Neocon myth buster #2

PostmodernProphet said:
uh, just a hint, touchie, but if your going to have a myth buster thread it makes more sense if you actual bust the myth.....your quote verifies that they didn't bring the foreign ships in.....
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Uhh, learn to read, you post modern fool! The article is in sync with the title. Better yet, go to the damned site and READ the damned article...that way, you'll know WTF you're talking about.
 
bravo said:
Nothing misleading about reports...Obama DID turn down help from several nations in the past....widely reported....

The only thing misleading is your ridiculous post....

the Jones Act requires that any ships transporting goods from state to state be built in the US, crewed by Americans, and owned by Americans. On Monday, Sen. George LeMieux and Rep. Jeff Miller, both Florida Republicans, sent a letter to Obama requesting that he waive the act.

In response to such calls for more foreign help, the oil spill unified command on Tuesday streamlined the waiver process, adding that 15 foreign-flagged ships are already operating in the Gulf. More are on their way, according to Department of Homeland Security Secretary Janet Napolitano.

Nevertheless, some political scientists say that waiving the Jones Act could be a big symbolic step for Obama as he struggles to come to grips – not just with the spill, but with the other demands on his presidency.

"It's been an improvised response so far.... Any kind of dramatic step they can take is probably going to be beneficial," says Alan Abramowitz, a political scientist at Emory University in Atlanta.

In his Oval Office speech Tuesday, Obama laid out a relief scenario where thousands of ships and tens of thousands of relief workers are deployed and more National Guard troops are on the way. If the spill gets into the Gulf's loop current, it could round Florida's cape, join the Gulf Stream, and potentially head up parts of the Atlantic coast. Obama tried to prepare Americans for further setbacks Tuesday night, stating that oil will continue to hit beaches and marshes.
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:palm: Bravo, you are one incredibly proud ignorant clown! What the hell does this quote of yours change, refute or disprove about my link? Next time READ, you dunce! Learn to compare, analyze and correlate information. Here's a quote from my source (I noted you didn't give a link for yours)...put it in a time frame with what you put forth:


Q Senator Bill Nelson is going to write a letter to the President today asking for some clarification on the Jones Act and whether or not it is in any way inhibiting the U.S. government's use of offers from other foreign nations and foreign-flagged vessels to help in any way -- mediation, skimming, any of the other operations you're doing on the Gulf. What is the administration's position on it? The Jones Act was waived during Katrina by the Bush administration to bring oil in. What's your position on this?

MR. GIBBS: I would say this --

Q Is it an impediment or are you open to waiving it if you need to?

MR. GIBBS: No, no, as Admiral Allen said today, we are using equipment and vessels from countries like Norway, Canada, the Netherlands. There has not been any problem with this. If there is the need for any type of waiver, that would obviously be granted. But this -- we've not had that problem thus far in the Gulf.

Q But you're open to waiving it if you need to?

MR. GIBBS: If there's anything that needs to happen, that will -- we will make sure that it happens.
 
bravo said:
You have an annoying habit of reading more into a post than is printed ....
Its not only annoying, its downright fuckin' dishonest....and whats posted in the past is whats claimed then(when its posted), and may certainly differ from events or facts, 1 or 2 or whatever days or weeks later....

Obama did refuse foreign help. Thats doesn't mean ALL or say ALL foreign help...so stick with the fuckin' facts and whats posted and not what YOU THINK OR IMAGINE some poster means.....if you need some clarification of what a poster means, ask for it...
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If the Coast Guard Admn. is on record pointing out that foreign aid has been accepted, then WTF are YOU babbling about?

Seems our intellectually impotent Bravo has drunk the neocon Kool-Aid and is braying the neoon mythology FACTUALLY DISPROVED by Media Matters. But then again, dealing with reality has never been Bravo's strong suit.
 
bravo said:
http://thecable.foreignpolicy.com/posts/2010/05/06/us_not_accepting_foreign_help_on_oil_spill

According to Foreign Policy, thirteen entities that had offered the U.S. oil spill assistance within about two weeks of the Horizon rig explosion. They were the governments of Canada, Croatia, France, Germany, Ireland, Mexico, the Netherlands, Norway, Romania, Republic of Korea, Spain, Sweden, the United Kingdom, and the United Nations.

The U.S. response - Thank you, but no thank you, we’ve got it.

“..While there is no need right now that the U.S. cannot meet, the U.S. Coast Guard is assessing these offers of assistance to see if there will be something which we will need in the near future.”

Blame It On The Jones Act?

Separately, a Dutch news site De Standaard also reported Belgian and Dutch dredgers have technology in-house to fight the oil spill in the Gulf of Mexico, but the Act Jones forbids them to work in the U.S.

A Belgian group–DEME– contends it can clean up the oil in three to four months with specialty vessel and equipment, rather than an estimated nine months if done only by the U.S. The article noted there are no more than 5 or 6 of those ships in the world and the top specialist players are the two Belgian companies- DEME and De Nul - and their Dutch competitors.

The U.S. does not have the similar technology and vessel to accomplish the cleanup task because those ships would cost twice as much to build in the U.S. than in the Far East. The article further criticizes this “great technological delay” is a direct consequence of the Jones Act.
============================================

This was certainly true not that long ago and the oil was gushing while Obama fucked around...I don't know how many FOREIGN ships of FOREIGN equipment is in the Gulf now or whats being used....

No doubt...its TOO LITTLE, TOO LATE
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Fox & Friends repeatedly cropped Allen's comments to omit his discussion of foreign aid already being used
Fox & Friends aired only Allen's statement that "nobody's come to me with a request for a Jones Act waiver." Fox & Friends only aired Allen's statement during a June 10 press briefing that "if it gets to the point where there's a Jones Act required, we're willing to do that, too. Nobody's come to me with a request for a Jones Act waiver." But Fox & Friends did not air Allen's statement that "we are using" technology from other nations and that "[w]e are dealing with folks like Norway, the Netherlands, Canada and other places. Anyplace that's got skimming capability that's available, we're willing to talk to them, and we actually have, in some cases, actually transferred the equipment down and will continue to do that."
 
Taichiliberal said:
Anyplace that's got skimming capability that's available, we're willing to talk to them, and we actually have, in some cases, actually transferred the equipment down and will continue to do that."[/COLOR]
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tell me this.....why isn't the answer "anyplace that has skimming capability we have them out there skimming"?......
 
Taichiliberal said:
Fox & Friends repeatedly cropped Allen's comments to omit his discussion of foreign aid already being used
Fox & Friends aired only Allen's statement that "nobody's come to me with a request for a Jones Act waiver." Fox & Friends only aired Allen's statement during a June 10 press briefing that "if it gets to the point where there's a Jones Act required, we're willing to do that, too. Nobody's come to me with a request for a Jones Act waiver." But Fox & Friends did not air Allen's statement that "we are using" technology from other nations and that "[w]e are dealing with folks like Norway, the Netherlands, Canada and other places. Anyplace that's got skimming capability that's available, we're willing to talk to them, and we actually have, in some cases, actually transferred the equipment down and will continue to do that."
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Are you refering to some other post....
No one is talking about Fox News
No one mentioned Allen....
and if you can't actually prove your allegations, don't bother trying to convince us with your obsessive hate with Fox News

As of May 6...well into this fiasco, as the oil is fucking up to Gulf hourly
..
U.S. not accepting foreign help on oil spill
Posted By Josh Rogin Thursday, May 6, 2010 - 10:52 AM Share

When State Department spokesman P.J. Crowley refused to tell reporters which countries have offered assistance to help respond to the BP oil spill, the State Department press corps was flabbergasted.

"As a policy matter, we're not going to identify those offers of assistance until we are able to see, you know, what we need, assess the ongoing situation. And as we accept those offers of assistance, we will inform you," Crowley said.
================================

Now that the damage is so overwhelming, the clown finally starts to accept the help he should have sought from the DAY ONE
 
Originally Posted by Taichiliberal
Anyplace that's got skimming capability that's available, we're willing to talk to them, and we actually have, in some cases, actually transferred the equipment down and will continue to do that."
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PostmodernProphet said:
tell me this.....why isn't the answer "anyplace that has skimming capability we have them out there skimming"?......
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:palm: For the very reasons the articles and reasons I, Cypress Oncelar have pointed out.

Hey, I personally would have wanted Obama to have pulled a Slick Willy and call a meeting with all concerned (BP, EPA, Coast Guard, etc.), do an executive order to waive the Jones Act, and then kick ass and take names for the next meeting to be productive. But would the necon driven GOP NOT have screamed bloody murder about the Obama agenda to take over private enterprise? Subvert the Constitution, etc.

Again, the article I sighted did not say Obama was doing a 100% bang up job....they just pointed out that the neocon bullhorn's were exaggerating the negatives as usual (aka, "lying").
 
Originally Posted by Taichiliberal
Fox & Friends repeatedly cropped Allen's comments to omit his discussion of foreign aid already being used
Fox & Friends aired only Allen's statement that "nobody's come to me with a request for a Jones Act waiver." Fox & Friends only aired Allen's statement during a June 10 press briefing that "if it gets to the point where there's a Jones Act required, we're willing to do that, too. Nobody's come to me with a request for a Jones Act waiver." But Fox & Friends did not air Allen's statement that "we are using" technology from other nations and that "[w]e are dealing with folks like Norway, the Netherlands, Canada and other places. Anyplace that's got skimming capability that's available, we're willing to talk to them, and we actually have, in some cases, actually transferred the equipment down and will continue to do that."
Click to expand...

bravo said:
Are you refering to some other post....
No one is talking about Fox News
No one mentioned Allen....
and if you can't actually prove your allegations, don't bother trying to convince us with your obsessive hate with Fox News

As of May 6...well into this fiasco, as the oil is fucking up to Gulf hourly
..
U.S. not accepting foreign help on oil spill
Posted By Josh Rogin Thursday, May 6, 2010 - 10:52 AM Share

When State Department spokesman P.J. Crowley refused to tell reporters which countries have offered assistance to help respond to the BP oil spill, the State Department press corps was flabbergasted.

"As a policy matter, we're not going to identify those offers of assistance until we are able to see, you know, what we need, assess the ongoing situation. And as we accept those offers of assistance, we will inform you," Crowley said.
================================

Now that the damage is so overwhelming, the clown finally starts to accept the help he should have sought from the DAY ONE
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See folks, our intellectually impotent Bravo just can't (or won't) pay attention to detail or the chronology of the posts. Had the fool actually paid attention, he'd have noted that the ORIGINAL POST LINKED AN ARTICLE THAT INCLUDED INFORMATION ON FOX NEWS, ALLEN AND OTHERS AS TO HOW THEY EXAGGERATED AND LIED ABOUT FOREIGN AID TO THE GULF OIL SPILL CRISIS.

Neither I nor the article said Obama was doing everything correct.....just not letting the neocon bullhorns get aways with their usual exaggerations and lies. But Bravo is just another willfully ignorant neocon stooge who's brain stopped when he read an (incorrect) article that likened to his beliefs. As you can see, Bravo just keeps repeating the same BS while ignoring all else....Bravo the neocon parrot.:palm:
 
Originally Posted by Taichiliberal
For the very reasons the articles and reasons I, Cypress Oncelar have pointed out.
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PostmodernProphet said:
?????....you mean there aren't any reasons?.....because you haven't "pointed out" anything with any merit so far.....all you've done is claim "they did" when they obviously didn't......
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:palm: Go back the opening post...click on the link and READ the article (including internal links). It explains EXACTLY what I, Cypress and Oncelar have been trying to school you on. Be warned, the link uses FACTS to document what it's correcting..and I know how disturbing facts are to you insipidly stubborn neocon parrots....which is obviously why you didn't read it and then made this absurd statement of yours.

http://www.justplainpolitics.com/showpost.php?p=665800&postcount=1
 
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Taichiliberal said:
READ the article
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did....it proves that the ships were rejected and it took a month to accept the other offers, and then only after people reacted with a massive "wtf" that embarrassed the government into appropriate action....which pretty much amounts to massive thread fail on your part.....now, apart from the mud on your face, what is left to debate?......:pke:
 
Taichiliberal said:
:palm: Go back the opening post...click on the link and READ the article (including internal links). It explains EXACTLY what I, Cypress and Oncelar have been trying to school you on. Be warned, the link uses FACTS to document what it's correcting..and I know how disturbing facts are to you insipidly stubborn neocon parrots....which is obviously why you didn't read it and then made this absurd statement of yours.

http://www.justplainpolitics.com/showpost.php?p=665800&postcount=1
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No one really gives a shit what "MediaMatters" has to say or what they think...they're a left wing rag,------------- might as well get your information from the DNC, fool..
======================
And as of today.....the clown(Obama) has the CG stopping the cleanup efforts of barges because of fuckin' life-jackets...

http://abcnews.go.com/WN/bp-oil-spill-gov-bobby-jindals-wishes-crude/story?id=10946379

This administration is beyond incompetent...we are in the midst of a fuckin' disaster and they are using the Coast Guard to stop cleaning up the oil because the barges may not have life vests and fire extinguishers....are you freakin' kiddin' me ?
-----------
Coast Guard Orders Barges to Stop

So why stop now?

"The Coast Guard came and shut them down," Jindal said. "You got men on the barges in the oil, and they have been told by the Coast Guard, 'Cease and desist. Stop sucking up that oil.'"
But the Coast Guard ordered the stoppage because of reasons that Jindal found frustrating. The Coast Guard needed to confirm that there were fire extinguishers and life vests on board, and then it had trouble contacting the people who built the barges.
 
PostmodernProphet said:
did....it proves that the ships were rejected and it took a month to accept the other offers, and then only after people reacted with a massive "wtf" that embarrassed the government into appropriate action....which pretty much amounts to massive thread fail on your part.....now, apart from the mud on your face, what is left to debate?......:pke:
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Stop lying...the article shows that what was offered was only partially refused in accordance WITH THE LAW.....while OTHER FORMS OF FOREIGN ASSISTANCE WAS ACCEPTED.

No one is denying public outrage over the gov't not going gangbusters on this (which would have been interesting to see the reaction of the "less gov't, more private business" neocons and libertarians if it did) .....the article is just pointing out the neocon bullhorn's bull.

Once again, the post modern fool depends upon exaggeration, distortion and half truths to support his supposition and conjecture...while the FACTS are there to foil him at every turn. Now let's watch him just parrot the same disproven dreck ad nauseum...or divert to the usual personal attack.
 
PostmodernProphet said:
did....it proves that the ships were rejected and it took a month to accept the other offers, and then only after people reacted with a massive "wtf" that embarrassed the government into appropriate action....which pretty much amounts to massive thread fail on your part.....now, apart from the mud on your face, what is left to debate?......:pke:
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Its funny, how you can "school the fool" and he don't even know it....

Oh well, its more important the rest of us know it...:good4u:
 
Originally Posted by Taichiliberal
Go back the opening post...click on the link and READ the article (including internal links). It explains EXACTLY what I, Cypress and Oncelar have been trying to school you on. Be warned, the link uses FACTS to document what it's correcting..and I know how disturbing facts are to you insipidly stubborn neocon parrots....which is obviously why you didn't read it and then made this absurd statement of yours.

http://www.justplainpolitics.com/sho...00&postcount=1
Click to expand...
bravo said:
No one really gives a shit what "MediaMatters" has to say or what they think...they're a left wing rag,------------- might as well get your information from the DNC, fool..
======================
And as of today.....the clown(Obama) has the CG stopping the cleanup efforts of barges because of fuckin' life-jackets...

http://abcnews.go.com/WN/bp-oil-spill-gov-bobby-jindals-wishes-crude/story?id=10946379

This administration is beyond incompetent...we are in the midst of a fuckin' disaster and they are using the Coast Guard to stop cleaning up the oil because the barges may not have life vests and fire extinguishers....are you freakin' kiddin' me ?
-----------
Coast Guard Orders Barges to Stop

So why stop now?

"The Coast Guard came and shut them down," Jindal said. "You got men on the barges in the oil, and they have been told by the Coast Guard, 'Cease and desist. Stop sucking up that oil.'"
But the Coast Guard ordered the stoppage because of reasons that Jindal found frustrating. The Coast Guard needed to confirm that there were fire extinguishers and life vests on board, and then it had trouble contacting the people who built the barges.
Click to expand...

Once again, our willfully ignorant yet proud neocon numbskull that is Bravo brags about refusing to read information that contradicts his beliefs. That way, the dunce that is Bravo can continue his tirade in blissful ignorance...Bravo wearing blinders can never be wrong.

Jindal bitching about safety procedures momentarily slowing down clean up is just placating to dummies like Bravo, who lap it up like a dog going after a spilled ice cream cone on a sidewalk. Jindal wants to be re-elected, and the effort to somehow fault the Obama administration as the cause of this disaster and totally incompetant in reaction fits the neocon mantras for a comback in 2012.

But hey, let's all go after the Coast Guard if (God forbid) there's a serious/fatal accident on one of those barges...and if not let's just bitch and moan that they're "interferring". :palm:
 
Taichiliberal said:
Stop lying...the article shows that what was offered was only partially refused in accordance WITH THE LAW.....while OTHER FORMS OF FOREIGN ASSISTANCE WAS ACCEPTED.

No one is denying public outrage over the gov't not going gangbusters on this (which would have been interesting to see the reaction of the "less gov't, more private business" neocons and libertarians if it did) .....the article is just pointing out the neocon bullhorn's bull.

Once again, the post modern fool depends upon exaggeration, distortion and half truths to support his supposition and conjecture...while the FACTS are there to foil him at every turn. Now let's watch him just parrot the same disproven dreck ad nauseum...or divert to the usual personal attack.
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uh dude.....even your own links prove that your claims are false.....catch up....
 
Originally Posted by Taichiliberal
Stop lying...the article shows that what was offered was only partially refused in accordance WITH THE LAW.....while OTHER FORMS OF FOREIGN ASSISTANCE WAS ACCEPTED.

No one is denying public outrage over the gov't not going gangbusters on this (which would have been interesting to see the reaction of the "less gov't, more private business" neocons and libertarians if it did) .....the article is just pointing out the neocon bullhorn's bull.

Once again, the post modern fool depends upon exaggeration, distortion and half truths to support his supposition and conjecture...while the FACTS are there to foil him at every turn. Now let's watch him just parrot the same disproven dreck ad nauseum...or divert to the usual personal attack.
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PostmodernProphet said:
uh dude.....even your own links prove that your claims are false.....catch up....
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Really? Which ones? Stop blowing smoke like a Post Modern Fool and logically PROVE your accusation/allegation. Show my link, give us the quotes, and PROVE how they make my claims false. Put up or shut up!
 
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Taichiliberal said:
Really? Which ones? Stop blowing smoke like a Post Modern Fool and logically PROVE your accusation/allegation. Show my link, give us the quotes, and PROVE how they make my claims false. Put up or shut up!
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?????.....since this has already been done on this thread why do you pretend it would be different this time......the article you linked, in the OP, near the bottom, the guy said no boats had been accepted.....some equipment had been accepted, but a month after they were offered.....I believe it was Damo that pointed it out to you....since it's already there, I see no reason to repeat it......
 
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