Not about religion or the miliita

nigel and topspin of course have to the first hacks to embarrass themselves....

the PROSECUTOR said this, not me idiots...too funny how you go after me and leave the prosecutor alone...

hacks


I seriously don't know what you're point is. I was just looking for a little clarification.
 
tell me who waterstreet is in this matter topspin....


I still don't understand your point. The prosecutor says that the prosecution is not about first amendment protected activity. Why is that surprising and what do you contend it proves?
 
I still don't understand your point. The prosecutor says that the prosecution is not about first amendment protected activity. Why is that surprising and what do you contend it proves?

at this point, it doesn't "prove" anything....it is solely a counterpoint to the hysteria of conspiracy nuts like topspin who bash religion and the militia simply because of nutjobs like this....even the prosecutor at this time is claiming it is not about that and at this time, i would say he is more knowledgeable than others as to their motives and background...

you're just being obtuse on purpose in the hopes of getting some gotcha moment....sorry to disappoint you
 
at this point, it doesn't "prove" anything....it is solely a counterpoint to the hysteria of conspiracy nuts like topspin who bash religion and the militia simply because of nutjobs like this....even the prosecutor at this time is claiming it is not about that and at this time, i would say he is more knowledgeable than others as to their motives and background...

you're just being obtuse on purpose in the hopes of getting some gotcha moment....sorry to disappoint you


The "it" the prosecutor was referring to is the prosecution of these individuals. Of course the prosecutor is going to say that the prosecution is not based on first amendment protected activity (religion and freedom of association). What would you expect him to say?

I'm not trying to do play any gotcha games, that's more your thing. I just don't understand what point you think you are making.
 
The "it" the prosecutor was referring to is the prosecution of these individuals. Of course the prosecutor is going to say that the prosecution is not based on first amendment protected activity (religion and freedom of association). What would you expect him to say?

I'm not trying to do play any gotcha games, that's more your thing. I just don't understand what point you think you are making.

not true, just because you claim something is religious, doesn't mean it is protected....see the peyote case which was about religious practices

you're way off base here and this probably explains why you're clueless
 
not true, just because you claim something is religious, doesn't mean it is protected....see the peyote case which was about religious practices

you're way off base here and this probably explains why you're clueless


You have a really odd habit of seeing absolute statements where none exist. I never suggested that everything religious is protected against prosecution. The fact of the matter is that the prosecution of these individuals has nothing to do with their religious activities or the fact that they belong to an organization or association, but that they plotted to kill law enforcement.

And if you cannot distinguish between a religious practice that may violate the criminal law, such as the consumption of peyote, and members of a religious group that violate the criminal law, such members of a Christianist militia group plotting to kill law enforcement officers, then I cannot help you.

And I still don't know what your original point was.
 
The point of the OP:

No connection between mainstream Christianity and these nuts.

No connection between mainstream militia and these nuts. (???)

Do I win the prize?
 
The point of the OP:

No connection between mainstream Christianity and these nuts.

No connection between mainstream militia and these nuts. (???)

Do I win the prize?


That may be Yurt's argument, I don't know, but neither of those arguments are bolstered by the quote from the prosecutor.

And isn't the term "mainstream militia" an oxymoron?
 
That may be Yurt's argument, I don't know, but neither of those arguments are bolstered by the quote from the prosecutor.

And isn't the term "mainstream militia" an oxymoron?

LOL, could be. I was just taking a stab at it. I'm not too keen on militias anyway.
 
But the New world order is not merely some wacko religious concept.

Quotes of leaders themselves indicate their desire for the New World ORder

http://www.amerikanexpose.com/quotes1.html

New World Order Quotes

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Anthony J. Hilder's New World Order (Real Audio Player Needed)

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"We are grateful to the Washington Post, The New York Times, Time Magazine and other great publications whose directors have attended our meetings and respected their promises of discretion for almost forty years. It would have been impossible for us to develop our plan for the world if we had been subjected to the lights of publicity during those years. But, the world is now more sophisticated and prepared to march towards a world government. The supranational sovereignty of an intellectual elite and world bankers is surely preferable to the national auto-determination practiced in past centuries."
David Rockefeller Baden-Baden, Germany 1991

"Rarely have Americans lived through so much change, in so many ways, in so short a time. Quietly, but with gathering force, the ground has shifted beneath our feet as we have moved into an Information Age, a global economy, a truly new world."
President William Clinton State of the Union Address 1998

"We must all be profoundly grateful for the magnificent achievements of our forbearers in this century. Yet perhaps in the daily press of events, in the clash of controversy, we don't see our own time for what it truly is – a new dawn for America."
President William Clinton State of the Union Address 1999
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"...all of us here at the policy-making level have had experience with directives...from the White House.... The substance of them is that we shall use our grant-making power so as to alter our life in the United States that we can be comfortably merged with the Soviet Union."
H. Rowan Gaither, Jr., President - Ford Foundation
(as told to Norman Dodd, Congressional Reese Commission 1954)

"They [the Soviets] intend...to induce the Americans to adopt their own 'restructuring' and convergence of the Soviet and American systems using to this end the fear of nuclear conflict.... Convergence will be accompanied by blood baths and political re-education camps in Western Europe and the United States. The Soviet strategists are counting on an economic depression in the United States and intend to introduce their reformed model of socialism with a human face as an alternative to the American system during the depression."
Anatoliy Golitsyn The Perestroika Deception 1990
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"Those who hope that we shall move away from the socialist path will be greatly disappointed. Every part of our program of perestroika...is fully based on the principle of more socialism and more democracy."
Mikhail Gorbachev Perestroika - New Thinking for Our Country and the World 1988
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"The New Deal is plainly an attempt to achieve a working socialism and avert a social collapse in America; it is extraordinarily parallel to the successive 'policies' and 'Plans' of the Russian experiment. Americans shirk the word 'socialism', but what else can one call it?"
H.G. Wells The New World Order 1939
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"The sacrifice of personal existence is necessary to secure the preservation of the species."
Adolph Hitler Mein Kampf 1923

"The task of saving the earth's environment must and will become the central organizing principle of the post-Cold War world."
Senator Al Gore Putting People First 1992

"Our ideology is intolerant...and peremptorily demands...the complete transformation of public life to its ideas."
Adolph Hitler cited in The Psychopathic God 1977

"What we're talking about is creating new forms of life on the basis of new values."
Mikhail Gorbachev From Red to Green Audubon magazine 1994

"Our overriding environmental challenge tonight is the worldwide problem of climate change, global warming, the gathering crisis that requires worldwide action."
President William Clinton State of the Union Address 1998
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"I am a Communist, a convinced Communist! For some that may be a fantasy. But to me it is my main goal."
Mikhail Gorbachev New York Times 1989

"Now that we are rid of this syndrome of imposing the communist model on people, now that we've given them the chance to get rid of this dogma, I have to tell you Americans that you've been pushing your American way of life for decades. You thought it was perfection itself, the ultimate achievement of human thought... There has to be a different approach... Americans have to be more modest in their desires. We have to stimulate human qualities in people rather than greed."
Mikhail Gorbachev From Red to Green Audubon magazine 1994
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"Please remember one lesson of the 20th century. One cannot force happiness, impose happiness on nations by imposing any kind of utopia on others. The Communist model of society was a kind of imposed utopia for which the Russian people in particular paid a great price. Still, sometimes we see that attempts are being made to impose some other kind of model on the entire world - maybe a Westernized or Americanized model... This is not the way to go because this can only create conflict."
Mikhail Gorbachev Northeastern University 1998
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"Socialism has a bad name in America, and no amount of wishful thinking on the part of the left is going to change that.... The words Economic Democracy are an adequate and effective replacement."
Derek Shearer cited in Reason 1982

"More socialism means more democracy, openness and collectivism in everyday life..."
Mikhail Gorbachev Perestroika - New Thinking for Our Country and the World 1988
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"This new and complete Revolution we contemplate can be defined in a very few words. It is (a) outright world-socialism, scientifically planned and directed, plus (b) a sustained insistence upon law, law based on a fuller, more jealously conceived restatement of the personal Rights of Man, plus (c) the completest freedom of speech, criticism, and publication, and a sedulous expansion of the educational organization to the ever growing demands of the new order....
Putting it at its compactest, it is the triangle of Socialism, Law, and Knowledge which frames the Revolution that may yet save the world."
H.G. Wells The New World Order 1939
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"I would think that, if you understood what communism was, you would hope, you would pray on your knees that we would become communist."
Jane Fonda Michigan State University 1970

"Communism is one of the options that can improve people's lives."
Tom Hayden New York Times 1975

"I've always been a strong U.N. proponent.... Who was that guy who had the round table? Arthur? One for all, all for one."
Ted Turner CNN Interview with Larry King 1997
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"We will proceed toward better socialism rather than away from it. We are saying this honestly, without trying to fool our own people or the world. Any hopes that we will begin to build a different, non-socialist society and go over to the other camp are unrealistic and futile. Those in the West who expect us to give up socialism will be disappointed."
Mikhail Gorbachev Perestroika - New Thinking for Our Country and the World 1988
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"The crisis [the Great Depression] discovered a great man in Franklin Roosevelt...None too soon he has carried America forward to the second stage of democratic realization. His New Deal involves such collective controls of the national business that it would be absurd to call it anything but socialism, were it not for a prejudice lingering on from the old individualist days against that word...Both Roosevelt and Stalin were attempting to produce a huge, modern, scientifically organized, socialist state, the one out of a warning crisis and the other out of a chaos..."
H.G. Wells The Fate of Man 1939

"I doubt if these two fine, active minds [President and Mrs. Roosevelt] have ever inquiried how it is they know what they know and think as they do. Nor have they ever thought of what they might have been if they had grown up in an entirely different culture. They have the disposition of all politicians world over to deal only with made opinion. They have never inquired how it is that opinion is made."
H.G. Wells The Fate of Man 1939
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"The Soviet transition to a new political structure shows that the Soviet strategists are thinking, planning and acting in broad terms, way beyond the imagination of Western politicians. For this reason Western politicians cannot grasp the fact that the Soviet intention is to win by 'democratic' means. Through transition to a new system, the Soviets are revitalising their own people and institutions, and they are succeeding. Contrary to Western belief, they are holding their ranks together."
Anatoliy Golitsyn The Perestroika Deception 1990
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"But, you will say, we destroy the most hallowed of relations, when we replace home education by social....
The Communists have not invented the intervention of society in education; they do but seek to alter the character of that intervention, and to rescue education from the influence of the ruling class."
Karl Marx and Frederich Engels The Communist Manifesto 1888 edition

"10. Free education for all children in public schools... Combination of education with industrial production,"
Karl Marx and Frederich Engels The Communist Manifesto 1888 edition
 
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