepresenting anything?)

So desperate.

Yurtsie!

:cof1:
 
good lord, you are hopeless

i can't believe you're claiming i never showed you where ID never said it was blanket denial, where i pointed out that i never said seepage is the same as the oil spill and on and on....

whatever onceler
 
good lord, you are hopeless

i can't believe you're claiming i never showed you where ID never said it was blanket denial, where i pointed out that i never said seepage is the same as the oil spill and on and on....

whatever onceler

Oh, that? You mean where I had 3 quotes to your one (your one, which indicated nothing about accepting some foreign aid)?

Yeah - I smoked you on that one too, Yurtsie! You must have blinders on when you get embarassed like that...

:cof1:
 
Such dishonesty on the right. It has been widely stated and suggested, both here and elsewhere, that the admin is "refusing" foreign help.

When pressed, the goal posts shift, and the defense becomes, "oh, I wasn't trying to say they were refusing ALL foreign help."


Wow, almost exactly like the babble about the dangers of natural oil seeps, and how this really wasn't anything like the Exxon Valdez disaster we heard from NeoCons a month ago, and now they have a collective amnesia of ever having been idiots like that.

I'm not sure why the reich wing has to routinely lie....I guess it's congenital.

There are legitimate reasons to criticize obama, and all the substantive, and factually-based criticisms are coming from the left. One doesn't have to lie about natural seepage dangers, or accepting foreign help to excoriate Obama.



The Inside Story of How Obama Let the World’s Most Dangerous Oil Company Spiral out of Control

Though George W. Bush paved the way for the catastrophe, it was Obama who gave BP the green light to drill.

June 12, 2010 *







An extensive new investigation into the Obama administration’s handling of the BP oil spill disaster reveals that it was government mismanagement, delays and absence of oversight that allowed the crisis to spiral out of control. In the article "The Spill, the Scandal, and the President," Rolling Stone’s Tim Dickinson writes, "Though George W. Bush paved the way for the catastrophe, it was Obama who gave BP the green light to drill." Dickinson explores how Interior Secretary Ken Salazar kept in place the oil industry-friendly environmental guidelines that Bush had implemented and ultimately let BP, an oil company with the worst safety record, to get away with murder.


http://www.alternet.org/news/147180...il_company_spiral_out_of_control/?page=entire
 
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