Nine out of ten economists agree: Sports stadium subsidies are dumb

This. This is why I am against such subsidies. Still like my Dallas Cowboys though. :)
I like my Blue Jackets too but if I'm going to raise my own taxes to subsidize a business I expect one hell of a lot more of a return on investment than you're going to get from a pro sports franchise.
 
I'm in the camp that believes many extra bowl games and events adds to the economy!
It does but the economic studies show that most of the money goes into the hands of a few businessmen who take it out of state and that it doesn't add much to the local economy. A small parts manufacturer that employs 100 people will have a greater economic impact than most pro sports franchises cause the money stays local.
 
Nope. Productive effort makes us great. If they (or their capital) are not productive, i.e., if they persist by living off the productive effort of others collected in taxes then they are a net drain.

Detroit is a prime example of what happens when you open the public purse to any and all that want a handout.
That's a good point...which comes first the chicken or the egg or, as in this case, capital or labor. I think it's obvious that labor comes first cause you get nothing done without productive labor but productive labor won't get much done without capital.
 
Working stiffs may not buy 50 yard line seats but they still wear their teams gear and support their team whether it's watching the game at home or at a bar with buddies. You don't have to be at a game to support your team and get pleasure from it. When thousands of fans spill out onto the streets to celebrate a city's championship do you think it's only rich people out there?
I didn't say that. I said that using taxes to subsidize pro sports teams subsidized entertainment for the wealthy. That's by and large true. Who do you think that cost is otherwise passed onto? Joe Six Pack who can occasionally take his kid to a game?
 
Maybe single game tickets. That or they like sports a whole hell of a lot more than I do.

I mean these are the costs in my area.

2 season tickets, Cincinnati Reds. infield seats, +$5,000
2 season tickets, Cincinnati Bengals. Lower Level a relative bargain at $3200
2 season tickets, Ohio State Football. +$6000
2 season tickets, Columbus Blue Jackets. +$6000

I'd have to wait 50 years before a season ticket was available for the Steelers.
 
In football watching the game does not do anything for the team directly. It helps the league. In baseball and other sports it helps the team, but only based on advertisers and they pay more for higher income viewers.

Even in cities that don't have a team people watch sports, buy merchandise and gain some joy from being a fan.

I have to disagree with Mott. The tax subsidy does not subsidize tickets. The teams charge what the market will bear for tickets. They don't reduce the price of tickets because the stadium was built for them. While some deals do require a certain amount of tickets be provided at a lower price that's mostly a smoke screen. You are going to have cheap seats anyway simply because some seats will be further away.

Where does the subsidy go? Well mostly into building the stadium (though some teams are even ripping cities off to guarantee a certain amount of ticket sales). The teams will spend more on building the stadium than they normally would. Oftentimes it will be inefficient. If a team can build a feature that will increase revenues by, say, 40 million over the life of a stadium and costs 50 million to build and maintain, then they would not likely do it with their own money. But if taxpayer are paying for it then every bit of increased revenue is a bonus. They might even add features that don't increase revenues at all, because... fuck it, it's not their money.

So that money goes into the pockets of the owners and leagues and probably leads to an increase in pay for players and coaches. The poor are being taxed to help millionaires and billionaires.
I didn't say it subsidized tickets, I said it subsidized entertainment for the wealthy. Who do you think pays the bulk of the cost for these entertainment venues? If those pro-sports teams aren't subsidized who do you think that cost is passed onto? I'm not playing the class warfare card here. I'm pointing out an obvious fact. Pro Sports are predominantly supported financially by the wealthy classes and not Joe Six Pack.
 
I never said it benefitted the team. I was responding to this comment from Mott: "Public subsidies for pro sports do in fact subsidize entertainment for the prosperous"

Many working class stiffs watch and enjoy sports so they get benefit from the team being there. One doesn't have to be rich, nor at the stadium, to garner pleasure from the event.
I don't disagree but that has nothing to do with my point. Who pays the lion share of the bill for that entertainment venue?
 
It does but the economic studies show that most of the money goes into the hands of a few businessmen who take it out of state and that it doesn't add much to the local economy. A small parts manufacturer that employs 100 people will have a greater economic impact than most pro sports franchises cause the money stays local.
I think you can find one that says that, not consensus.
 
I'm not saying it's smart financial, the median prole doesn't have a pot to piss in.
Well that's pretty much my point about subsidizing entertainment for the prosperous. I'm not playin class warfare. I'm pointing out a fact. It's mostly the wealthy and prosperous who pay for these entertainment venues as your average Joe Six pack can't afford the ticket prices other than on a very occasional basis.
 
Well you and I don't think they should buy, but it's there choice!
Since when did you noticed public spending happening frequently on the most economic all prudent way anyhow!
 
I think you can find one that says that, not consensus.
Please! There are 500 people who work our corporate office in Dublin. We contribute nearly $100,000,000 annually to the local economy. That's probably 3 to 4 times more than what a NFL team would contribute to the local economy annually.
 
Please! There are 500 people who work our corporate office in Dublin. We contribute nearly $100,000,000 annually to the local economy. That's probably 3 to 4 times more than what a NFL team would contribute to the local economy annually.
25,000,000 annually is a ton!
Junior
 
Depends. Each deal for a new stadium is separate.
Ultimately it's the people who buy tickets and the sponsors who pay for TV and Radio coverage. Which gets to my point. I don't think it's right to ask tax payers to subsidize someone else business model or entertainment.
 
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