Proposals for Electoral Reform

Yeah the president is the executive with no resume or job qualifications required except be a natutal born citizen and over 35 ? i think it is.

We hire the most powerful man in this country (aside from uberman of course) and do not even require a resume.

No job requires a resume. Resumes are used by employers to quickly weed out the unqualfied. They are, however, under no requirement to. They could hire someone to be head manager with only a GED if the wanted to.
 
Don't you mean closed party list?

In an open party list, the list is decided on by the parties voters, and the party leadership has no voice in the matter.
Ah yes, I guess I would mean that. Except I don't. The selection of candidates are made by the party before the voter gets to decide on where they fall on the list. Therefore the party still controls the candidates in most open party list systems. They are equally slaves of the party, with an illusion of supposed independence.
 
Ah yes, I guess I would mean that. Except I don't. The selection of candidates are made by the party before the voter gets to decide on where they fall on the list. Therefore the party still controls the candidates in most open party list systems. They are equally slaves of the party, with an illusion of supposed independence.

A candidate could always run as an independent under open party list, and kicking out a popular candidate would cost them popularity, just like under our current system. Under STV, parties could kick candidates out just as easily, and they could run as independents just as easily.

I'll admit that the only real reason to favor open party list over STV is simplicity. STV is essentially two methods in one (IRV plus the transfer of surplus votes), and people get confused enough just hearing about IRV.
 
You know shit about history, otherwise you would agree with me, all you know is something you read off of some random right wing blog that you thought sounded nice.

You whiny, fucking, little, child.
Rigggghht.

Should have known to try honest debate with a mindless twit. Try again when you grow up. (which I doubt will ever happen.)
 
Well if we're going to have to cap it in the future anyway why even start?

Because the higher the number, the better the Representation.

Currently, each member represents an average of 690,000 people. By increasing the House membership to 548, we'll cut that number down to 547,000 people. This will make it less costly to run a campaign, increasing the chance of "average Joes" being elected to Congress. Also, concentrating representation brings government closer to the people. Are you opposed to that, Watermark?

It is true that a practical limit will be reached, unless extensive renovations are made to the House chamber. But in the meantime, why not increase it?

Watermark, your claim that the electoral college is "idiotic" reveals your level of smugness and ignorance. The electoral college made perfect sense in its day, and does continue to serve its purpose. I don't think our founders were idiots for putting that system into place; I simply believe IRV would better serve in the interests of the people.

Another reform (without eliminating the college) would be to enact IRV at the State level, with the majority winner in a State receiving the electoral votes from that respective State.
 
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A candidate could always run as an independent under open party list, and kicking out a popular candidate would cost them popularity, just like under our current system. Under STV, parties could kick candidates out just as easily, and they could run as independents just as easily.

I'll admit that the only real reason to favor open party list over STV is simplicity. STV is essentially two methods in one (IRV plus the transfer of surplus votes), and people get confused enough just hearing about IRV.
Not often enough to make a difference for the party control. If a person is elected as part of the party, they will not be reselected to be run as a party candidate the next time if they do not follow the party line. They may run as an independent, but they don't win often enough to punish the party.

I prefer proportional to "open party" lists.
 
(was the last resume YOU used 100% accurate?)

Yep all of em have been.

one thing to keep in mind, political advertisements are specifically exempt from the truth in advertising laws.
 
No job requires a resume. Resumes are used by employers to quickly weed out the unqualfied. They are, however, under no requirement to. They could hire someone to be head manager with only a GED if the wanted to.

Yep we did for president twice....
 
You saying Harvard doesn't educate? Sorry Barack, find another school pal.

Depends on how much education you go after. You can come out well educated or just somewhat educated, with a degree in both cases.
Esp if you are in a Frat and rich scion.
 
Not often enough to make a difference for the party control. If a person is elected as part of the party, they will not be reselected to be run as a party candidate the next time if they do not follow the party line. They may run as an independent, but they don't win often enough to punish the party.

I prefer proportional to "open party" lists.

Well it was just a random thing in a list of proposals, Damo. You don't like it and thats clear and I doubt pages of arguing is going to choose either of our mind. ;)

You prefer proportional? What kind of proportinal, LOL.
 
Because the higher the number, the better the Representation.

Well I don't really agree with that logic. Minorities still aren't ever going to win and the house can't be reasonably expected to be increased to a size where you can just walk over to your reps house and have a nice chat with them. ;)

Currently, each member represents an average of 690,000 people. By increasing the House membership to 548, we'll cut that number down to 547,000 people. This will make it less costly to run a campaign, increasing the chance of "average Joes" being elected to Congress. Also, concentrating representation brings government closer to the people. Are you opposed to that, Watermark?

Having to campaign to 547,000 people instead is still going to make it impossible for an average joe without huge party support, and it would meet or surpass the current level within like a decade or so.

It is true that a practical limit will be reached, unless extensive renovations are made to the House chamber. But in the meantime, why not increase it?

The house could be set to population if it were a non-deliberative house. Which would also have other advantages (non-deliberative houses won't as often fall into a hive-mind state that we so often see in modern legislatures, where outrageous proposals are pass nearly unanimously). But that would be a big reform.

Watermark, your claim that the electoral college is "idiotic" reveals your level of smugness and ignorance. The electoral college made perfect sense in its day, and does continue to serve its purpose. I don't think our founders were idiots for putting that system into place; I simply believe IRV would better serve in the interests of the people.

The electoral college was put into place because of fears that later proved to be unfounded. I believe if the founders had the benefit of forsight they would not have put the system in place. They probably would've either chosen election by congress or direct election. And since direct election is the only proposal that would be reasonably accepted today, I go with that one.

Another reform (without eliminating the college) would be to enact IRV at the State level, with the majority winner in a State receiving the electoral votes from that respective State.

That would have the same winner-take-all problemsand distortions that the current system has. The winner-take-all effect probably has a greater effect on the votes than the fact that the vote is slightly weighted towards smaller states.
 
I think we should vote for VP and pres seperately. Of the persidential candidate with the most votes is pres and the second highest is VP. We could have some true bipartisanship then.
 
I think we should vote for VP and pres seperately. Of the persidential candidate with the most votes is pres and the second highest is VP. We could have some true bipartisanship then.

I think we should just abolish the position of VP, personally. Its pretty pointless. The pres should appoint a direct sucessor who could be in his cabinet and he should make this known before election. But it shouldn't be an official, salary drawing position.

Appoint the opposition VP just wouldn't make much sense - if the president died 30 days after a landslide election, the person who America didn't vote fore would suddenly become pres. If the VP were given some other roles that balanced out the executive and if he wasn't directly in the line of succession, it would make slightly more sense.

Then again, he'd probably use his role just to obstruct governance.
 
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